Structural strength of City, Civics made in Thailand vs Phils

**imperialv** · May 21st, 2008 03:10 AM

Originally Posted by niker

The Honda salesman said that in Thailand, they put a raw metal cube into a super machine. Then out came the shell (including roof) in one piece.. that is... there is no spot-welding different panels of metal together... but all coming right out of the fabrication oven. He said in phils.. it's low tech where things have to spot welded.

Hmm.. I don't know if he has big imagination or he heard it elsewhere. He loves honda and said toyota cars have bad fuel consumption and their engines are the same back ages ago.

*niker... don't believe what he said.. total salestalk..

**av427** · May 21st, 2008 03:59 AM

Honestly, Im having 2nd thoughts buying CBU Hondas from thailand--you know why?

My 2007 JAZZ got bumped at the left rear side last April, walang natamaan na ibang vital except the quarter panel sa left side rear and the bumper corner.

Of course, papalitan di ba? Knowing Jazz hatchback yan so shempre natural lang dapat na may stock sila ng quarter panel kasi wala ngang likod so yun ang tatamaan agad pag may bumunggo sa yo sa likod,

I ordered the parts from Honda and lo and behold-- the quarter panel daw that was used in my Jazz DOES NOT EXIST daw sa stock ng Laguna Honda plant ng QPanels for jazz.

Its like they have quarter panels A, B, C for jazz and mine was C but they have A and B only.

They will check daw if A and B will fit mine, kasi wala daw talagang dumating sa kanila ever na C quarter panel--

2 weeks na wala pa ding news,

Sabi ko, napaka IMPOSIBLE naman na unang Jazz lang sa buong Pilipinas ang Jazz ko na papalitan ng left quarter panel--so impossible di ba?

I got so mad and asked "Bakit kayo magbebenta ng car na walang parts na available? Ano yan, Porsche?"

Iorder daw nila sa Thailand and will take 3 weeks to get here, which will make my waiting time close to 2 months already---ang galing di ba?

Please note that this is a 2007 Jazz which is the same as the 2008 Jazz which is the latest. Ang sunod na lalabas is yung Full Model Change na so pano nangyari na kabago bagong model e walang quarter panel na stock?

May kilala ba kayo na nagpapapalit na ng Quarter panel ng Jazz 2006-2007-2008 model? Para malaman ko kung totoo bang never sila nagkaton nung panel na yon, baka matulungan nyo ko para maireklamo ko itong kalokohan na ito.

Mabuti na lang may nasasakyan pa ko ngayon kung hindi susulat ako sa head nila at magrereklamo ito pag di pa nagka solusyon ito by end of May.

In fairness, malakas ang pagkabangga sa min pero walang ibang damage kundi yung panel and bumper lang talaga. Sa ilalim malinis lahat, walang tinamaan which is thankful ako dahil baka umabot ng 6 months kotse ko dun pag ganun nangyari.

Ngayon iniisip ko sana Made in Pinas na lang yung car ko, dali pa ng parts if ever!

**russpogi** · May 21st, 2008 04:06 AM

Here's my two cents:

He's a salesman, so he's good with b*llsh1t because, that's his job. If he knows that much about structural integrity, he should have been working at the assembly line as an engineer, like what niky mentioned.

**niker** · May 21st, 2008 07:09 AM

Originally Posted by number001

^Everything comes out of the dying machine as one ? and all they have to do is screw the doors and viola ! ? Sorry to say, but that is probably the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard.

A die stamping machine is really big. They feed it with sheets of metal and it outputs the ready body panels. Even panels like the hood, trunk, doors, etc...are made of at least to pieces of stamped metal that are "punched" together.

The honda salesman was not saying that the panels all came out of
the fabrication oven. What he was saying is that the structures
frames and beams are the one in one piece coming out of it. So
what you'd see is like the skeleton of the car without any panel
because the panels were added later. Here in phils daw the skeleton
is spot welded specially connecting the rooftop. While in thailand,
the roof beam and structure is connected to the main body beams
in one piece without any spot welding because of their advanced
fabrication process. What do you think? Is this not theoretically
possible? Note it's the beams and structures only.. the skeleton..
that came out of the fabrication machine in one piece.. not
the panels of course where were later added to the one piece
structure.

**basti08** · May 21st, 2008 07:28 AM

BS!

baka ang sinasabi sayo na may dalawang klase ng body structure

1.) unibody at 2.) body on frame and the former is stronger/more rigid than the latter.

unibody is mostly what modern car are using. traditional SUVs (4Runner, Jeep Cherokee etc) and old school Large sedans are like this (Ford Crown Vic, Mercury Grand Marquis, 94 Toyota Crown etc)

He said that the base of the Jazz to the roof is moulded from
one piece of metal. While in City, the roof is connected to
the base by joint support enough to hold the roof, not one
piece of metal.

maybe next time when he says that the roof is made up of 10% metal to hold it across its length and 90% Masilya... eh maniwala ka. ;)

**niker** · May 21st, 2008 08:14 AM

Originally Posted by basti08

BS!

baka ang sinasabi sayo na may dalawang klase ng body structure

1.) unibody at 2.) body on frame and the former is stronger/more rigid than the latter.

unibody is mostly what modern car are using. traditional SUVs (4Runner, Jeep Cherokee etc) and old school Large sedans are like this (Ford Crown Vic, Mercury Grand Marquis, 94 Toyota Crown etc)

maybe next time when he says that the roof is made up of 10% metal to hold it across its length and 90% Masilya... eh maniwala ka. ;)

Come on. It's not impossible to fabricate pure beams and structural skeleton in one piece especially when you have the technology and manufacturing technique. Imagine a vertical i-beam in a house foundation, the horizonal beam is put on top of it. But it's not hard to manufacture I-beam with the vertical and horizonal already together from the fabrication machine.

The idea of the salesman is simply that the body base beam is connected
by supporting beams to the roof beams in one piece without solder so
that when the say Jazz goes turtle, the roof won't collapse due to
more strength in the support compared to the ones manufacture here
where it can simply collapse from the poor spot welding where the only
support of the side support is to hold the roof and nothing more.

He is of course refering to unibody structural beams and not body-on-frame which is not used by the honda sedans and suv.

Of course if a Honda factory worker or employee can share with us the truth,
then we can categorically state the salesman is just imagining things.

**basti08** · May 21st, 2008 08:40 AM

It's not impossible? Yes. But would Honda, knowing the Innovative Honda that we know, would do that? I just dont think so. Would Honda risk their reputation? Nah ah.
I am not a Honda fanboy whatsoever I do like Mazda and the sucky Nissan better than it but I just dont think Honda would do it.

Of course if a Honda factory worker or employee can share with us the truth,
then we can categorically state the salesman is just imagining things.

If from a Honda factory worker or employee, I just smell sabotage here. Just when a decade ago, when CBA conflicts was what I heard ruined the quality of Mitsubishi products locally produced.

If they are telling the truth, they better prove it. Sue Honda bigtime, bring their facts to the table and make Honda a cashcow. hahahaha

Im just not biting.

**mbeige** · May 21st, 2008 10:25 AM

This link should give an overall view of the structure of the Honda Jazz, similar to the City and Civic (couldn't find the one for the sedans)

http://corporate.honda.com/press/art...=2006033154139

**aku** · May 21st, 2008 09:57 PM

Labo... Sounds like a very weird way to try and upsell someone towards a more expensive model. Baka naman it's just that one guy. See if the other salespeople at the dealership give you the same story. If they don't, well, there's your answer.

**niker** · May 21st, 2008 10:02 PM

Originally Posted by mbeige

This link should give an overall view of the structure of the Honda Jazz, similar to the City and Civic (couldn't find the one for the sedans)

http://corporate.honda.com/press/art...=2006033154139

After some research in the net. The above is called a floorpan of a unibody
design. I wonder if the civic floorpan is imported from thailand or locally produced here. The honda salesman position was that it was locally produced. He said that in Thailand, the civic floorpan was fabricated in one piece right out of the machine while locally, the floorpans were spot welded in the bench since the "one-piece" technology only belongs to Thailand and other more high tech plants. If someone can confirm all floorpans came from Thailand, then the salesman was incorrect.

In friday or so. I'll grill the honda salesman again to see if he has indeed visited the thailand plant and what security clearance he has.. whether S4 or just S1. S4 is 4 levels underground in high security advanced vehicular cybernetic exo-skeleton fabrication department where proprietary secrets may be held.