Motor Oil 101 and how the HGMO policy is not good for Theta II.

[dfopiso]

The FS HGMO of HQA is also made by Amalie oil in Florida, 5W 40 SN rated, sa diesel it passes the CF rating and ACEA B4 rating. I guess acceptable naman.

so Amalie ang HGMO supplier ng HARI

[micodee07]

The FS HGMO of HQA is also made by Amalie oil in Florida, 5W 40 SN rated, sa diesel it passes the CF rating and ACEA B4 rating. I guess acceptable naman.

I recall my SA at Hyundai E Rod saying that the FS oil was manufactured in Germany. I wonder if iba-iba ang suppliers kada casa.

In any case, I just got my oil changed sa HQA last weekend, they accepted owner provided oil so I bought Mobil 1 0W-30 Advanced Fuel Economy. So far my observations are that my cold start engine noise has gone done significantly. In fact yung valve tappeting sounds from cold start would only be audible nalang for about 20-30 seconds compared to about 3-4 mins with the HGMO. Power and response has improved noticeably.

On fuel economy, I have palang the numbers from the instrument panel - I drove my benchmark city route this morning and the reading on my dash panel was 12.9L/100km for my 15km city drive; normally my reading would be around 15.7L/100km for the same route, same traffic conditions. 6.3km/L vs 7.7km/L is about 20% improvement. This far exceeds my expectations; I was only expecting around a 5% improvement. I just got my first full-tank since the oil change this morning. I'll report back my actual fuel economy on my next re-fill.

[IMm29]

I recall my SA at Hyundai E Rod saying that the FS oil was manufactured in Germany. I wonder if iba-iba ang suppliers kada casa.

In any case, I just got my oil changed sa HQA last weekend, they accepted owner provided oil so I bought Mobil 1 0W-30 Advanced Fuel Economy. So far my observations are that my cold start engine noise has gone done significantly. In fact yung valve tappeting sounds from cold start would only be audible nalang for about 20-30 seconds compared to about 3-4 mins with the HGMO. Power and response has improved noticeably.

On fuel economy, I have palang the numbers from the instrument panel - I drove my benchmark city route this morning and the reading on my dash panel was 12.9L/100km for my 15km city drive; normally my reading would be around 15.7L/100km for the same route, same traffic conditions. 6.3km/L vs 7.7km/L is about 20% improvement. This far exceeds my expectations; I was only expecting around a 5% improvement. I just got my first full-tank since the oil change this morning. I'll report back my actual fuel economy on my next re-fill.

Hmmm i think the FC would be dependent on the oil's viscosity. 0W-30 vs 5w-40 is probably the reason for your better FC.

I think the API/ACEA rating would be more of how the oil would protect your engine, if it can handle the pressure and stress, and stand up to the wear and tear being given by the engine.

Either way, that Mobil FS should be better than the HGMO.

[micodee07]

Hmmm i think the FC would be dependent on the oil's viscosity. 0W-30 vs 5w-40 is probably the reason for your better FC.

I think the API/ACEA rating would be more of how the oil would protect your engine, if it can handle the pressure and stress, and stand up to the wear and tear being given by the engine.

Either way, that Mobil FS should be better than the HGMO.

Agree, although a 20% improvement is still outrageous going from a 40 to 30 weight oil. The Mobil 1 is rated API service SN, ACEA A1/B1 & A5/B5 by the way.

[Veilside]

I recall my SA at Hyundai E Rod saying that the FS oil was manufactured in Germany. I wonder if iba-iba ang suppliers kada casa.

In any case, I just got my oil changed sa HQA last weekend, they accepted owner provided oil so I bought Mobil 1 0W-30 Advanced Fuel Economy. So far my observations are that my cold start engine noise has gone done significantly. In fact yung valve tappeting sounds from cold start would only be audible nalang for about 20-30 seconds compared to about 3-4 mins with the HGMO. Power and response has improved noticeably.

On fuel economy, I have palang the numbers from the instrument panel - I drove my benchmark city route this morning and the reading on my dash panel was 12.9L/100km for my 15km city drive; normally my reading would be around 15.7L/100km for the same route, same traffic conditions. 6.3km/L vs 7.7km/L is about 20% improvement. This far exceeds my expectations; I was only expecting around a 5% improvement. I just got my first full-tank since the oil change this morning. I'll report back my actual fuel economy on my next re-fill.

Sir, anong sabi ng HQA, hindi ba void warranty mo nung nagdala ka ng sariling Oil? corkage fee? sino SA mo sir? thanks!
*I thought I'm the only one experiencing around 2mins of tappet noise kapag cold start..


Regarding FC, try niyo petron blaze, ewan ko lang kasi sa akin mas OK ang FC ko highway and city driving
compared sa XCS or VPower nitro+ ng shell. P2 lang naman ang difference.

[Starex_Gold]

Regarding FC, try niyo petron blaze, ewan ko lang kasi sa akin mas OK ang FC ko highway and city driving
compared sa XCS or VPower nitro+ ng shell. P2 lang naman ang difference.

Pati sa Sportage Theta, sa Blaze100 ko nakuha best FC at performance.

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Regarding FC, try niyo petron blaze, ewan ko lang kasi sa akin mas OK ang FC ko highway and city driving
compared sa XCS or VPower nitro+ ng shell. P2 lang naman ang difference.

Pati sa Sportage Theta, sa Blaze100 ko nakuha best FC at performance.

[micodee07]

Sir, anong sabi ng HQA, hindi ba void warranty mo nung nagdala ka ng sariling Oil? corkage fee? sino SA mo sir? thanks!
*I thought I'm the only one experiencing around 2mins of tappet noise kapag cold start..


Regarding FC, try niyo petron blaze, ewan ko lang kasi sa akin mas OK ang FC ko highway and city driving
compared sa XCS or VPower nitro+ ng shell. P2 lang naman ang difference.

Hindi naman daw void. in fact nung PMS ko pinalitan din yung battery, free of charge, under warranty. Si Luigi yung SA ko sa HQA.

[bjreyesmd]

Point taken, but also take note that the oil also passes the ACEA B4 standard which is the european counterpart. Im looking at the manual of my SF3, and I cant find any API requirement for the oil, except that it should be ACEA B4 rated. Maybe because yung manual ko is European based?

Anyway, di naman siguro ganun ka-reckless ang HQA to put out of spec oil sa SF3 ko, otherwise magrereklamo ako.

[IMm29]

Point taken, but also take note that the oil also passes the ACEA B4 standard which is the european counterpart. Im looking at the manual of my SF3, and I cant find any API requirement for the oil, except that it should be ACEA B4 rated. Maybe because yung manual ko is European based?

Anyway, di naman siguro ganun ka-reckless ang HQA to put out of spec oil sa SF3 ko, otherwise magrereklamo ako.

Well, I certainly hope they're not reckless with our cars. But then I think that can still be debated on. In another thread. Hehehe!

That puzzles me though. Parang by Euro standards it's still within spec, but by American standards it's way off? I can understand if it's SM or SN but just CF, coz that would mean it was mainly meant for gasoline engines and just mixed fleet for diesels. But the comparo is diesel to diesel already. Or am I reading it wrong? Can someone enlighten us?

[dfopiso]

to owners of Tucs CRDI, forced to use HGMO (im assuming na CF rated), how is your FC and engine so far?

[elviar]

to owners of Tucs CRDI, forced to use HGMO (im assuming na CF rated), how is your FC and engine so far?

Lakas ng FC ko.. gamit ko na ung EURO IV ng UniOil wala prin.. Next change oil ko, magdadala na ako ng sarili.

[dfopiso]

Lakas ng FC ko.. gamit ko na ung EURO IV ng UniOil wala prin.. Next change oil ko, magdadala na ako ng sarili.

how about yung sound ng engine? hindi ba affected ng CF rated HGMO?

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Lakas ng FC ko.. gamit ko na ung EURO IV ng UniOil wala prin.. Next change oil ko, magdadala na ako ng sarili.

how about yung sound ng engine? hindi ba affected ng CF rated HGMO?

[niky]

Well, I certainly hope they're not reckless with our cars. But then I think that can still be debated on. In another thread. Hehehe!

That puzzles me though. Parang by Euro standards it's still within spec, but by American standards it's way off? I can understand if it's SM or SN but just CF, coz that would mean it was mainly meant for gasoline engines and just mixed fleet for diesels. But the comparo is diesel to diesel already. Or am I reading it wrong? Can someone enlighten us?

If I recall, that's just minimum standards, but the oil can exceed it. If the oil meets the required standards in Europe, should be no big deal.

Maybe it doesn't meet US standards because it's full of GTOil.

Anybody have any idea on the zinc content? The EPA absolutely hates zinc, though it is better for the engine.

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Well, I certainly hope they're not reckless with our cars. But then I think that can still be debated on. In another thread. Hehehe!

That puzzles me though. Parang by Euro standards it's still within spec, but by American standards it's way off? I can understand if it's SM or SN but just CF, coz that would mean it was mainly meant for gasoline engines and just mixed fleet for diesels. But the comparo is diesel to diesel already. Or am I reading it wrong? Can someone enlighten us?

If I recall, that's just minimum standards, but the oil can exceed it. If the oil meets the required standards in Europe, should be no big deal.

Maybe it doesn't meet US standards because it's full of GTOil.

Anybody have any idea on the zinc content? The EPA absolutely hates zinc, though it is better for the engine.

[micodee07]

The EPA absolutely hates zinc, though it is better for the engine.

Zinc is an anti-wear component in motor oil but it also kills the catalytic converter (which is a very expensive part to replace, btw). This is why zinc has been reduced iteratively in every subsequent API spec since SH. It is worthwhile to note also that the reduced levels of Zinc (and Phosphorous) affect older engines (with Flat tappets) more than it does newer engines.

On the other hand the current specification (SN) requires the highest level of the anti-wear component Molybdenum to date, which IMHO is all around better for new cars. Besides, you get the "Moly plating" effect which is more persistent than the straight up lubrication you get with zinc (which flows down with the oil when you turn the engine off). This makes it better for cold starts which is where lubrication additives matter most.

Actually, kinda think about it now, I wonder if the reduced valve tappet sound in my Tuc is because of the thinner oil viscosity or the move from SM to SN rated oil.

[dfopiso]

Ever since the first PMS of my Tucson, I have been forced by my Hyundai service center to use their HGMO oil. It is a crappy policy by all means. I've had a number of problems - and complaints to Hyundai - including terrible fuel economy (5.3k/L) and very loud valve tappeting sounds on cold starts all pointing to poor or incorrect oil in my engine. Hyundai has refused to allow me to bring my own oil. Unfortunately for me, I think my engine has already been damaged by the wrong spec HGMO oil that Hyundai has been forcing down our throats.

...

I'd actually hope a HARI executive replies to this thread. I hope HARI can answer the question of why we cannot have a choice on something as trivial as engine oil? Why are we forced to use oil from an unknown manufacturer of a quality, for all we know, could be sub-standard. At the very least HARI should present to us who's the 3rd party manufacturer of this oil and let us choose our own quality oil.

*TS/micodee: you can visit HARI (walkin will do) at their office at the 10th to 12th Floor, KPMG Center, 6787 Ayala Avenue, Makati (tel 813-6788 to 89)

FC of my 2.0L Theta II Tucs is 7.3km/li at 60-40% city-highway driving. i have same sound and grunt observation as yours

my first change oil, HQA used 15w-50 semi syn. second, HGC used 5w-40 full syn

[micodee07]

FC of my 2.0L Theta II Tucs is 7.3km/li at 60-40% city-highway driving. i have same sound and grunt observation as yours

I did analysis on my Tucson GLS 2.0 record, these are my FC stats over my recorded period from March 2012 to today:

10,728km on HGMO FS 10W-40

Isolated HWAY records - 2,484.7km 304.0L 8.17km/L
Isolated CITY records - 5,321.3km 1019.4L 5.22km/L
Unisolated mixed records - 2,922.0km 509.4L 5.74km/L

Computed mixed cycle - 32/68 h/c ratio 7806.0km 1323.4L 5.89km/L
TOTAL/AVERAGE - 10,728km 1832.76L 5.85km/L

There are also other stats on gas -
Petron Xtra is about 3.20% MORE efficient than XCS on the highway
Petron Xtra is about 0.68% LESS efficient than XCS in city driving
Petron Xtra is about 1.73% LESS efficient than XCS on a 32/68 mixed cycle

It costs P9.26 per km in fuel and P1.77 per km in maintenance (total of P11.03 per km) to operate the Tucson

[dfopiso]

^ eversince, i only used Shell Nitro+; except in Subic, using XCS (~ 4% of total fuel used for 6 months)

so the viscosity rating affects the health of the engine, right? 5w-40 better than 15w-50

while the API rating affects the FC, right? no diff between SN and SM

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^ eversince, i only used Shell Nitro+; except in Subic, using XCS (~ 4% of total fuel used for 6 months)

so the viscosity rating affects the health of the engine, right? 5w-40 better than 15w-50

while the API rating affects the FC, right? no diff between SN and SM

[micodee07]

I think not as straight forward as that....

SAE rating (i.e. viscosity) i think would affect FC most noticeably (thinner is more efficient) but would also have a significant effect on engine health/lifespan. Too thick - and you damage your engine on cold starts, too thin, you damage the engine as it gets hot since there's not enough lubrication film between metal parts. For the Tucson Theta II at least: I would pick viscosity in this order:

0W-20 > 0W-30 > 5W-20 > 5W-30 > 10W-30 > 10W-40

I wouldn't put anything above 10W-40 (i.e. 15W-50) in my Tuc.

API tells you what additive contents are in the oil. Zinc, Moly, Phosporous, Boron, detergents and other stuff. You might need to research a bit to know the right API rating, especially if you have an older model car. I would say that SN is best for the Tuc Theta II - better than the SM. Then again, we live in the Philippines. My 89 corolla (that barely runs) would pass emissions tests with flying colors; it might make more practical sense to let the cat converter waste away with an SL or SJ rated oil and extend the engine's life longer with the greater ZDDP/ZDTP. content.

[bjreyesmd]

Well, I certainly hope they're not reckless with our cars. But then I think that can still be debated on. In another thread. Hehehe!

That puzzles me though. Parang by Euro standards it's still within spec, but by American standards it's way off? I can understand if it's SM or SN but just CF, coz that would mean it was mainly meant for gasoline engines and just mixed fleet for diesels. But the comparo is diesel to diesel already. Or am I reading it
wrong? Can someone enlighten us?

Yup, ako din puzzled. Looking at the label, FS HGMO is applicable for all types of engines whether petrol or diesel. Meets SN and CF requirements but also ACEA B4. Pwede ba yun?