Toyota D4D engine woes

[patron]

"The all-new 2KD-FTV four-cylinder diesel engine delivers top class fuel efficiency with extended maintenance periods. This latest technology diesel engine from Toyota has a high-pressure common rail direct fuel injection system and is fitted with a compact, high efficiency turbo charger. A range of electronic controls, including a drive-by-wire throttle system, assist in optimising engine power output, fuel efficiency, and emissions. The advanced controls also contribute to lower combustion noise and improved torque at low engine speeds."

Excerpt from a D4D review. So, this is all crap? Is anyone aware of same problems with D4D-equipped HiLux? Do they have same problems, too?

[beebs]

larshell, number 15 ka sa mga nagreklamo sa dealer mo? medyo alarming ang bilang considering maraming dealers ang toyota. multiply 15 by the number of dealers eh hindi biro yun. hay naku. my diesel adventure has 90k kms sa odo and not once pumalya ito. i know toyota has a 100k kms/3 year warranty on their engines. i appreciate the engine warranty, ayoko lang ng abala. that's why i'm purchasing a new car dahil ayoko ng frequent maintenance.

[BlueBimmer]

i think its not the engine itself, but the fuel system

[lord]

Mga Innova peeps..
My INNOVA G Diesel Variant was brought by my brother a while ago at Marikina
Service Station. My 15k PMS was also done at the said service station. Prior
to
the 15K PMS, we already have complaints that after several full tanks of
diesel
fuel from PETRON and mixing it with ESTROL Biodiesel (5% and 1%), the engine
begins to experience the following:
1. The engine often dies after starting it. This is true during cold startup
(mornings and after several hours of being parked). This is sometimes called
by
users - pumapalya o na-chochoke. Kelanagn mo apakan yung gas pedal or rev up.
the engine.

2. Sometimes during shifting gears, especially on slow speed (2nd gear) parang
kakadyot ung makina o malulunod (has the tendency to stop) pag hindi mo agad
inapakan ung gas pedal.
3. Sometimes, I feel that the engine is loosing power. Although my top speed
is
not affected, the behavior of the engine sa arangkadahan or during normal
speed
is not the same. sometimes I do need to drive hard. But I observed that my
fuel
consumption is still the same. 9.5-10.5 KM/L pa rin. I am now using Shell
Diesel.

All of these symptoms were relayed by my brother sa toyota mechanic sa
Marikina.
Toyota diagnosed again our unit by using their laptop to get into the unit's
engine statistics. My brother also relayed the possibility of the fuel filter
being clogged and maybe it just need to be adjusted. However, toyota did not
attempt to take a look. They are satisfied with the results being shown by the
engine at their laptop. The other bad news is, they still have to report the
said event either at planta or at Cubao. They instructed my brother that they
will contact us again for the next visit. This time at cubao. I am planning to
bring my unit at P. Tamo or Makati this Saturday for a second opinion. These
stations I believe are independent and have their own pool of expert mechanics
and management that can decide immediately and do not depend on other
stations.

Since I am not the only one who have experienced such behavior, (others are
just using pure diesel without additives or biodiesel) maybe we could organize
a body or at least help each other to get the attention of Toyota. I believe
that the D4d engine is not that bad since it has been released before in other
countries. There might just be an adjustment with our engines. Lets push
Toyota
to work on this issue. Toyota must have a fixed for this issue, better yet
fixed this issue so that our engine can use and benefit from biodiesel.

[apexi_66]

Mga Innova peeps..
My INNOVA G Diesel Variant was brought by my brother a while ago at Marikina
Service Station. My 15k PMS was also done at the said service station. Prior
to
the 15K PMS, we already have complaints that after several full tanks of
diesel
fuel from PETRON and mixing it with ESTROL Biodiesel (5% and 1%), the engine
begins to experience the following:
1. The engine often dies after starting it. This is true during cold startup
(mornings and after several hours of being parked). This is sometimes called
by
users - pumapalya o na-chochoke. Kelanagn mo apakan yung gas pedal or rev up.
the engine.

2. Sometimes during shifting gears, especially on slow speed (2nd gear) parang
kakadyot ung makina o malulunod (has the tendency to stop) pag hindi mo agad
inapakan ung gas pedal.
3. Sometimes, I feel that the engine is loosing power. Although my top speed
is
not affected, the behavior of the engine sa arangkadahan or during normal
speed
is not the same. sometimes I do need to drive hard. But I observed that my
fuel
consumption is still the same. 9.5-10.5 KM/L pa rin. I am now using Shell
Diesel.

All of these symptoms were relayed by my brother sa toyota mechanic sa
Marikina.
Toyota diagnosed again our unit by using their laptop to get into the unit's
engine statistics. My brother also relayed the possibility of the fuel filter
being clogged and maybe it just need to be adjusted. However, toyota did not
attempt to take a look. They are satisfied with the results being shown by the
engine at their laptop. The other bad news is, they still have to report the
said event either at planta or at Cubao. They instructed my brother that they
will contact us again for the next visit. This time at cubao. I am planning to
bring my unit at P. Tamo or Makati this Saturday for a second opinion. These
stations I believe are independent and have their own pool of expert mechanics
and management that can decide immediately and do not depend on other
stations.

Since I am not the only one who have experienced such behavior, (others are
just using pure diesel without additives or biodiesel) maybe we could organize
a body or at least help each other to get the attention of Toyota. I believe
that the D4d engine is not that bad since it has been released before in other
countries. There might just be an adjustment with our engines. Lets push
Toyota
to work on this issue. Toyota must have a fixed for this issue, better yet
fixed this issue so that our engine can use and benefit from biodiesel.

Well that's not a good practise that pag start sa morning o pagmatagal syang naka park, kailangang rev up ang engine kaagad dahil nga sa namamatay sya. Dapat pa check mo sa Toyota thoroughly yang car mo dahil it will wear up your engine fast if you will continue doing it. Try mo kaya Seaoil " bioexceed" product nila. That's what my friend is using on his Sorento 2.5 CDRi and his ODO now is more than 9K at never pa syang nagka problem sa engine nya. He normally add 2 liters on his 80ltr tank.

[isketi]

Well that's not a good practise that pag start sa morning o pagmatagal syang naka park, kailangang rev up ang engine kaagad dahil nga sa namamatay sya. Dapat pa check mo sa Toyota thoroughly yang car mo dahil it will wear up your engine fast if you will continue doing it. Try mo kaya Seaoil " bioexceed" product nila. That's what my friend is using on his Sorento 2.5 CDRi and his ODO now is more than 9K at never pa syang nagka problem sa engine nya. He normally add 2 liters on his 80ltr tank.

Yup, I once read a motoring article that advises against revving your engine immediately after starting it coz the oil hasn't circulated yet.

[zeagle]

Try to stop using additives and see if performance will improve. Sensitive kasi sa pressure and injection pump system. Additives could have been affecting the consistency of the fuel. It can also affect the timing of the injectors causing a delay in delivery and thus loss of power.

[oldblue]

kung minsan mahirap din bumili kagad ng bagong technology, nagiging guinea pig ka pa.

[RedHorse]

yep oldblue... parang v0.r0 syndrome of most softwares

[jimaroquai]

wala bang way para ma DIY manual filtering ang diesel? Para bumili na lang kayo sa container at idaan sa inyong sariling filtering before feeding it to your rig.

[bongliza]

D4D is not a very new Engine. It's been running for a few years already for other countries. Is it possible to check the performance of the D4D engines from other coutries as well? Like Thailand and Indonesia.

[badkuk]

jimaroquai:wala bang way para ma DIY manual filtering ang diesel? Para bumili na lang kayo sa container at idaan sa inyong sariling filtering before feeding it to your rig.

hmmm...now that's an idea(for a tsikot article)...

[BlueBimmer]

wow i dont know about you but manually filtering 60+ liters of diesel does not work for me and if you use your innova often...pwede kana magtrabaho sa gas station hehe

[patron]

It looks like we're still way too far from completing the three pillars of CLEAN DIESEL technology: (1) State-of-the-art engines, (2) cleaner burning fuels, (3) effective emmissions-control system. (Parang Centrino platform..hehe). Nasa step 1 pa lang tayo, if you'd consider the D4D as state-of-the-art. Clean Air Act? How far did the government really went on this? Just a legislation? Just a thought....

[patron]

Some excerpts:

"Today's automobile diesel engine...is a high-tech juggernaut, markedly more sophisticated than the gasoline engine.''

"Recent technology has made diesel engines more environmentally sound and the barrier is a psychological one more than a rational one."

It looks like that the D4D is suffering from a case of engine technology which is not fully compatible with the diesel fuel technology available to phil. market.

[cary168]

most of the countries used euro4 compliant diesel fuel which has 50 parts per million of sulfur, while the phil used only euro 2 compliant diesel which has 250ppm sulfur that's why its dirtier and clogging or choking the fuel system. My friend at UNIOIL told me that if they sell euro 4 compliant diesel which is used at other countries the price will be more expensive than premium unleaded gasoline

[patron]

most of the countries used euro4 compliant diesel fuel which has 50 parts per million of sulfur, while the phil used only euro 2 compliant diesel which has 250ppm sulfur that's why its dirtier and clogging or choking the fuel system. My friend at UNIOIL told me that if they sell euro 4 compliant diesel which is used at other countries the price will be more expensive than premium unleaded gasoline

*cary168... thanks for the info. Clearly an ENGINE/FUEL MISMATCH. Cleaner diesels and cleaner fuels go hand-in-hand. Diesel technology is very promising, and it will be a big part of energy future. Europe is really way ahead on this...

[mazdamazda]

most of the countries used euro4 compliant diesel fuel which has 50 parts per million of sulfur, while the phil used only euro 2 compliant diesel which has 250ppm sulfur that's why its dirtier and clogging or choking the fuel system. My friend at UNIOIL told me that if they sell euro 4 compliant diesel which is used at other countries the price will be more expensive than premium unleaded gasoline

yup... that is true...

our clean air act is only up to euro 1 and 2 (at best) compliant.

this is just the same with our fellow SEA neighbors... around 500 ppm of sulfur for diesel. none of our neighbors have yet to implement a lower ppm figure (though they plan a 10ppm for 2010).

this will entail huge refinery upgrades by the way.

[larshell]

yup... that is true...

our clean air act is only up to euro 1 and 2 (at best) compliant.

this is just the same with our fellow SEA neighbors... around 500 ppm of sulfur for diesel. none of our neighbors have yet to implement a lower ppm figure (though they plan a 10ppm for 2010).

this will entail huge refinery upgrades by the way.

So ang D4d engine ba is Euro4 complaint? kapag euro4 naba ang engine wont much sa euro2 fuel?

[allenjo]

So ang D4d engine ba is Euro4 complaint? kapag euro4 naba ang engine wont much sa euro2 fuel?

Not quite sure if the D4D engine has been tested for EURO4 Compliance but for a vehicle to adhere to EURO4 Standards means that both the engine and the fuel quality must match. EURO4 measures emissions compliance(byproduct) and not hardware compliance. Some of the manufacturers advertise EURO4 compliance but if used with lower grade fuel then expect it to perform less that what is expected. Just my opinion bro