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  1. FrankDrebin Guest
    #101
    Turbo-prop is not old for Philippine Standard anyway. Go for it!!:D

  2. Join Date
    Mar 2005
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    8,837
    #102


    swedish stealth ship.

  3. Join Date
    Oct 2002
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    10,808
    #103
    here's another site of the super tucano showing the intruments and night vision gear for the pilot...

    http://www.aviationweek.com/shownews...e/topsto02.htm

  4. Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Posts
    1,621
    #104
    Diesel-Electric subs are only usable in shallow waters and for short operations only (great for defending ports & channels).
    Tell that to WW2 Grand-Admiral Karl Donitz, who sent U-boats into the Indian Ocean (the Monsoon Group).

    Their batteries will only last upto around 12 hours only (provided that you don't run at full speed) and afterwards they already need to use the noisy diesel engines to recharge them. In that process, they also need to snorkel for fresh air (although some newer diesel-electric subs have developed more advanced air circulation systems that will allow longer snorkel time intervals).
    Diesel-electric boats have changed a great deal since World War II. We're not talking about Type VI-C U-boats or Romeo-class boats here..

    German U-212/214 class boats with hydrogen fuel-cell Air-Independent Propulsion system:
    http://www.naval-technology.com/projects/type_212/

    Swedish Gotland-class diesel-electric boats have Stirling-cycle closed-loop air-independent propulsion and can go 3 weeks without surfacing. The US Navy rented the HMS Gotland from Sweden in 2005.
    http://www.naval-technology.com/projects/gotland/

    "In May 2005 the Gotland was leased to the U.S. Navy for one year, complete with Swedish crew. The Gotland will initially be based in San Diego, where the U.S. Navy will practice joint maneuvers with the stealthy AIP-equipped diesel submarine.[4] The vessel will later operate on the east coast of the United States. According to the Swedish newspaper Blekinge Läns Tidning, U.S. interest in the Gotland class was aroused during joint naval exercises when the U.S. Navy was unable to track the Swedish submarine.[5]"

    In this case, if a CBG suspects that a diesel-electric sub is operating in the area they can just deploy further from shore to limit the sub's effectiveness.

    The Los Angeles class of the USN is one of the best ASW (anti-submarine warfare) / CBG-escort submarines around. If that is not enough, the USN also has ASW aircrafts that can be deployed (Orion or Viking???). A new ASW aircraft is also in the works.
    the LA class is obsolescent.
    Many of the boats have already been retired and cut up. The Virginia-class SSN is the replacement.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Virginia_class_submarine

    diesel-electric boats are quieter because they don't need reactor pumps. the only nuclear sub with passive cooling is the Ohio-class SSBN.
    Last edited by orly_andico; October 4th, 2005 at 05:44 PM.

  5. FrankDrebin Guest
    #105
    I stand corrected by the Sub Guys! :D

    Anyway, I remember this old Sean Connery-Alec Baldwin movie-The Hunt for Red October, is that technology in that Russian Sub currently used nowadays?

  6. Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Posts
    1,621
    #106
    actually in the book, the "caterpillar drive" was just a ducted turbine (instead of a propeller). the current British SSN's (Trafalgar-class) use this technology (also known as "pump jet" propulsion -- same principle as a jetski).

    in the movie they changed it to an MHD (magnetohydrodynamic drive). which is currently not practical (only a few experimental Japanese boats -- as in boats, not submarines, not ships) have it. MHD has no moving parts but requires tremendous amounts of electricity. it basically moves seawater past the ship's hull using a magnetic field alone.

  7. Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Posts
    14,824
    #107
    Diesel-electric boats have changed a great deal since World War II. We're not talking about Type VI-C U-boats or Romeo-class boats here..
    The new gen diesel-electrics (with AIP) is still not yet widely used. Only the Germans & Swedish have a handful of them.

    Swedish Gotland-class diesel-electric boats have Stirling-cycle closed-loop air-independent propulsion and can go 3 weeks without surfacing. The US Navy rented the HMS Gotland from Sweden in 2005.
    3 weeks at the speed of 5 knots.

    As I've said... good for short / homefront operations only. They still need to refuel somehow after their diesel is gone.

    Plus, SSNs are more difficult to manage in shallow waters - that is why Diesel-Electrics will definitely have an advantage there (as I've said before). Plus, operating on homewaters will give them a very BIG advantage as they can blend in with local water traffic & even the environment.

    But for deep water operations - the SSNs will still lord it over them anytime.

    the LA class is obsolescent.
    Many of the boats have already been retired and cut up. The Virginia-class SSN is the replacement.
    That is still up in the air. Although some LA class have already been decommissioned but the US is still contemplating on refueling some LA class to extend their service life (as the new Virginia is a bit costly at around $2B each).

  8. FrankDrebin Guest
    #108
    Hmmm, the German diesel U-Boats of WW2 terrorized the British at the Atlantic Ocean.

  9. Join Date
    Oct 2002
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    14,824
    #109
    Quote Originally Posted by FrankDrebin
    Hmmm, the German diesel U-Boats of WW2 terrorized the British at the Atlantic Ocean.
    That just during the first few years of the war.

    Afterwards - it was a downward spiral for the U-boat.

    ===

    Watching The History Channel & Discovery is now paying off. ;)

  10. Join Date
    Dec 2003
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    11,317
    #110
    mga walking military encyclopedia ata kayo e!

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