Usapang Boxing Thread

[calix0305]

Maraming nagsasabing "lucky punch" lang daw ang tumalo kay Pacman.... Sadly,- typical na Pinoy excuse ito...

Pero, has anyone really thought about training, training, and training? And, the desire and heart to win?....

Our dear Pacman should take a hard look at himself....

Iba ang labanan sa loob ng ring... The hours you've invested into your training and preparation (mind, body and heart) will give you the necessary edge against your formidable opponent...

17.6K:santa:

True! from the legend himself Ali once said, "The fight is won or lost far away from the witnesses, behind the lines, in the gym, and out there on the road; long before I dance under those lights.”

[calix0305]

Marquez did what he is known best... counter-punching. He caught Pac squarely in the jaw while coming in.

[CoDer]

My point of view.

MP is ahead in the fight after getting really serious. Gigil lang talaga at gusto na tapusin si JMM kaya naging vulnerable atake ni MP. With boold gushing from JMM's nose, the longer the fight takes, he will get more tired since his breathing is becoming a problem. Sayang, one word to describe what I feel about the fight.

I know some would say na mag-retire na siya and they are probably right, but precisely because he was winning the fight when he was KO'd kaya masakit yun esp. ka Manny. I would not be against a 5th meeting if that is the reason for MP's return, to prove to himself that he can KO JMM as well. He is a fighter before he became someone else. Hope that he will regain that form and mentality if ever there is indeed a 5th fight. I would understand him for that.

And BTW, I would not be surprised if JMM fails a more rigorous drug testing. Angel Hernandez is known around the sports world as the ultimate cheater. He is of olympic caliber. His name is of enough malice to compel the change from Heredia to Hernandez. *39 years of age, you don't have growth anymore, it's impossible to get strong without sacrificing something

Here's what Nacho said.

"I never thought that Juan could knock out Pacquiao. Juan is not a [power puncher]. He is a very precise fighter, and hits hard but not violently. He gets you with three shots in a row at the tip of the chin and he hurts you, but not like [what happened with the punch that hit Pacquiao]. What happened was a phenomenon," Nacho said.

"I'm happy because I had a desire to see Pacquiao on canvas, because the truth is we already won three times. It's like I'm dreaming right now."

Nacho should have said... What happened was Angel Heredia.

[CoDer]

Marquez did what he is known best... counter-punching. He caught Pac squarely in the jaw while coming in.

Pacman got careless and that was a perfectly timed punch. Marquez KD on Pacman at round 3 was shocking enough for me.

Fountain of youth really do exist.

[shadow]

Not dominated? Anong laban napanood mo sir?

Sa score card lang ng mga local commentators na 6 rounds nakuha ni packy...


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[CoDer]

For those who don't know who Heredia is.

Taken from An Interview with Angel Heredia - Former PED Dealer to Athletes and Olympians

With the talk of Mendes/Broz, I thought it would useful to re-post an old article from Olympische Spiele: "Wenn er behauptet, er sei clean gewesen, kann ich nur antworten: Das ist eine Lüge." - SPIEGEL ONLINE where Angel Heredia is interviewed. For those that don't know who he is, he supplied Marion Jones--among other Olympians--with PEDs.

I'm not here to persuade anybody to change their opinions here on steroid usage. But, I believe some informational and educational information would be good to put things in perspective for those that would persecute anybody who is a top-level athlete and their coach and/or coaching staff for steroid usage.

As Glenn said in the Broz thread, the US has a culture of fear-mongering. We like to pass judgment, often times without sound contextual knowledge of the issues, often to the detriment of the actual people involved. It is unfortunate that the world does not seem to be catching up with US in terms of controlling PED usage with their world-level competitive athletes. Or, is it that the US is going through a cultural dark age and sorely behind the rest of the world?

-------------------------------

Angel Heredia, once a doping dealer and now a chief witness for the U.S. Justice Department, talks about the powerlessness of the investigators, the motives of athletes who cheat and the drugs of the future.
He had been in hiding under an assumed name in a hotel in Laredo, Texas, for two years when the FBI finally caught up with him. The agents wanted to know from Angel Heredia if he knew a coach by the name of Trevor Graham, whether he carried the nickname “Memo”, and what he knew about doping. "No", "no", "nothing" – those were his replies. But then the agents laid the transcripts of 160 wiretapped telephone conversations on the table, as well as the e-mails and the bank statements. That’s when Angel "Memo" Heredia knew that he had lost. He decided to cooperate, and he also knew that he would only have a chance if he didn’t lie – not a single time. “He’s telling the truth,” the investigators say about Heredia today.
SPIEGEL: Mr. Heredia, will you watch the 100 meter final in Beijing?
Heredia: Of course. But the winner will not be clean. Not even any of the contestants will be clean.
SPIEGEL: Of eight runners ...
Heredia: ... eight will be doped.
SPIEGEL: There is no way to prove that.
Heredia: There is no doubt about it. The difference between 10.0 and 9.7 seconds is the drugs.
SPIEGEL: Can drugs make anyone into a world record holder?
Heredia: No, that is a misapprehension: “You take a couple of tablets today and tomorrow you can really fly.” In reality you have to train inconceivably hard, be very talented and have a perfect team of trainers and support staff. And then it is the best drugs that make the difference. It is all a great composition, a symphony. Everything is linked together, do you understand? And drugs have a long-term effect: they ensure that you can recover, that you avoid the catabolic phases. Volleyball on the beach might be healthy, but peak athletics is not healthy. You destroy your body. Marion Jones, for example ...
SPIEGEL: ... five-time Olympic medallist at Sydney 2000 ...
Heredia: ... trained with an unparalleled intensity. Drugs protect you from injury. And she triumphed and picked up all the medals.
SPIEGEL: Are you proud?
Heredia: Of course, I still am. It is still a tremendous achievement, and you must not believe that Marion’s rivals were poor, deceived competitors.
SPIEGEL: This isn’t just an American problem?
Heredia: Are you kidding me? No. All countries, all federations, all top athletes are affected, and among those responsible are the big shoe companies like Nike and Adidas. I know athletes who broke records; a year later they were injured and they got the call: “We’re cutting your sponsorship money by 50 percent.” What do you think such athletes then do?
SPIEGEL: Tell us what you did for your clients.
Heredia: Athletes hear rumors and they become worried. That the competition has other tricks, that they might get caught when they travel. There is no room for mistakes. One mistake can ruin a career.
SPIEGEL: So you became a therapist for the athletes in matters of drugs?
Heredia: More like a coach. Together we found out what was good for which body and what the decomposition times were. I designed schedules for cocktails and regimens that depended on the money the athletes offered me. Street drugs for little money, designer drugs for tens of thousands. Usually I sent the drugs by mail, but sometimes the athletes came to me.
SPIEGEL: With Marion Jones ...
Heredia: ... it was about the recovery phases. In 2000 she competed in one event after another, and she needed to relax. I gave her epo, growth hormone, adrenaline injections, insulin. Insulin helps after training, together with protein drinks: insulin transports protein and minerals more quickly through the cell membrane.
SPIEGEL: Jones was afraid of needles.
Heredia: Yes, that’s why C. J. Hunter, her husband at the time, and her trainer Trevor Graham mixed her three substances in one injection. I advised them against it because I thought it was risky.
SPIEGEL: What kind of relationship did you have with your athletes?
Heredia: Business ties. It was all about levels and dosing. I rarely spoke with Marion. It was done through her coaches.

[uls]

God must have been betting on Marquez

[CoDer]

God must have been betting on Marquez

Thor's daddy I suppose.

[calix0305]

Si Marquez kasi late bloomer yan sa boxing at hindi gaanong bugbog sa boxing career nya kasi counter-puching style not unlike Pac which have been into many wars at come forward style pa. IMO, those "wars" had taking a toil on him now.

But still JMM was a better fighter that night

[calix0305]

In boxing, kahit naka PED ka hindi guarantee na mananalo ka. It takes skills and techniques to do so.

In fairness to Marquez he got skills and techniques to defeat Pac and he showed us that last Sunday.

[CoDer]

Si Marquez kasi late bloomer yan sa boxing at hindi gaanong bugbog sa boxing career nya kasi counter-puching style not unlike Pac which have been into many wars at come forward style pa. IMO, those "wars" had taking a toil on him now.

But still JMM was a better fighter that night

Hindi late bloomer si Marquez, his style is designed for longevity look at Hopkins. Example ng late bloomer is Martinez.

In boxing, kahit naka PED ka hindi guarantee na mananalo ka. It takes skills and techniques to do so.

In fairness to Marquez he got skills and techniques to defeat Pac and he showed us that last Sunday.

Remember the old baseball saying "PEDs don't improve hand eye coordination" No, they just help a batter hit the ball 50 ft farther

[calix0305]

Hindi late bloomer si Marquez, his style is designed for longevity look at Hopkins. Example ng late bloomer is Martinez.

maybe but where is Marquez during the prime of Barrera at Morales.

Well, PEDed marquez or not kung hindi tatama suntok walang silbi di ba?

[shadow]

Filipino spin doctors are now trying to put question mark on the KO win of JMM. While others are downplaying it as a lucky punch...

Talo na kasi Kung talo...Dami pang dahilan packy was caught by a well timed punch, suck it up pinoys...

Meron mga articles na Bakit lumakas suntik ni JMM eh hinde niyan ma KO Si packy nun 1st 3 fights, but at the same time, pwede rin itaming Nasaan yun power ni packy hinde rin niya ma KO Si JMM in 3 fights.

it's just funny that we are now insinuating of PED used when not too long ago pinoys and team packy were up in arms when the very same allegation was thrown against them.

Sa pinoy talaga walang natatalo either nadaya or naka Tsamba Lang kalaban.

Kaya hinde umasenso eh mga athltes Masyadong bondying Dito, kahit talo panalo pa rin...talo na nga eh gusto pa palabasin na panalo.


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[calix0305]

si torrecampo at hussein naka-PED din daw LOL

[testament11]

Lousy fighter na si Pacman ngayon. Before eh excited ka sa mga laban niya dahil for sure he'll get a KO or TKO win sa kalaban niya. Pero lately, wala eh. Hindi na siya ganun. Could his new-found faith is the factor sa decline niya, possible, pero hindi siya sobrang laking factor. Could his new-found career (politics, showbiz) ang biggest factor, it is, for me.

Hindi dedicated fighter si Pacman ngayon. Inagaw na ng politics at kung ano-ano pang sideline ang oras niya sa training. Pacman should now ask himself kung saan ba talaga ang buhay niya, showbiz, politics, religion, or boxing. He should also learn to look at the people around him, especially those money sucking leeches around him. Sorry pero I had to say this against him, masyado siyang uto-uto at nagpapadala sa mga taong nasa paligid niya and those people around him are the ones who pulls him down, sama mo pa ang greed na nasa loob niya.

Agree ako sa sinabi ni Ry regarding the possibility of the 5th fight. Welcome din sa akin ang 5th fight nila, provided, na kung mangyari, will be the very last. Then he should take Bradley also para malinis din ang pagkatalo niya doon, which is also a controversial one. PBF pa rin ang dapat, for me, ang huli niyang makalaban bago siya mag-retire.

[niky]

Filipino spin doctors are now trying to put question mark on the KO win of JMM. While others are downplaying it as a lucky punch...

Talo na kasi Kung talo...Dami pang dahilan packy was caught by a well timed punch, suck it up pinoys...

Meron mga articles na Bakit lumakas suntik ni JMM eh hinde niyan ma KO Si packy nun 1st 3 fights, but at the same time, pwede rin itaming Nasaan yun power ni packy hinde rin niya ma KO Si JMM in 3 fights.

it's just funny that we are now insinuating of PED used when not too long ago pinoys and team packy were up in arms when the very same allegation was thrown against them.

Sa pinoy talaga walang natatalo either nadaya or naka Tsamba Lang kalaban.

Kaya hinde umasenso eh mga athltes Masyadong bondying Dito, kahit talo panalo pa rin...talo na nga eh gusto pa palabasin na panalo.


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I really wasn't surprised Marquez won.

Let's face it. He's the only guy who's been able to outclass Pacquiao at every match they've had. That last fight was stolen from him, big time... just like Pacquiao's loss in his previous fight... which was also a farce.

Apparently, Pacquiao still doesn't have an answer for Marquez. And karma bit him on the butt. No way to weasel out a win when you're knocked out.

Manny should either retire from boxing, or retire from all the other crap he's doing that's affecting his focus on boxing. Juggling a lot of balls is okay if you're a stage performer, but an athlete needs complete focus and discipline to win. Something I have not seen from Manny for the past several fights.

[champoy]

Kahit nung katoliko si paki talaga contra tiempo nya si marquez.

Present ba si pambansang anino kagabi? Natatawa talaga ako sa ginawa nya dati..

[oliver1013]

Masakit kasi tanggapin yung 2:59 left tapos na KO pa. Tapos factor mo pa na dati nang binibigay ni JMM yan kay pacquiao with no effect.

Tapos binarag na ni Manyy mukha ni JMM, deep inside every pinoy, come from behind fairytale KO win si Manny ang inaasahan, till the "punch" landed.

Mismo palang trainer niya hindi makapaniwala na kaya ni JMM yung ginawa niya, pwede siguro bumagsak si Manny pero tumayo uli, tapos habol nalang o kaya desisyon in favor of JMM.

Pero yung tulog si Manny like yesterday..it will be hard to swallow for pinoys na sanay for ten years na inaabangan nalang kung KO o throw in the towel ang resulta..or pinaka alat, nakaw na desisiyon in favor of his opponent.

[calix0305]

anything can happen in boxing.

si tyson nga ganun din nangyari at mas mahusay naman si halos JMM kay douglas.

There are factors not seen by fans like us that affected the outcome of the fight.

[antonath]

si torrecampo at hussein naka-PED din daw LOL

PED? parang LIMITLESS movie lang yan ahh.. haha