New Mitsubishi Montero Sport [ARCHIVED]

[JB20689]

Mga sir,

Tanong ko lang kung gaano katagal ang waiting time nyo sa Montero sport nyo? Bibili na sana dad ko kaso wala naman stock.

Took me three full months (i paid in cash). I made 5k depo to Union Otis, Diamond GH, Citimotors LasPinas, and Carworld Pampanga. The first to release my unit was Diamond Motors and they also gave me an additional discount of 10k on top of the 60k cash discount MMPH offered to MS SEs. So I got na lng my SE at 1.610M. Diamond is also the only dealer who allowed me to get my insurance outside their firm.

Yun lng I had to wait quite a while to get things in order. Hehehe

[benchph1]

My apologies sir, but the 4D56HP generates 400 newton meters of torque * 2000rpm, thats 57nm more than my 4m41 and 20nm more than the Ranger's 3.0L Duratorq at the same rpm range. Just imagine the difference in pull. Pulling a 2105kg Montero SE with 400nm is a lot better than 4m41's 343nm both have a peak torque at 2000rpm =)

The saying "there is no replacement for displacement" is generally true especially decades ago when the big block V8s of AM muscle cars ruled the streets. But technology has gotten more advance these days that many manufacturers are able to design and come up with engines that extract more power and torque even even without the additional CCs. Think of Kia's R-Diesel that boasts 200hp and 400++ nm *2000rpm from a 2.2L engine

My father's 4x4 automatic Navara certainly pulls harder than stick driven 2009 Strada GLS Sport. Especially when you hit 2000 rpm. Suddenly my 4m41 feels anemic.

I actually bought my MS SE not because for its engine but for its stance, on road comfort and features. If I wanted a midsize SUV that pulls like a 4.6L Expedition V8 then the Everest 4x4 would be on top of my list which happens to be 200cc smaller than the MS SE.

I think one of our members here has a 4x4 Navara and an SE. Correct me if im wrong, but I believe he picked the smaller displacement Navara over other bigger engine pick ups in the market coz of its sheer pulling power and higher hp output.

In summary, when it comes to crdi engines especially when VGTs are in play, displacement isnt everything.

Forgive me also, but i think you did not get my point. Yeah, the 4d56hp and KiaR engines both with VGT may have 400nm of torque but on what rpm do you get them? 2000 rpm right?

so i ask you what do you get in between, from 1000 rpm to 2000 rpm? nothing. torque curve is absolutely flat. some may it call turbo lag. I based this from what i feel during that time i tested a 2.5 monty. not just what i can read on paper.

[benchph1]

Looks like im going to eat my words. nyahahaha!!

My dad just texted me and is considering getting the 2.5 4x2. retirement car niya kasi to, and will be cheaper to own in the long run. kaso badtrip white lang ang color na available. gusto ko sana silver uli. tsk.

[silverend]

navara 4x4 at 220kph? really? talo pa pala nito crv. my strada gls sprt m/t the most is 185kph lang, pero la pa namang navara 4x4 na naka over take so far, kundi ako nanghahabol sa mga navarra sa daan, parang takot ata mga navarra sa strada hehe

wag kayo matatakot sa 6 speed, hehe.

[JB20689]

Forgive me also, but i think you did not get my point. Yeah, the 4d56hp and KiaR engines both with VGT may have 400nm of torque but on what rpm do you get them? 2000 rpm right?

so i ask you what do you get in between, from 1000 rpm to 2000 rpm? nothing. torque curve is absolutely flat. some may it call turbo lag. I based this from what i feel during that time i tested a 2.5 monty. not just what i can read on paper.

hmmmm...

Actually sir, I based my statements on years of experience on dyno tuning =) Both inertia dynamometers and flywheel dynos

Also if I may suggest, it would also help if you get the chance to test drive both the 4x4 Navara and Strada GLS sport in order to feel the huge difference in pull from 1k-2k rpm (2.5 vs 3.2L).. Just merely the pull sir would suffice.

Lastly, I believe there is no need to post the dyno sheet of the Navara to point out that the torque curve is no way flat from idle to 2k rpm. Just imagine, how could you possibly reach 403nm *2k rpm if that 403nm isnt being spread out from idle to 2krpm? Of course, it wont just jump from 100nm to 403nm without passing 250nm, 350nm, 380nm across the said rpm range (therefore, spreading 403nm on that range would make the torque curve significantly tall up to 2k rpm). In addition to that, knowing the torque delivery of the Navara, it would be safe to assume that its engine relatively puts out 350nm (53nm short of its peak torque and 7nm more than the peak torque of 4m41) at just around 1.5-1.6k rpm. Thats 500 rpm earlier than what 4m41 can produce at its maximum and there is still 53nm more on tap all the way to 2k for the Navara..

Just to reiterate, the max torque of the 4x4 Navara and Strada 3.2L is 403nm and 343nm respectively both at 2k rpm.

As I have said earlier, the best way to compare is to drive both trucks (even if you don’t get pass 2k rpm for all gears, much more if you floor both). Pretty much sure it would definitely enlighten you sir =)

Would be pleased to lend you either my Strada or my SE for the test drive. =)

[JB20689]

navara 4x4 at 220kph? really? talo pa pala nito crv. my strada gls sprt m/t the most is 185kph lang, pero la pa namang navara 4x4 na naka over take so far, kundi ako nanghahabol sa mga navarra sa daan, parang takot ata mga navarra sa strada hehe

wag kayo matatakot sa 6 speed, hehe.

downward sloping sector in sctex (Subic bound) would provide an extra 20kph at the very least depending on the car you are using.

With A/C off, my matic Strada GLS Sport hit almost 210kph on that slope. My SE just above the 200kph mark (barely broken in).

The lighter, more powerful Navara would definitely pass that slope faster than my trucks.

[JPG111]

navara 4x4 at 220kph? really? talo pa pala nito crv. my strada gls sprt m/t the most is 185kph lang, pero la pa namang navara 4x4 na naka over take so far, kundi ako nanghahabol sa mga navarra sa daan, parang takot ata mga navarra sa strada hehe

wag kayo matatakot sa 6 speed, hehe.

buti wala ka pa nakasabay na 4x4 navara, you dont want the navara to say bye bye to you :bye2:

[silverend]

buti wala ka pa nakasabay na 4x4 navara, you dont want the navara to say bye bye to you :bye2:

if that happens then we would get the navarra for a 2nd truck, in fact we are choosing between the new hi lux 4x4 and the navarra 4x4, what puzzles me is may nakausap ako dalawa pick niya navarra 4x4 at tong bago strada gls sport, sabi niya mas mabilis ang strada, di daw niya gusto ang shifting ng 6 speed, well thats his opinion, mas naging mabagal daw ang arangkada, to stir him up i objected sabi ko mali ata kayo mas mabilis ang navarra kasi 6 speed , sabi pa niya..MAGHANAP KA NG NAVARRA 4X4 SUSUBUKAN NATIN DITO SA STRADA PARA MAKITA MO!hirit pa niya may navarra 4x4 nga ako ayaw mo pa maniwala? napatawa nalang ako kasi di niya alam may strada din ako. di naman cguro bias yon kasi sa kanya naman lahat ng sasakyan kinumpara niya. and this guy is only on his late 30's. Well the navarra may be faster but i dont believe it would outrun the strada gls sport that easy, or would it?

[tc327]

if that happens then we would get the navarra for a 2nd truck, in fact we are choosing between the new hi lux 4x4 and the navarra 4x4, what puzzles me is may nakausap ako dalawa pick niya navarra 4x4 at tong bago strada gls sport, sabi niya mas mabilis ang strada, di daw niya gusto ang shifting ng 6 speed, well thats his opinion, mas naging mabagal daw ang arangkada, to stir him up i objected sabi ko mali ata kayo mas mabilis ang navarra kasi 6 speed , sabi pa niya..MAGHANAP KA NG NAVARRA 4X4 SUSUBUKAN NATIN DITO SA STRADA PARA MAKITA MO!hirit pa niya may navarra 4x4 nga ako ayaw mo pa maniwala? napatawa nalang ako kasi di niya alam may strada din ako. di naman cguro bias yon kasi sa kanya naman lahat ng sasakyan kinumpara niya. and this guy is only on his late 30's. Well the navarra may be faster but i dont believe it would outrun the strada gls sport that easy, or would it?

it looks like this thread becomes a battle of Strada and Navara na hehehehpeace

[JPG111]

if that happens then we would get the navarra for a 2nd truck, in fact we are choosing between the new hi lux 4x4 and the navarra 4x4, what puzzles me is may nakausap ako dalawa pick niya navarra 4x4 at tong bago strada gls sport, sabi niya mas mabilis ang strada, di daw niya gusto ang shifting ng 6 speed, well thats his opinion, mas naging mabagal daw ang arangkada, to stir him up i objected sabi ko mali ata kayo mas mabilis ang navarra kasi 6 speed , sabi pa niya..MAGHANAP KA NG NAVARRA 4X4 SUSUBUKAN NATIN DITO SA STRADA PARA MAKITA MO!hirit pa niya may navarra 4x4 nga ako ayaw mo pa maniwala? napatawa nalang ako kasi di niya alam may strada din ako. di naman cguro bias yon kasi sa kanya naman lahat ng sasakyan kinumpara niya. and this guy is only on his late 30's. Well the navarra may be faster but i dont believe it would outrun the strada gls sport that easy, or would it?

^^ OT na.. you can check this thread battle of the pick ups

[av8or5]

downward sloping sector in sctex (Subic bound) would provide an extra 20kph at the very least depending on the car you are using.

With A/C off, my matic Strada GLS Sport hit almost 210kph on that slope. My SE just above the 200kph mark (barely broken in).

The lighter, more powerful Navara would definitely pass that slope faster than my trucks.

buti wala ka pa nakasabay na 4x4 navara, you dont want the navara to say bye bye to you :bye2:

it looks like this thread becomes a battle of Strada and Navara na hehehehpeace

^^ OT na.. you can check this thread battle of the pick ups

finally....meron na nagsabi OT na kayo dito.. Montero thread po eto..hindi po Strada or Navara comparison. magagalit si pres Mic ninyan. hehehhe peace sir mic.

[mic_21_ph]

Welcome to the Strada vs Navara Thread

Unfortunately we cannot post this topic in our website http://monterosportclubphil.proboards.com but the informations mentioned prior to this post are noteworthy

i wonder how can we tweak the 4m41 to match the others? Paging sir _ _ _ _ _, maybe you can share your experience withour 4m41 and have sirJB20689 test it

[Memphis Raines]

Let us not add fuel to the fire.

Fellow mods Doc Ooba and The Patriach, can we request you to kindly soft delete the off-topic posts.

Salamat po.

[jozef_10]

the exchange was interesting and informative. it would be a waste to just delete it imho

[JB20689]

the exchange was interesting and informative. it would be a waste to just delete it imho

+1 =)

The discussion was actually not definitive to Navara vs Strada. It was more of an actual analysis of the difference between a big displacement 2nd generation Crdi like the 4m41 and a smaller but VGT boosted Navara.

I wanted to make my Monty SE my medium for my explanations but I thought it would be more accurate if I use the Strada instead due to weight differences between the Monty and the Navara. I needed to use the Strada to bring out more concrete facts and to set out more appropriate example against the Navara. By class and category alone, it would be off to compare the MS with the Navara.

Mga boss, dont get us wrong. The discussion was mainly about the advantages of having a smaller, but more advanced CRDi powerplant over the 4m41. It is imperative to let our fellow members know that if ever MMPH decided to bolt 4d56HPs on our Stradas and Montys then it would be to our favor. - Remember the first statement raised about this was "I dont think MMPH would DOWNGRADE the engines on the SEs. Thats why they are called special edition"? Or something like that. hehehe

If that happens (dropping the thirsty, noisy 4m41 in way of 4d56hp), our MS would definitely be the best midsize SUV (non premium) in the market hands down!! It would be elegance, beauty, and brawn without guilt.

[JB20689]

Welcome to the Strada vs Navara Thread

Unfortunately we cannot post this topic in our website http://monterosportclubphil.proboards.com but the informations mentioned prior to this post are noteworthy

i wonder how can we tweak the 4m41 to match the others? Paging sir _ _ _ _ _, maybe you can share your experience withour 4m41 and have sirJB20689 test it

Hi sir mic!

The below suggestions are the best way to safely improve the power and torque output of our Montys regardless of model (2.5 or 3.2)

1. Install a piggyback computer to change the fuel mapping, ignition timing, and boost flow of the ECU (Emanage, Haltech, or Unichip)

2. Snap on a bigger front mounted air to air intercooler (bar and fin design if possible). Dont install too big intercoolers!! They may look angas and cool but surely inappropriate for our application. Pressure drop is one thing we want to prevent in upgrading our intercoolers. No need to change the original pipings. Just make sure the inlet and outlet of the intercooler will meet the original location of the pipings. You can save roughly 12k if we dont have the pipings fabricated (mandrel bent)

3. Freer flowing panel air filter. I strongly suggest not to install cone type aftermarket filters since it would suck hot air off the engine bay.

4. Get an alcohol injection kit. (Devil's own, Aem etc).. With this one we can safely raise the boost level of the turbo not to mention clean up the combustion internals. Mother nature friendly =)

5. No need to change the pipings of our exhaust system just the muffler. I think the OEM diameter of our exhaust system is 2.5 inches. Good enough since CRDI engines by nature isnt rev happy. They all cooked up at roughly around 4.5k rpm. At that range, we arent really making a lot of smoke so no need to increase the diameter. Howver, if we cant help ourselves the biggest we could install and not lose a lot of torque production at low rpms is 2.75 inches

6. Good fully syn oil like Royal Purple, Motul excess, Castrol Edge among others. Motul's 300v is too expensive for a lazy revving diesel engine.

7. 1 bottle of Bioactive per 50 liters of diesel. Take my word on this one... =)

8. Lastly but the most important of all, an accurate dynamometer like the one Carlos Gono has in Autoplus and Tommy Teng's flywheel units in Autoteknika. Autoplus would have much lower read out since it measures the power through the wheels which is more accurate as weight and inertia are being factored in the testing.

hmmmm.. ano pa ba?

A good tuner of course. Pacho and Tommy are two of the most famous and arguably the best tuners in the metro. Is Ferman doing the dyno tuning at Speedlab?

With these modifications at hand, Im confident I would be able to tune the 4m41 up to 200++ hp and approximately 450nm at the crank. Not to mention better FC and cleaner emissions

[drivensteven]

^^^ wow! Well-said, Sir JB20689!

Now I wonder how much will it cost for everything? Any ballpark figure(/s), sir? TIA

[dadz]

Hi sir mic!

The below suggestions are the best way to safely improve the power and torque output of our Montys regardless of model (2.5 or 3.2)

1. Install a piggyback computer to change the fuel mapping, ignition timing, and boost flow of the ECU (Emanage, Haltech, or Unichip) what kind of piggy back our rigs have 3 diffrent types of piggy back system (commonrail, injectors and ecu)?

2. Snap on a bigger front mounted air to air intercooler (bar and fin design if possible). Dont install too big intercoolers!! They may look angas and cool but surely inappropriate for our application. Pressure drop is one thing we want to prevent in upgrading our intercoolers. No need to change the original pipings. Just make sure the inlet and outlet of the intercooler will meet the original location of the pipings. You can save roughly 12k if we dont have the pipings fabricated (mandrel bent) Intercooler and not a turbo kit, but still kung hindi tugma problema pa din? Doind this with out the proper setting in you electonic system is still a problem.

3. Freer flowing panel air filter. I strongly suggest not to install cone type aftermarket filters since it would suck hot air off the engine bay.Ito malamang sencor problem and kasunod.

4. Get an alcohol injection kit. (Devil's own, Aem etc).. With this one we can safely raise the boost level of the turbo not to mention clean up the combustion internals. Mother nature friendly =)

5. No need to change the pipings of our exhaust system just the muffler. I think the OEM diameter of our exhaust system is 2.5 inches. Good enough since CRDI engines by nature isnt rev happy. They all cooked up at roughly around 4.5k rpm. At that range, we arent really making a lot of smoke so no need to increase the diameter. Howver, if we cant help ourselves the biggest we could install and not lose a lot of torque production at low rpms is 2.75 inches what types of metal to be use?

6. Good fully syn oil like Royal Purple, Motul excess, Castrol Edge among others. Motul's 300v is too expensive for a lazy revving diesel engine.

7. 1 bottle of Bioactive per 50 liters of diesel. Take my word on this one... =)

8. Lastly but the most important of all, an accurate dynamometer like the one Carlos Gono has in Autoplus and Tommy Teng's flywheel units in Autoteknika. Autoplus would have much lower read out since it measures the power through the wheels which is more accurate as weight and inertia are being factored in the testing.

hmmmm.. ano pa ba?

A good tuner of course. Pacho and Tommy are two of the most famous and arguably the best tuners in the metro. Is Ferman doing the dyno tuning at Speedlab?

With these modifications at hand, Im confident I would be able to tune the 4m41 up to 200++ hp and approximately 450nm at the crank. Not to mention better FC and cleaner emissions

sir only my question, my engine is use to be fully mod but mid this year binalik ko sa stock and i only keep my piggy back sa injectors and commonrail. A stock is much better hindi naman tayo kakarera hehehehhehehe peace to all.

[sergi]

yeah. it seems to me that some of our brothers here are so speed enamored as if they want to convert their SUV's into a sports car or coupe. In the first place if you were really into speed, you should have bought a sports car in the first place and not a people/family/cargo hauler. It's as if you bought a rottweiler and you want it to run like a greyhound. Then why not buy a greyhound if that was the case.

Just my 2 cents worth. Peace mga bros.

[JB20689]

yeah. it seems to me that some of our brothers here are so speed enamored as if they want to convert their SUV's into a sports car or coupe. In the first place if you were really into speed, you should have bought a sports car in the first place and not a people/family/cargo hauler. It's as if you bought a rottweiler and you want it to run like a greyhound. Then why not buy a greyhound if that was the case.

Just my 2 cents worth. Peace mga bros.

not necessarily true sir.. I just answered sir Migs question on how to tweak the 4m41 to match the others.. Just laying out the possible options for our members who might consider upgrading their engines in the future. Atleast they have an idea na =)

Honestly, with all the mods I have mentioned, our MS is still incapable of being converted into a sports car so I wont even dare to try it myself. The estimated more or less 200++ hp carrying a 2105 kg car would be lucky to hit 0-100kph as fast as a stock 2.0L diesel sedan with powershift double clutch tranny. It means it still wont be sports car fast.

As for my experience, it doesnt matter how much mods you put in to your automobile or how fast your car has become for that matter. What matter is how we drive our cars. Its all about discipline and proper ethics on the road.

Modding an suv or a pick up truck doesnt automatically mean a person is a speedfreak. There is also a possibility that they need the extra power when going off road while carrying a full load. Or more pulling prowess when taking steep mountain hills like Baguio in full load. It would be so much better if we know our engines do possess more power and torque on tap even if you dont need to use it often because when the need arises the extra ponys are there to back us up. =)

We just need to be responsible enough to know when really is the right time to use the extra power. Because if we use it rightfully, I firmly believe it would aid more to our safety and convinience rather than to a potential accident.