Bargain price hybrid in works at Honda?

[number001]

Honda to Release World's First Hybrid Subcompact

Nikkei Net Interactive
February 22, 2006

TOKYO -- Honda Motor Co. plans to start selling the hybrid version of its Fit subcompact worldwide as early as fiscal 2007, The Nihon Keizai Shimbun learned Tuesday.

This vehicle stands to become the first hybrid to be priced at less than 2 million yen, as Honda apparently aims to sell it for around 1.4 million yen, about 200,000 yen more than the conventional Fit's price tag. Based on midsize and large vehicles, the hybrid cars currently on the market sell for at least 2 million yen.

Toyota Motor Corp.'s hybrid vehicles are priced about 500,000 yen higher than the gasoline-powered vehicles they are based on. Honda aims to reduce the price difference to less than half by developing a smaller motor and battery.

Honda plans to add the hybrid model when the Fit subcompact is due for full remodeling. The Fit series consists of models with engine displacements ranging between 1.3 and 1.5 liters. For the hybrid version, Honda intends to develop a 1-liter-class engine.

Aside from Honda and Toyota, Ford Motor Co. sells hybrid cars in North America. Toyota, which led the way with the launch of the Prius hybrid in 1997, now offers five hybrid models. Its sales of hybrid cars in 2005 totaled 235,000 units, or 3.2% of its entire vehicle sales.

Honda entered the market in 1999 by rolling out the Insight two-seater hybrid. It now sells the Insight and hybrid versions of the Civic and Accord. Aggregate sales of these three vehicles in 2005 came to 48,000 units, about 1.4% of Honda's overall car sales.

Launched in 2001, global sales of the Fit subcompact totaled 390,000 units in 2005, the third-highest tally among Honda vehicles, following the Accord's 680,000 units and the Civic's 590,000.

The Fit hybrid will likely offer a fuel economy comparable to the Insight's 36km per liter and the Toyota Prius' 35.5km per liter.

Driven by high gasoline prices, demand for hybrid cars has been growing worldwide. The U.S. is the biggest market, with the bulk of all global hybrid car sales made there. Much of the rest are sold in Japan and Europe.

Hybrid Jazz? I thought it was fuel efficient enough already by today's standards.

[Karding]

USDM Hybrid Fit which will sell for only $12,000 and gets a whopping 80mpg

[gearspeed]

80mpg

wow ang tipid ah..

wow...tapos magbababaan na presyo ng gas.

hindi lang babaan ng gas bagsakan pa...

[carlocaraddict]

80mpg?! holy cow!!

[Autobeat]

Wow, so around 34km/liter ito? Oks, so around Php1/km lang gas cost nito.

[baiskee]

wow...tapos magbababaan na presyo ng gas.

[theveed]

Edi ayos, once every 2 months ka nalang magpapafulltank hahaha, maka mas mataas pa oil change cost mo kesa fuel cost.

[orly_andico]

that 80mpg figure is US EPA highway reading, which is at a constant 48mph with no aircon. :P
about 60mpg would be the realistic highway mileage, and Phil. city driving conditions about 40mpg.

so that's 25km/L highway and 17km/L city. both figures of which are readily achievable under realistic conditions by the Hyundai Matrix.

i'm on the alt.autos.toyota newsgroup, and the americans on the group can't figure out why anyone would pay big bucks for a Prius which gets 40-something mpg when a Tercel with a gas engine gets 35-something. Same case here, a difference of 200,000 yen is about $2000. would you buy a Honda Jazz for 900k to get the hybrid technology? potential shocker pa yan pag lumusong ka sa baha.

[Karding]

that 80mpg figure is US EPA highway reading, which is at a constant 48mph with no aircon. :P
about 60mpg would be the realistic highway mileage, and Phil. city driving conditions about 40mpg.

so that's 25km/L highway and 17km/L city. both figures of which are readily achievable under realistic conditions by the Hyundai Matrix.

i'm on the alt.autos.toyota newsgroup, and the americans on the group can't figure out why anyone would pay big bucks for a Prius which gets 40-something mpg when a Tercel with a gas engine gets 35-something. Same case here, a difference of 200,000 yen is about $2000. would you buy a Honda Jazz for 900k to get the hybrid technology? potential shocker pa yan pag lumusong ka sa baha.

potential shocker nga pero Im pretty sure my ground fault detection or else it would have never been approved by the NHTSA.

hindi ko din maintindihan kung bakit hindi ini-isip ng mga Hybrid buyers ang long term expenses or the big picture. A price difference of $5,000 for Prius is so ridiculous when you have to wait 8 years to recover the extra money spent compared to driving a Corolla.

the estimated MPG of each car is a ballpark figure indeed, could be a good or bad. For example, my 04 Civic was rated 37mpg highway. I drove from LA to San Diego with A/C on * cruising speed of 70mph, and the MPG I got? 42mpg ;) And it wasnt stock Civic, intake, header, exhaust, heavy 17's which could have made the fuel economy worst.

The Prius is a different story. Kaya hindi cost effective ang Prius compared to similar car like Corolla, dahil na din sa $5,000 difference nila. Whereas with Fit/Jazz, $1,700 lang ang difference compared to gas powered Fit/Jazz.

Another way to get the ROI quickly is if you drive more than the average of 12,000 miles. If you drive 12,000 a year then a gas powered is better for ROI.

30,000 miles a year = 1.5year to recover the price difference with annual savings of $1,071
12,000 miles a year = 3.9years to recover the price difference with annual savings of $428

OR...the price of gas reaches $5.00/gal

Monthly payment:
Hybrid Jazz/Fit = $228/mo x 60months
Gas Jazz/Fit = $200/mo x 60months

$5000 battery, save the $1000 yearly and by the 5th year, may pambili ka na hahahaa

its a good tool to decide if Hybrid is for you or not. depending on one's own assumption of the REAL mpg, the ROI could be quicker or slower.

If you are a road warrior, then Hybrid Jazz/Fit is probably a better way to commute.

[niky]

If you are a road warrior, then Hybrid Jazz/Fit is probably a better way to commute.

Particularly since the Gas Jazz can get 32 mpg when driven like a maniac (on track, and on the highway at around 100 mph, combined), and over 40 mpg in regular traffic and commuting.

Since Honda is known for their "quick launch" IMA motor for the Accord, will the hybrid system give the Jazz/Fit a peppier launch, too? If it turns the 9-10 second 1.5 CVT into an 8 second car, it would likely be worth the extra 100,000 pesos over the regular 1.5, hybrid or not.

I've always thought the way Honda went with the Accord Hybrid was the way to go. Show people you're not sacrificing anything to fuel efficiency... that you can get both high performance and low fuel consumption in the same package, in a car that's not any different than the regular one.

Not like the Prius or Insight, where you sacrifice performance, practicality and comfort to the gods of the gas pump.

[ghosthunter]

with any other hybrid car... you can extend the pure electric range simply by installing more batteries.

[mazdamazda]

honda still doesn't get get it.

they should have just shoehorned a small diesel engine to their subcompacts if they want to really save on the overall cost of the vehicle (like how the europeans are doing it right now). notice how this hybrid craze isn't too hot in europe.

people should get over the mpg / fuel consumption reading and also consider the maintenance cost down the line. heck... 8 years from now the cost of the battery replacement might equal the resale value of the car.

[niky]

Actually, it will be interesting to see. What's funny is that Paul Tiglo's already gotten over 100mpg on the Honda City in two fuel economy runs. Except in traffic, the Jazz hybrid may not save much, but I bet we'll see some cool figures if Honda brings a demo unit in.

[theveed]

Well, if the target market is the US, medyo iba line of thinking dyan pre... Just don't forget how well gaz guzzling suvs are selling there... So they're just marketing the opposite end of the spectrum hehe...

But you're right, since malamang sa Euro ibebenta to at Asia... Pag Euro, mas mahilig padin sila sa diesel.

[orly_andico]

exactly right.
although in the US dealers buy back the batteries. it's like $2000 net after 5 years battery replacement cost. the true cost is $5000 but since the batteries are recyclable.. the lower figure is used. still quite large.

[pitbullz]

170kl/litre the Daihatsu UFE(ultra fuel efficient). looks experimental. i just hope that the technology born from this will go mainstream in the next 3 years

[pitbullz]

http://arabam.milliyet.com.tr/fuar/2...atsu_UFEII.jpg

UFE2

[ale828]

the problem with honda is that they are practically newbies when it comes to diesel technology. they only have a couple of diesel engines and its mostly placed in their euro car line up. Their diesel tech is way behind with othe jap car manufacturers like toyota. they are better off using the newer hybrid technology where in most car manufacturers are still building its technology in the infancy stage.

[ghosthunter]

On TV, I saw a kind of twist to the hybrid car technology. The main problem of using a hybrid car is the power still ultimately comes from gasoline or diesel fuel and the hybrid electric system is only used to increase the efficiency of the ICE (internal combustion engine).

The twist in the hybrid car comes in where you can charge your car's batteries at your home or destination simply by plugging in your car to the nearest outlet. With a little tweeking, you can drive around to nearby destinations on pure electric mode. With added battery capacity, you can increase the electric range. If your workplace is in range of your batteries, its possible to have your entire car commute in electric mode. If you need to go out of town, you can drive as far as the batteries will take you then the ICE will come in and propell you the rest of the way (and charge the batteries as well).

I think the current view of hybrid car is gasoline/diesel engine first and electric system helping. The twist is to view the hybrid car as electric car first and ICE system as helping to increase the vehicle's range.

[Loki]

eh kung dagdagan pa nila ng tax incentive yung hybrid cars, di mas lalong konti na lang difference ng hybrid against regular jazz di ba. if im not mistaken meron tax incentive yung hybrid and electric cars sa US. Or maybe the projected price difference factor in the tax incentive already?