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View Poll Results: Senate's verdict on CJ

Voters
69. You may not vote on this poll
  • Guilty!

    58 84.06%
  • Not Guilty

    9 13.04%
  • i couldn't care less

    2 2.90%
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  1. Join Date
    Nov 2010
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    736
    #2531
    Quote Originally Posted by CoDer View Post
    SALN is act of all. Next!
    yap, kasi pare-pareho lang sila na di tama ang entries ng mga SALN nila. Based on my observation and experience, most gov't. officials and employees' SALN are under declared.

  2. Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Posts
    22,710
    #2532
    Quote Originally Posted by tomboy View Post
    I love you niky and fourtheboys96
    My vote may change, depending on the developments of the case.

    Ang pagbalik ng comeback...

  3. Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Posts
    1,326
    #2533
    Quote Originally Posted by CoDer View Post
    Walang katapusang ala "collegial body kami" na palusot.
    For me, it is an argument... maaaring sabihin equivalent sa palusot.. pero yun din naman ang katotohanan...

    Would 1 vote matter? Look at the cases... ilan ba ang natalo o nanalo by a mere 1 vote? Then at that point his vote would have mattered... kapag hindi 1 vote ang difference ng winner / loser... e di dapat look at the voting patterns of the other guys.. at kung may same pattern, sama sama silang iimpeach...

    I believe that Corona is just the start... kung talagang gusto linisin ni Noy ang SC... then sige, isa isahin nya mga SC justices... how grim that propsect may be...

  4. Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Posts
    1,326
    #2534
    Quote Originally Posted by tsupermario View Post
    the impeachment trial is a political process, it is not a criminal trial.

    since it is not a criminal trial, proof beyond reasonable doubt does not apply. it is closer to an administrative case where substantial evidence is enough. still it is a political exercise.

    due process was observed, cj corona is given the opportunity to face and answer the charges.

    in administrative proceedings, technical rules of evidence and procedure are not strictly applied. the concern should be on the weight of evidence rather than its admissibility.

    in the end the question should be, is corona fit to continue being the cj of the sc?
    I agree, ultimate question is if corona fit to continue being CJ... I agree that the OUTCOME of Impeachment is political in nature and not criminal... pero yung PROCESS... I beg to disagree.. the highest standards of procedure should be done.. to ensure that due process is observed...

    Nagiging political sya, as a consequence na ang mga gumagawa ng decision (Impeach or Acquit) ay mga politiko (vs judges).

  5. Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Posts
    1,326
    #2535
    Quote Originally Posted by tsupermario View Post
    i believe i read somewhere that:

    Judges must adhere to the highest tenets of judicial conduct. They must be the embodiment of competence, integrity and independence. A judge’s conduct must be above reproach. Like Caesar’s wife, a judge must not only be pure but above suspicion. A judge’s private as well as official conduct must at all times be free from all appearances of impropriety and be beyond reproach.

    A judge should personify judicial integrity and exemplify honest public service. The personal behavior of a judge, both in the performance of official duties and in private life should be above suspicion.

    Judges should make sure that their acts are circumspect and do not arouse suspicion in the minds of the public. When they fail to do so, such acts may cast doubt upon their integrity and ultimately the judiciary in general.

    etc. etc. etc.

    unless we evaluate cj corona by a different standard since he is after all a supreme court justice, a chief justice at that and not a mere trial court judge..
    I agree in all respects.. but due process should still be accorded...

  6. Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Posts
    22,043
    #2536
    Too bad Corona can't do the same...

    BUDGET SECRETARY Florencio Abad acknowledged that he has only been listing the assessed values of his real properties in his statements of assets, liabilities, and net worth (SALN), and pledged to review his previous SALNs and include the acquisition costs of his properties “in the interest of transparency.”
    Buti pa si CJ may list ng properties sa SALN. Eh yung accuser...

    Many officials, for instance, still refuse to disclose the full details of the current/fair market and assessed values of their real properties, their exact location, and the size of their real properties. They include President Benigno Simeon C. Aquino III himself, Budget Secretary Florencio ‘Butch’ Abad, Health Secretary Enrique T. Ona, and some senators, congressmen (as of their 2009 SALN), and other Cabinet members.

    For a man who knows both his law and his money, Abad offers a puzzling SALN. He reported owning six real properties worth less than a million pesos or basement prices that could leave eBay and sulit.com bargain hunters slack-jawed in envy.

    The six properties that Abad enrolled in his December 2010 SALN include a lot and a house in Quezon City (which he said bought and built in 1983 and 1990, and with assessed values of only P203,040 and P584,550), three lots in Batanes (acquired on sale in 2001, 2004, and 2008, with assessed values of P2,250, P64,000, P33,370), and a lot in Batangas (acquired in 2008 with assessed value of P105,000).

    Altogether, Abad declared the assessed value of his six real properties to be only P993,070. He left blank the columns for data on current/fair market value and acquisition cost of his real properties.

    Meanwhile, Health Secretary Ona, who had a long lucrative private practice as a kidney doctor before his Cabinet posting, declared a net worth of P78.24 million in his December 2010 SALN. But he opted to be mum about the details of his wealth; regarding his real properties, Ona simply typed the word “various” under the columns for “kind,” “location,” and “year acquired,” and left blank those for the assessed value and fair market value of his properties.

    Ona’s net worth was shored up, however, by unspecified “stocks and investments” declared at P75.43 million, even as he reported liabilities such as “personal loans” of P5 million, a car loan from a bank of P750,000, and income tax payable of P65,059.50.

    Similarly, President Aquino himself filled out his SALNs for June 2010 and December 2010 by simply typing “various” on and on under the columns for personal and other properties, leaving out many important details like his purchase of a second-hand Porsche (that he later sold), and the firearms he owns.
    Si Nognog at Tupak.


    There is also a tendency by many officials to claim huge sums of investments, time deposits, stocks, and money market placements, but they would not disclose in which business entities, companies or establishments these are lodged.

    Examples of such filers are Vice President Jejomar Binay and Iloilo Rep. Niel Tupas, Jr., chair of the justice committee and lead prosecutor in the Corona impeachment trial.

    Binay declared a net worth of P58.09 million in his latest SALN as of December 2010 – all of it representing assets. He had zero liability.

    He declared 12 real properties (three in Makati City, three in Batangas, two in Laguna, one each in Muntinlupa, Cavite, Isabela, and Bataan). Of the 12, Binay said he purchased seven, inherited two, earned two others as legal service fees, while two remain mortgaged.

    Binay placed the acquisition cost of the 12 properties at only P16.88 million.

    He reported though a constantly growing amount of personal and other properties totaling P42.7 million, or nearly three times more than his real properties. This accounts for P17.52 million “cash on hand and in bank”, P11 million in “receivables,” P7.07 million in “furnitures, antiques, clothings, etc”, and P4.05 million in “investment in business” that Binay said was the “exclusive property of the spouse.”

    As for Tupas, his SALNs offer a curious case of constantly rising investments in “time deposits and money markets.”

    He reported a significant steady growth in his net worth, according to his disclosed SALNs for 2007, 2008, and 2009, or the years when he served in the 14th Congress.

    As of his latest available SALN – 2009 – “time deposits/money market” assets seem to be the pivot of Tupas’s wealth, even as it first appeared only in his 2008 SALN. It just kept growing, despite the fact of the global financial crisis that sent markets in Europe tumbling down in 2008 to the present.

    In July 2007, Tupas said he had P8.5 million cash in bank, but zero “investments” or “time deposits/money market” assets. In December 2007, his cash in bank stood at P11.5 million, but still he had zilch for “time deposits/money market.” By December 2008, however, his cash in bank slipped to P2 million, and a new entry, “investments,” came in, which Tupas valued at P11.7 million.

    In December 2009, the term “investments” disappeared in his SALN; in its place, Tupas reported he had “time deposits/money market” assets worth P22 million.

    The paper trail of real properties (i.e. land, houses, buildings) is fuller and stricter, thus easier to track. In contrast investment instruments could be shrouded in corporate veil, or brokered and sealed with agents, thus easier to hide.
    Last edited by Monseratto; March 18th, 2012 at 12:26 PM.

  7. Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Posts
    22,043
    #2537
    Good boy si JPE at Angara. Gusto ko makita yung SALN ni BongBong...


    Among the senator-judges, Senate President Juan Ponce Enrile and Sen. Edgardo J. Angara stand out with their fully filled-out SALNs, which show to the last detail of the registration and plate numbers of their vehicles, and dates of acquisition of how many stocks in whichever companies.

    In contrast, like President Aquino, opposition Sen. Manuel B. Villar repeatedly typed “various dates” under the column for “year of acquisition” of his real estate and other properties in his 2010 SALN.

    All that Villar revealed were “investment in shares of stocks” worth P147.8 million, and “other real and personal properties” worth P572.8 million. His net worth: P725.2 million, with zero liabilities.

    The colorful Sen. Miriam Defensor Santiago meanwhile said in her 2010 SALN that her assets include nine residential and two agricultural lots (six located in La Paz, Tarlac; two in Iloilo, and one in Lipa, Batangas) worth only P4.18 million.

    The bulk of her wealth or P100.3 million consists of personal and other properties, including P51.2 million “cash on hand/in bank” and P29.06 million in “investments” in unnamed business entities. But because she declared P60 million in “personal loans” to unnamed creditors, Santiago’s net worth slipped to only P40.3 million.

    Sen. Joker P. Arroyo filed possibly the most trite of all SALNs among his colleagues. He declared a net worth of P11.05 million in his 2010 SALN. He said he had P7.9 million in “investments” and offered no further details. He also said he owns a “residential” property in Makati City that he said was worth P3.15 million.

    Arroyo, a known resident of posh Dasmariñas Village in Makati, said he acquired it in 1968 for P450,000, but that its assessed value now is only P150,000; he constructed his house for P1.05 million, but that he had improvements made so its value should now be worth P3 million.
    SALN: Good law, bad results « Philippine Center for Investigative Journalism
    Last edited by Monseratto; March 18th, 2012 at 12:36 PM.

  8. Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Posts
    3,033
    #2538
    Quote Originally Posted by wowiesy View Post
    I agree, ultimate question is if corona fit to continue being CJ... I agree that the OUTCOME of Impeachment is political in nature and not criminal... pero yung PROCESS... I beg to disagree.. the highest standards of procedure should be done.. to ensure that due process is observed...

    Nagiging political sya, as a consequence na ang mga gumagawa ng decision (Impeach or Acquit) ay mga politiko (vs judges).
    the impeachment trial that is under way is already a testament that due process is being observed. due process is satisfied when the parties are afforded fair and reasonable opportunity to explain their side of the controversy.

  9. Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Posts
    1,326
    #2539
    Quote Originally Posted by tsupermario View Post
    the impeachment trial that is under way is already a testament that due process is being observed. due process is satisfied when the parties are afforded fair and reasonable opportunity to explain their side of the controversy.
    yes.. but the manner in which the bank accounts were divulged... the "intent" to "disregard" FCD confidentiality laws in spite of the legal prohibitions, etc... again.. di lang basta nabigyan sya ng pagkakataon na magpaliwanag (procedural due process) pati substantive due process (paano ginawa yung pagbigay sa kanya ng pagkakataon na magpaliwanag)...

  10. Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    3,828
    #2540
    Quote Originally Posted by galant E SS View Post
    yap, kasi pare-pareho lang sila na di tama ang entries ng mga SALN nila. Based on my observation and experience, most gov't. officials and employees' SALN are under declared.
    Unfortunately its Corona who's being impeached.

    Everyone here knows that politician and public employees were never truthful in their declaration. But they're not the respondent to the case, add to that public employees were actually removed from the post because of mis-declarations on their SALN.

    "Sila nga eh" excuse will not sell, and that's what the defense is precisely doing.

Impeachment against CJ Corona..