2011 Mitsubishi Montero Sport [ARCHIVED]

[jaguarchua]

Yep. Actually it's just VGT for the Monty. Mechanically controlled by solenoid. While the eVGT is electronically controlled via ECU.

Maybe wala pang masyadong alam yung agent mo brother.

Kung ako ang tatanungin, go for it. I-trade mo na yung 2010 GLS mo sa 2011 GT-V for a great upgrade, kasi yung GLS lang ulit, parang wala nagbago sa exterior

Pampalakas loob sakin ito, I'll now discuss with the manager and check if their opinions as well because they might sing the same tune. Turns out directive pala nung manager na sabihin sa client yun. hahaha. Thanks

[Ry_Tower]

Minsan 2500RPM bago bumukas ang turbo, ganun sa Trooper.

Alam ko naman principle ng VGT, ilan ang kotse namin na may VGT

What I mean lang is yung sa dating turbo ng MS (and most mitsu turbo disel ata na hindi vgt) alam ko 2K rpm bago gagana vs sa new na mababa na. hehehe.

Natuwa lang boss sa post mo na nose bleed.hehe, yes I believe you know vgt naman and a lot more about cars. Pardon me na lang if I sound like teaching you guys. Ako nga itong maraming natutunan pa rito sa Tsikot esp from the experts.

[jaguarchua]

not exactly true SG
The vgt actuator is not mechanically controlled by solenoid.

Mitsubishi vgt is controlled by ecu. The ecu controls the solenoid which controls vacuum pressure that controls a vacuum (mechanical) actuator opening and closing of vanes.

eVGT is just a simpler and cheaper system where the ecu controls an electro motor actuator directly to open and close the vanes.
Jeep among have been using eVGT engines made/designed by VM Motori long before the Koreans. Actually Italian company VM Motori have made engines for lots of car makers including Toyota and ford. Even Hyundai used to make engines under license from them?

So, is it safe to say that VGT are far better than evgt? Which is superior in terms of engine performance and cost efficiency in maintenance?

[jaguarchua]

What I mean lang is yung sa dating turbo ng MS (and most mitsu turbo disel ata na hindi vgt) alam ko 2K rpm bago gagana vs sa new na mababa na. hehehe.

Natuwa lang boss sa post mo na nose bleed.hehe, yes I believe you know vgt naman and a lot more about cars. Pardon me na lang if I sound like teaching you guys. Ako nga itong maraming natutunan pa rito sa Tsikot esp from the experts.

We are the same Sir Ry_Tower when it comes to learning about these technical stuff. Somehow it hits me just now, that VGT or evgt will be somewhat useless in Urban driving. kung araw-araw traffic ang driving mo not unless youre driving for out of town trips, i.e. daan ka sa SCTEX. We can only maximize the turbos power once in high revs lang...... Am I correct?

[Expatio]

So, is it safe to say that VGT are far better than evgt? Which is superior in terms of engine performance and cost efficiency in maintenance?

Should be little or no difference. It is possible that the electronic actuators could have a faster response time; but I have seen no evidence of this. There is no doubt that eVGT is cheaper and most manufacturers use it. It may also be more reliable. Having said that; a failed solenoid on a non eVGT can easily be replaced by non technical person.

Some of you guys have got to realize that car manufacturers never bring engines up to anywhere near their maximum PS. There are several reasons for this, one being reliability decreases as more stresses are put on the engine itself and transmission by extreme driving. Also the faster the car the better stopping power required, better dynamics etc.

The MS VGT engine could in fact easily produce 220PS if Mitsubishi wanted it to by simply reprogramming the ECU, and still stay well within it's actual limitations.

Here is a pic of Mitsu VGT:

[Starex_Gold]

So, is it safe to say that VGT are far better than evgt? Which is superior in terms of engine performance and cost efficiency in maintenance?

Halos pareho lang sila

[Ry_Tower]

We are the same Sir Ry_Tower when it comes to learning about these technical stuff. Somehow it hits me just now, that VGT or evgt will be somewhat useless in Urban driving. kung araw-araw traffic ang driving mo not unless youre driving for out of town trips, i.e. daan ka sa SCTEX. We can only maximize the turbos power once in high revs lang...... Am I correct?

Yung old turbo design you're right na sa hway speed or in overtaking lang napapakinabangan most of the time. But with the vgt technology kasi, even as low as 1,400 rpm you can feel the turbo, albeit in a lower boost, (but at least meron na agad di ba) is working already so I'm sure mas nagagamit ngayon yung benefit ng turbo compared sa previous models.

Kaya nga mas efficient/effective yung vgt turbo. Sa bumper to bumper traffic, la talaga mapapakinabangan dyan. Yung nice sounds/music na lang natin... jejejeje (hope ok lang itong jejemon ko mga moderators) PEACE!

[Ry_Tower]

Tingin ko sir pare-parehong from the flywheel ang mga figures na yan. Standard practice na kasi ng mga car companies na yun ang ilagay para mas mataas at mas impressive tingnan.

If you really want the real measure of the power you get to the ground you need to get it on a dyno. Pero mas mababa talaga natitirang power ng A/T compared to M/T. Mas malaki ang power loss sa drivetrain.

Not always na M/T has higher Nm than A/T because I think sa ibang countries mas mataas rating nung A/T to compensate for the heavier tranny.

Another example of tranny affecting Nm figures is Toyota's 1KD-FTV 3.0 D4D in the Fort is lower both in hp and torque versus the one in the Prado. Aside from obvious engine ECU mapping differentiation, most probably sa transmission nga. Afterall, 6M/T at 5A/T ata yung prado vs the Forts 4A/T. If ever nga, dyno would tell the real figures but I doubt na magiging mas mataas pa rin A/T ng fort sa A/T ng prado. How they do it, I haven't researched. La pa time he, hehehe.

Anyway thanks sa info sir.

[QUARTZBRO]

Thanks Sir Quartzbro, now youve given me a good idea, time to get even with this agent as ako yung nagmumukhang tanga sa thread na ito. maybe the manager oughta know.

[SIZE=3]Dahil siguro wala pa syang previous experience to sell cars similar to this latest variant, naging pessimist si sales agent. Ipalagay nalang natin ang opinion nya ay out of record at nabitawan nya mga salitang iyon doon sa back stage, still, he must take all precautions to maintain the sweetest taste of his “sales talk”.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=3]The goodness and the rip off of his opinion, influence the reputation of the product kasi siya ang credible person representing the product. [/SIZE]

[SIZE=3]Paano siya kikita at paano nya ma-meet ang weekly, monthly sales quota nya, at paano siya magiging sales agent of the year if he tends to piss off his client? (Sa bagay hindi ko na problema at wala na ako doon kong paano sya kumita)[/SIZE]

[SIZE=3]Kong ako din ang nasa situation ng client, talaga, hindi ko na sabayan ang excitement ko na bumili pa sa bagong product nya, hindi na ako magdalawang isip, aalis nalang ako sa car dealer na yan. Kong magkataon,ganyan rin lang ang explaination nya sa akin, hindi ko na i-gumble ang pera ko dahil it’s worth 1.6 Million ±. No return, no exchange pa naman pag-makuha mo na unit.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]*****We have to protect our money from wrong expenditure********[/SIZE]

[Expatio]

Mindf*cked.
Paki-tagalog naman oh ...

Not a chance mate for various/obvious (to some) reasons.

[Wh1stl3r]

*Ry_Tower
Yessir, isa pang example from the seat of my pants the A/T Innova feels like it has more pull than the M/T. Pero I still think that with everything else constant mas mechanically efficient pa rin ang M/T. Sabi rin ng friend kong nasa GM the more transmission fluid your transmission needs is an indication of how efficient it will be. The best manuals are around 90-95% and the best automatics at around 80-85% daw.

*jaguarchua
Di naman sir, you can appreciate VGT din in traffic lalo na sa acceleration. I think mas ramdam on smaller displacement engines yung turbo lag ng non VGT, di kasi kaya ng engine patakbuhin ng mabilis yung load kapag wala pang boost.

[wei]

IMO it has someting to do with the transmission as well. For example, Ford's 3.0 CRDi has 156hp but has 380 Nm of torque. Mitsu's own 3.2 DiD in MS is 161 hp and 343Nm while the same engine in the Pajero 162hp (+1) but 374Nm.

Sir, I've been wondering why the Montero sport's 3.2 engine is less powerful than the Pajero's. According to Wikipedia, the 4m41 engine of the Pajero uses VGT. Would you know if this is true? because I've never seen any articles from newspaper or Top Gear Phil mentioning this.

[jaguarchua]

Should be little or no difference. It is possible that the electronic actuators could have a faster response time; but I have seen no evidence of this. There is no doubt that eVGT is cheaper and most manufacturers use it. It may also be more reliable. Having said that; a failed solenoid on a non eVGT can easily be replaced by non technical person.

Some of you guys have got to realize that car manufacturers never bring engines up to anywhere near their maximum PS. There are several reasons for this, one being reliability decreases as more stresses are put on the engine itself and transmission by extreme driving. Also the faster the car the better stopping power required, better dynamics etc.

The MS VGT engine could in fact easily produce 220PS if Mitsubishi wanted it to by simply reprogramming the ECU, and still stay well within it's actual limitations.

Here is a pic of Mitsu VGT:

Thanks Sir Expatio, I have now a better understanding between the two.

Halos pareho lang sila

Yung old turbo design you're right na sa hway speed or in overtaking lang napapakinabangan most of the time. But with the vgt technology kasi, even as low as 1,400 rpm you can feel the turbo, albeit in a lower boost, (but at least meron na agad di ba) is working already so I'm sure mas nagagamit ngayon yung benefit ng turbo compared sa previous models.

Kaya nga mas efficient/effective yung vgt turbo. Sa bumper to bumper traffic, la talaga mapapakinabangan dyan. Yung nice sounds/music na lang natin... jejejeje (hope ok lang itong jejemon ko mga moderators) PEACE!

Salamat, malaking bagay din yung improved fuel efficiency generated by the new VGT of Monty. Actually, I have acquired a sentimental value for my 4 months old MS so it's not that easy to have him traded in. I really wish that it s possible to convert it to the new VGT upgrades but I don't think its really possible as I have read from our colleagues in this forum and in our MSCP forum that the engine needs to be heavily modified to accommodate this particular upgrade per se. Deep Sigh..... hehehe

[SIZE=3]Dahil siguro wala pa syang previous experience to sell cars similar to this latest variant, naging pessimist si sales agent. Ipalagay nalang natin ang opinion nya ay out of record at nabitawan nya mga salitang iyon doon sa back stage, still, he must take all precautions to maintain the sweetest taste of his “sales talk”.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=3]The goodness and the rip off of his opinion, influence the reputation of the product kasi siya ang credible person representing the product. [/SIZE]

[SIZE=3]Paano siya kikita at paano nya ma-meet ang weekly, monthly sales quota nya, at paano siya magiging sales agent of the year if he tends to piss off his client? (Sa bagay hindi ko na problema at wala na ako doon kong paano sya kumita)[/SIZE]

[SIZE=3]Kong ako din ang nasa situation ng client, talaga, hindi ko na sabayan ang excitement ko na bumili pa sa bagong product nya, hindi na ako magdalawang isip, aalis nalang ako sa car dealer na yan. Kong magkataon,ganyan rin lang ang explaination nya sa akin, hindi ko na i-gumble ang pera ko dahil it’s worth 1.6 Million ±. No return, no exchange pa naman pag-makuha mo na unit.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]*****We have to protect our money from wrong expenditure********[/SIZE]

you are right, spot on Sir.

[tucson88]

sir jaguar, wag nyo na lang i-trade yung montero nyo. you can have just have your engine chipped at lagyan din ng devil's own. magagastos nyo lang is 50k kaysa ibenta ang montero na napakalaki na ng depreciation.
just my 2 cents.
HTH

[ChoyJo]

*Tsikoters waiting for the GTV

Guys magkano na yung na-i-offer na discount at ano na mga freebies nyo?
Medyo maalat pa sa amin.. Hindi umaabot sa kagaya ng Discount at Freebies na ito:

new quote from another SA...


MS 2011 GTV 4x4

price: 1,688,000.00
discount: 45,000.00

freebies: 3 3/4 years LTO, matting, 3m tint, EWD, visor, rustproof

[arsen]

Should be little or no difference. It is possible that the electronic actuators could have a faster response time; but I have seen no evidence of this. There is no doubt that eVGT is cheaper and most manufacturers use it. It may also be more reliable. Having said that; a failed solenoid on a non eVGT can easily be replaced by non technical person.

I think diaphragm actuated VGT has faster response compared to electric actuated. The diaphragm actuator is so responsive (but most of the time unnecessary) that it moves the vanes of the VGT for every rise and fall of vacuum. This unnecessary movement creates premature wear on the pivots of the linkages and vanes. Electric actuator (servo motors) variance was later added for the main purpose of reducing the wear on the linkages.

Some says electric actuated VGT is expensive to repair because the electric actuator is not sold separately. One has to replace the entire turbo assembly.

[Expatio]

Some says electric actuated VGT is expensive to repair because the electric actuator is not sold separately. One has to replace the entire turbo assembly.

Yes. I have heard about this also.
But oftentimes the ecu will give an electric actuator error code in the eVGT system when if fact there is a carbon build up in the vanes that need freeing and actuator itself is fine. Back in UK there are companies that specialize in such repair/service of all kinds of turbos. 'Es*** Turbos' is one that comes to mind.

[Ry_Tower]

Sir, I've been wondering why the Montero sport's 3.2 engine is less powerful than the Pajero's. According to Wikipedia, the 4m41 engine of the Pajero uses VGT. Would you know if this is true? because I've never seen any articles from newspaper or Top Gear Phil mentioning this.

Yes, mas malakas nga yung 3.2 4M41 ng Paj vs MS. 220hp and 440Nm ata if i remember correctly yung sa Paj BK na bagong labas sa ibang bansa. Yung local wala pa niyan pero parating na rin siguro. Pero malabong lagyan pa ng vgt 3.2 engine mga MS ngayon, magiging mahal kasi. Baka hindi na competitive vs the other SUV.

[tribby]

Offer below is pretty good..hope everyone can share other offers that they have so far for the GTV (with contact info of the SA)..

*Tsikoters waiting for the GTV

Guys magkano na yung na-i-offer na discount at ano na mga freebies nyo?
Medyo maalat pa sa amin.. Hindi umaabot sa kagaya ng Discount at Freebies na ito:

[jaguarchua]

sir jaguar, wag nyo na lang i-trade yung montero nyo. you can have just have your engine chipped at lagyan din ng devil's own. magagastos nyo lang is 50k kaysa ibenta ang montero na napakalaki na ng depreciation.
just my 2 cents.
HTH

Thank you Sr Tucson88, will give it a thourough thought. I plan to test drive the new Monty with the VGT and a colleague's monty who upgraded with Power chip. Still, depreciaton is a big factor to consider, but I might be convinced by the joys of driving a superior engine if it is the case with the new Monty GLS-V. hmmmm