component speakers.

[jncp9886]

Usually ang amp na 4ohms output impedance kaya i-drive ang 8 ohms speakers pero don't expect full power. Umiinit ang ampli sa standing waves kung lower speaker impedance ang nilagay mo say 4ohms ampli connected to 2 ohms speakers.

If you wanna be safe since dalawa naman ang speakersi, i-parallel mo nalang to get the 4 ohms requirement ng amplifier.. OR.. use matching transformer to adjust the impedance.. Pero right now ang pinaka safe para ma-test mo ay i parallel yung speakers then connect to 1 channel out ng HU.

i try ko muna yan suggestion mo. tapos if ok ung speakers, ano pwede gawin next?

[12vdc]

i try ko muna yan suggestion mo. tapos if ok ung speakers, ano pwede gawin next?

Kunin mo yung another sets ng speaker(front) from component at ikabit mo din. Kung OK ang resulta, then i-fix mo na sa ilalim ng upuan ng rear seats or near the wheel well.. Then maybe drink some beer or sortoff celebrate while listening to your new DIY boombox..

[joemarski]

hahahaha! siguradong talsik ang tulele mo pag nilagay mo sa full volume. :thumbup:

[jodski]

good luck to you... doable naman na setup yan eh basta tama lang yung combination mo as stated ni 12vdc

huwag mo nga pala tatanggalin sa original housing ng speaker kasi mag iiba ang tunog and sayang

ang problem mo na lang talaga eh kung saan mo i pwesto yang mga speakers na yan sa loob ng sasakyan

[1D4LV]

my suggestion:

sell the component system.....
get a powered sub.....

mas madali.... mas less risky....


another suggestion:

a) install a converter sa sasakyan.
b) gamitin mo na yung buong component dun...

nanghihinayang lang ako dun sa compo and dun sa speaker.... baka masira.

[dbbanas]

Nagawa ko na din during college days.. Mas malake pa nga jan. Nag direct tap ako from rear speakers papunta sa home teatre speakers ko.. Un nga lng space consuming tlga... Kaya tinanggal ko din


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[jhnkvn]

Holy cow.. naging 3 pages yun thread. Well.. this thread is a bit unique compared to most car audio questions but it isn't the first time I've seen this.

I'll echo the same recommendation as 1D4LV: Sell the component system, buy a powered subwoofer. Since all you want is the subwoofer.

Pero pagayaw.. let's start.

Component systems aren't really complicated. They're usually just a tweeter, midrange (if it's 3-way), and a midbass enclosed in a PVC box with some having a separate subwoofer box of 8-10 inches. It's very much like your bookshelf speakers -- except it's made for mass production and designed to be affordable.

Until now, I'm not too sure if you plan on chopping the component system up (e.g. getting the speaker drivers lang) or you plan on using the entire compo system in your car. Clarify that for me ;)

If you plan to throw the entire thing in a car: how do you plan on powering it? Most component systems have a source with a built-in amplifier that drives the speakers. You then power this source by socking it in a 220V household wall socket. If this is your route, I will suggest a power inverter and though if possible try not to purchase the cheapest one you can find.

Kung balak mo lang gamitin yun subwoofer ng compo system. How does it connect to the compo system? (Aka patingin nga ng likod..) If you have no plans on chopping the sub box up, this will tell you what's inside your sub box. Sa totoo lang ito yun mahirap sa if you go for this route kasi madami tanong...

1. How is it powered? Nasa loob ba yun amplifier or nasa labas? (most subwoofers have a built-in one hence "active subwoofers" and so do most compo systems.. keyword is: most)
2. How does it receive the signals? Does it do signal filtration (crossovers) on the source itself? on the amplifier? or via a passive crossover?

Kasi ganito lang yan.. if you can't answer #1, where will the subwoofer get its power? Kung nasa loob yun amplifier, okay. Now ask yourself -- how do you power that amplifier?

If you can't answer #2, well.. this is pretty fine pero konting kawawa subwoofer mo since without filtration, it'll try to play the entire spectrum range (20hz to 20khz). Of course, it can't reach the upper frequencies since physics says it can't vibrate fast enough but it's still recommended to filter it to <150hz.

If you want to just get the subwoofer driver... Good.. easy enough. You just need to build an enclosure for it which also costs money so if you're adventurous and kuripot enough, try going for an infinite baffle (Google it) or free-air subwoofer configuration, afterwards all you need to do is attach speaker wires to it.

But wait, what about the filter? Well.. like I said with #2, okay lang naman kahit wala. Your subwoofer is just going to try to extend as high as it can naturally.

[12vdc]

From what i understand. The speaker box is passive just like any ordinary old model component. It has 3 speakers in a box so that would definitely have a crossover/ filter built-in.. TS wants to plug it but unsure if it would work without damaging the HU's amplifier, so the first thing he should do is check the specs (impedance and power), match it with the car-stero amplifier output..

In this case, car stero says 4 channel 45 watter 4 ohms
What he have on hand and planning to install is 4 speaker box with 8 ohms input impedance and 100w max output. Probably the component comes in 4+1 configuration, the +1 is the center speaker.. So if he wants to wire it in the car, he'd normally connect 2 speaker box in parallel 8 ohms + 8 ohms = 4 ohms, so out from 4 speakers, he would make 2-sets of speakers rated at 4 ohms 200 watts each.

The result... REAR LEFT channnel consisting of 2 speaker boxes and the other side REAR RIGHT channel with 2 speaker boxes.. If he's creative enough to tuck neat the speakers under the seats, i think his plan would be a success..

[monty_GTV]

a home audio component inside a car? unique nga. major consideration is how you will power it from AC to DC and the space it will consume...

[jhnkvn]

From what i understand. The speaker box is passive just like any ordinary old model component. It has 3 speakers in a box so that would definitely have a crossover/ filter built-in.. TS wants to plug it but unsure if it would work without damaging the HU's amplifier, so the first thing he should do is check the specs (impedance and power), match it with the car-stero amplifier output..

In this case, car stero says 4 channel 45 watter 4 ohms
What he have on hand and planning to install is 4 speaker box with 8 ohms input impedance and 100w max output. Probably the component comes in 4+1 configuration, the +1 is the center speaker.. So if he wants to wire it in the car, he'd normally connect 2 speaker box in parallel 8 ohms + 8 ohms = 4 ohms, so out from 4 speakers, he would make 2-sets of speakers rated at 4 ohms 200 watts each.

The result... REAR LEFT channnel consisting of 2 speaker boxes and the other side REAR RIGHT channel with 2 speaker boxes.. If he's creative enough to tuck neat the speakers under the seats, i think his plan would be a success..

Most car audio head units have a 50Wx4 MOSFET built-in amplifier. It's mostly 23W RMS * 4ohms under 1% distortion. Get anything more and your distortion plot will rise dramatically until it's around 20% at 50W. Another thing people should know is that head units are actually 8 channels that are bridged in order to get 23W on all four channels at 4 ohms. This is the reason why you can't bridge the outputs to get something like 2x50W RMS.

But that's simply a tidbit on my part totally unrelated dito haha..

Well, if it's the entire speaker box as you outlined above..

Pwede. No problems there. Parallel connection of 2 speaker compo systems on each channel.

Problem here is that speaker compo systems aren't really subwoofers. They're just tweeter + (midrange) + midbass in a plastic ported enclosure. When it comes down to it, they won't hit 30hz and that's considering a natural no-crossover slope. A single 10" subwoofer will be more efficient than all 4 6" midbass drivers in reproducing bassy sounds.

Also, I'm not too sure in wanting to have component systems under your seats. Thanks to the higher frequencies, your ears will automatically locate in your head that your music will be coming under your seat -- in other words, you'll hear music playing below your ass.

If you want the bass of the midbass drivers in DIY setup. You can always yank them out, try to get a crossover that covers dunno... 63/80hz to 300hz, fabricate a slim-type enclosure for use under your seat.. and voila.. DIY under-your-seat midwoofers. Still, for the cost.. a powered subwoofer might be a more ideal setup.

Still, kung gusto mo talaga ng bass, there's nothing more ideal than getting a 12" GT5-12 subwoofer (3,000), a ported enclosure (cost depends on installer), some wires, and wire it to an affordable V12 amplifier when you're talking about costs. You can also use 12" Targa drivers to further reduce cost if you'd like.

Since ilalagay naman niya sa likod ng Revo.. I'll probably get the entire compo set, throw it at the back, get a power inverter.. ayun na yun.. DIY loud and clear vehicle. This is probably the easiest solution if you want a compo set inside a car.

[jncp9886]

wow ang dami ng inputs nyo ah. salamat. nagawa kasi ng kaibigan ko ikabit ung dalawang speakers from a component system. ang ginawa lng nya is connect dun sa amplifier. gusto ko gawin rin yon kaso lng nagdadalawang isip ako baka kasi hindi compatible para sa sasakyan ung component speakers..

[jncp9886]

eto po yung likod ng component attaching the speakers

[jhnkvn]

wow ang dami ng inputs nyo ah. salamat. nagawa kasi ng kaibigan ko ikabit ung dalawang speakers from a component system. ang ginawa lng nya is connect dun sa amplifier. gusto ko gawin rin yon kaso lng nagdadalawang isip ako baka kasi hindi compatible para sa sasakyan ung component speakers..

Ganito kasi yan.. there's no such thing as non-compatibility in speaker amplification with regards to impedence. So wag matakot gamitin yan. All your speaker needs is power in the form of watts. The wattage it gets depends on the electrical resistance. This is what you call ohms or denoted by the symbol Ω.

So I'll give you a summary of it:
1. The higher the ohms is, the more resistance you have. The lower it is, the less resistance you have.
2. If an amplifier can handle 2Ω nominally, it will handle a load of >2Ω.

In other words, yes.. gagana yun component system mo sa kotse mo as car head units are 4-ohm stable -- for car amplifiers, it depends but it can go as low as 2 or 1 ohm.

Now, I do not know why people are afraid of it.. but there's no such thing as incompatibility in amplifier and speaker "matching" thanks to resistivity load.

So let's say you have a 4-ohm nominally stable amplifier. You have a 3-ohm nominal speaker resistance.

Will your speaker work? The answer is: Yes. Music does not have a static (not moving) resistance load. It's always moving depending on the waveform of the music such as peaks and dips. It may be 2.3 ohms at 50hz, 13 ohms at 100hz, a whopping 500 ohms at its resonant frequency, so on so forth. Nominal is simply the term manufacturers use that to denote something like the average resistance load a speaker presents to an amplifier.

So when will your speaker dip to 3 ohms usually? If you push it hard. Once you push it hard, the speaker will need more power and to get that power it'll drop its resistance (remember, less resistance.. more power). Once it starts demanding 3Ω from a 4Ω-stable amplifier, the amplifier will be unstable and will go into protection mode is because the load is too much for it to handle. So unless you're really have a crappy amplifier, all it'll do is shutdown your amplifier.

Hope that helps.

[jhnkvn]

eto po yung likod ng component attaching the speakers

Those are what you call speaker wires. Kung ganyan sila.. you're all good. It just needs power. You can tap your stock speaker wires or you can get an an amplifier and wire a speaker wire from it to your speakers.

[jncp9886]

any kind of amplifier will do ba? paano po ba DIY mg install ng amplifier?

[jhnkvn]

any kind of amplifier will do ba? paano po ba DIY mg install ng amplifier?

Uhhh... konting malabo yun "any amplifier". Since technically, yes. You can get home audio amplifiers, plug it in a power inverter, and you can run your system there. But nobody does it sa kotse hahaha..

So what you need is a car audio amplifier or an amplifier that gets its power from a 12V source.

How to install.. if you plan on DIY, best friend mo si Google. Something like Wikihow will work (How to Install Car Audio Amplifiers: 17 Steps - wikiHow). If you suck at DIY installation, best have a professional car audio installer do it. Last thing you want is cause a fire in your car thanks to wrong wiring.

[12vdc]

Ganito kasi yan.. there's no such thing as non-compatibility in speaker amplification with regards to impedence. .

Actually there is.. There's a reason why a transmitter(the amplifier) gets an output impedance to be matched to the input impedance of a sink w/c is the speakers. Same exact reason why the microwave radiation could'nt get pass thru a 2mm wire mesh and you could safely peep outside the mesh without toasting your face while the magnetron transfers its power to the food you are cooking.

You match the source and the sink to be able to transform all the power to audible wave. What happens when you put lower impedance is that the ampli heats up because of overload condition, power being absorbed and more power is demanded untill the amp gets toasted.. Modern amps have protection from overloads and mostly are thermal overload protection. On the other hand if you match a higher impedance, not all power are absorbed by your sink w/c results to lost energy in a form of standing waves.. Matching may not matter much at lower frequencies, but as you go up into the shorter wavelength from radio to audio to micro and the higher electromagnetic spectrum, even the medium of transmission like wires get its resistance in a form of skin effect.. Another reason why there are cable of different impedance, from RCA, coax, twisted pair, up to the air waves in the waveguide..

[12vdc]

any kind of amplifier will do ba? paano po ba DIY mg install ng amplifier?

Any kind of amplifier will do as long as the specs matches your speakers.. Lots of car amps around, the manual will guide you.

If ever you're planning to install an amp with power coming from inverter(because its 220VAC) i'd strongly discourage you to do. Reason, i have yet to see a perfect sinusoidal wave car inverter, all of them are either square or stepped-sinusoidal w/c are too noisey. Thats doable though with larger UPS with on-line inverter..

[jhnkvn]

True on the broad side of things. However, on the general car and home audio side of things, there's no matching on amplifier and speakers. Because more than 95% of loudspeakers will typically be in the nominal loads of 1-16Ω -- they're close enough that matching impedance shouldn't be an issue and insignificant. Head-fi has since resistance load of headphones varies wildly from 16Ω to 600Ω and you try to match them with an amplifier that would minimize its impact on the sound curve of the speaker (hence there's hi-gain and low-gain in some headphone amplifiers).

For home audio, 8Ω drivers are the most common, 6Ω can also be found and 4Ω is also rather common. For car audio, 4Ω nominal is pretty much the standard. The reason for the lower impedance is that unlike in home audio where we have 220V on tap, in a car we usually get 12-13.8V -- a lot less than what your household plug has.

As much as I do recommend you optimize your amplifier-speaker combo by trying to get the nominal ratings that best takes advantage of your amplifier. I don't think this should deter anybody from using high impedance speakers. For one, I have a 8Ω driver that's just sitting waiting to be used on my next project. Second, there are people who professionally competes with higher impedance speakers in a car and win.

I might not recommend people run a 1Ω load to a 4Ω-stable amplifier.. but can you use it and actually play it? Yes, you can. Your amplifier simply anticipates the load a speaker will give out. If the resistance is higher, it'll play. If the resistance is lower, it'll protect. Will you cause significant damage to your amplifier? Not really.. well as long as your thermal protection is working properly.

Going from 8Ω to 4Ω usually means a halving of received wattage. However, power isn't really significant in car audio. Too many people are led stray by power ratings. Is 100W twice as loud as 50W? No. It's only +3dB more. Many people think: oh, I need 100W of power to match that 100W of speaker RMS but do they when most background listening only sucks up <30W of power? Remember, given all else the same.. 23W to 100W is simply +6.4dB. Whether those additional decibels is important is up to how loudly one listens.

P.S. Speaker wire skin effect does have an effect but the question is: is it significant? In that light, I'll answer no. In fact, temperature changes would probably yield a bigger effect on our perception of sound. For wires, resistance is king for me. Inductance is too.. but that's more of a PITA as a metric to go for.

[jhnkvn]

Any kind of amplifier will do as long as the specs matches your speakers.. Lots of car amps around, the manual will guide you.

If ever you're planning to install an amp with power coming from inverter(because its 220VAC) i'd strongly discourage you to do. Reason, i have yet to see a perfect sinusoidal wave car inverter, all of them are either square or stepped-sinusoidal w/c are too noisey. Thats doable though with larger UPS with on-line inverter..

Actually, ayan din nasa isip ko eh. Modified sine waves of el-cheapo inverters are incredible in their distortion plots. That's why I recommended not to go for the cheapest one because we can generally assume it has the least filtration.

However, noisy as it is, you can still use it. Actually, I've seen a perfect sine-wave inverter.. problem is, it isn't really made for cars but rather for solar installations fitted into a car. But the TS can't go this route.. hell.. those perfect wave inverters will give him nightmares in cost alone.

In that event, let's just hope his compo system doesn't hum or anything haha.. or heat up.. hahaha.. the internet's full of two camps on this one: one is "it's completely fine" while the other one is "it's disastrous".