PowerShift Transmission: Needs Replacing < 25,000km

[butterpear]

My brother had a similar problem with his OPEL OMEGA sedan. AT tranny failed after the warranty but the odometer was still under 40K. The casa wanted replace the tranny and charge him for the cost of the tranny plus labor (over P500,000 total in parts alone). After a few letters exchanged (with CC to lawyers, managers, executives, etc), OPEL (I think GM was the company who owned OPEL in the Philippines then) relented and ended up billing my brother only less than 50K for a new crated tranny, which was opened in his presence (part of the legal agreement) before it was installed on the car.

All in all, I think it took him 3 months just to get the legal matters done.

Thanks for sharing this. 3 months is bad, glad he sorted it out. But considering my car has been with Ford for over 2 months without them even giving a specific diagnosis yet I guess i'm not in great shape. My wife was able to get in touch earlier today with FGP over the phone, we'll be meeting with FGP next week about this. Will update this thread in case anyone is interested.

[butterpear]

Possibly. If so, then they do owe you a replacement, since the unit is supposed to be completely maintenance free.

Hi Niky, it's also my understanding that the dual clutch transmission is supposed to be essentially maintenance-free. In fact, when Casa suggested that we change the fluid because it was black I had to wait several days as the plant doesn't stock it since they rarely have any need for it. At close to P3,000 per litre of the stuff I guess I wouldn't stock up on it either. When I brought it to Casa earlier this year for a general check-up, there was no mention of the need to change transmission fluid. They told me recently (after my transmission problems) that the fluid usually needs to be changed at very high mileage only.

Would you know though where I can find official documentation that states this?

The reason I ask is when my wife spoke with FGP earlier, they said that the transmission fluid should have been changed after 2 years/60,000km, and my transmission problems might have been caused by our not having done this. While I'm quite sure that this isn't the correct interval I don't have a document to prove it.

[niky]

If it is not in the manual, then they can't hold you to it. The car has been casa-maintained since new by the previous owner? If so, there should be a service history, and there should be evidence as to whether he was told by the SA to change the fluid. Shift the blame to the dealership for not informing the previous owner.

[butterpear]

If it is not in the manual, then they can't hold you to it. The car has been casa-maintained since new by the previous owner? If so, there should be a service history, and there should be evidence as to whether he was told by the SA to change the fluid. Shift the blame to the dealership for not informing the previous owner.

Thanks Niky. Unfortunately, the manual is in the glove compartment of the car in the Casa parking lot. The previous owner had it Casa serviced at 1 thousand and 5 thousand km, and seems to have missed the one at 10thousand(?). I'm sure though that there was no advice from Casa to change the fluid as part of scheduled maintenance as they didn't mention it when I had the car checked with them initially after purchase- nor in all of our discussions about the transmission problem when I brought it in for that. In fact, they said that the need to change transmission fluid at all for the DCT was a rare occurrence for them. Thanks again.

[mitzusu4DJ1]

Suwertihan talaga ang pagbili ng second hand, mababa nga ang mileage pero morethan 3year na siya, wala narin warranty and di natin alam ang history ng sasakyan, magagastusan ka talaga diyan. Sa FGP my mga company vehicle sila na sira ang A/T transmission Everest mga 4years old tinatambak nalang kahit sila namamahalan pag papalitan ng transmission

experience ko sa TDCI 25,000km in 3weeks 24/7 shifting driver pedal to the metal pa ang driving style, FGP mileage test 2009, ang nasira lang ubos ang brake pads pati brake disc hukay ang tire 30% nalang, tingin ko malas lang talaga bakit nasira yan di pa umabot sa warranty

hanap ka nalang ng magaling sa a/t transmission sa labas ng casa, mapag aaralan naman nila yan, ganyan talaga ang sasakyan ginawa para masira

[glenn manikis]

sir biglaan lang po ba nangyari na naglolo tranny nyo?

SIR niky power shift din kaya yung focus namin? gas 1.8AT yung may ( + M -) na nakalagay

a/t power shift din ata focus namin... so far 26k ang mileage so far so good pero more than 4yrs. na minsan ko lang ginamit yung power shift ba tawag dun? yung may + M - na sign... pero never pa na change oil ang tranny....

[hyblaxx_24]

I was thinking about the ford's dry clutch DCT. I have a friend who encountered same problem but fiesta yung sa kanya.ford replaced the clutch module. So sa pagiging ignorance ko nagtanung tanung ako sabi nila clutch module control unit yung problem nun. I knew a place that conducting a review about sa powershift DCT and checking the vehicle.curious lang ako nun day na yun. And i hope na may solution na sila sa problem n yan.

[hyblaxx_24]

Try to search and watch pala the zf 7dct.

[niky]

sir biglaan lang po ba nangyari na naglolo tranny nyo?

SIR niky power shift din kaya yung focus namin? gas 1.8AT yung may ( + M -) na nakalagay

a/t power shift din ata focus namin... so far 26k ang mileage so far so good pero more than 4yrs. na minsan ko lang ginamit yung power shift ba tawag dun? yung may + M - na sign... pero never pa na change oil ang tranny....

Nope. Regular 4-speed AT.

[blue_gambit]

TS in your shoes I'd change the tranny to a convetional M/T na lang... atleast next time na mag ka problema madali gawin..

[glenn manikis]

Nope. Regular 4-speed AT.

mabuti kung ganun...

sir napancin ko last time 120kph na nag shift pa po...

[yebo]

ngayon ko lang nakita to.

correct me if i am wrong, ang ford focus DCT ay multi-plate wet type clutch, tama ba?

naka-baklas na ko ng multi-plate clutch once in my boring life. same symptoms as described by the TS, shruderring, then lack of power. may strainer lang yan na barado kaya walang power. then the root cause of the problem (burned/dirty oil) is one of the valves. clutch/brake kasi yan, pag inapakan mo yung brake dapat bibitaw ang clutch. pag barado yung valve late ang pag-release ng clutch kaya napupudpod ang clutch disks, reason why the oil is burned and dirty.

so need gawin dyan (assuming tama ako) is open the transmission housing, flush all the oil and clean inside, clean all the oil strainers (maybe just 1, maybe 2, need to check all ports kasi nasa ports yung strainers)), and clean/adjust OR replace yung sequence valve.

[butterpear]

Suwertihan talaga ang pagbili ng second hand, mababa nga ang mileage pero morethan 3year na siya, wala narin warranty and di natin alam ang history ng sasakyan, magagastusan ka talaga diyan. Sa FGP my mga company vehicle sila na sira ang A/T transmission Everest mga 4years old tinatambak nalang kahit sila namamahalan pag papalitan ng transmission

experience ko sa TDCI 25,000km in 3weeks 24/7 shifting driver pedal to the metal pa ang driving style, FGP mileage test 2009, ang nasira lang ubos ang brake pads pati brake disc hukay ang tire 30% nalang, tingin ko malas lang talaga bakit nasira yan di pa umabot sa warranty

hanap ka nalang ng magaling sa a/t transmission sa labas ng casa, mapag aaralan naman nila yan, ganyan talaga ang sasakyan ginawa para masira

Hi Mitzusu, feeling ko factory defect, at di kasalanan ng previous owner dahil automatic at sealed/maintenance free yn transmission. Sana di na kailangan lumabas sa kasa pero baka di nila kaya.

[butterpear]

sir biglaan lang po ba nangyari na naglolo tranny nyo?

SIR niky power shift din kaya yung focus namin? gas 1.8AT yung may ( + M -) na nakalagay

a/t power shift din ata focus namin... so far 26k ang mileage so far so good pero more than 4yrs. na minsan ko lang ginamit yung power shift ba tawag dun? yung may + M - na sign... pero never pa na change oil ang tranny....

Hi Glenn, yes biglaan lang

[butterpear]

ngayon ko lang nakita to.

correct me if i am wrong, ang ford focus DCT ay multi-plate wet type clutch, tama ba?

naka-baklas na ko ng multi-plate clutch once in my boring life. same symptoms as described by the TS, shruderring, then lack of power. may strainer lang yan na barado kaya walang power. then the root cause of the problem (burned/dirty oil) is one of the valves. clutch/brake kasi yan, pag inapakan mo yung brake dapat bibitaw ang clutch. pag barado yung valve late ang pag-release ng clutch kaya napupudpod ang clutch disks, reason why the oil is burned and dirty.

so need gawin dyan (assuming tama ako) is open the transmission housing, flush all the oil and clean inside, clean all the oil strainers (maybe just 1, maybe 2, need to check all ports kasi nasa ports yung strainers)), and clean/adjust OR replace yung sequence valve.

Hi Yebo, very detailed response- thank you! I'm not sure pero dry clutch ata yn focus DCT. Assuming dry clutch, may equivalent problem/solution kaya? thanks again.

[docgorio]

I wonder if the previous owner got too amused with the immense torque of the TDCi???

Being a sealed unit this must be maintenance free. If it broke down with about 25K on the clock then it should be a congenital defect that needs replacing.

I also wonder if other owners of TDCi's had a similar issue???

[mitzusu4DJ1]

Anong balita TS sa Turbo Diesel Common Rail Injection Car mo? malapit na Pasko....

[niky]

Hi Yebo, very detailed response- thank you! I'm not sure pero dry clutch ata yn focus DCT. Assuming dry clutch, may equivalent problem/solution kaya? thanks again.

The TDCi is wet-plate. The dry-plate system is in the Fiesta and new Focus 1.6. The dry-plate system has replaceable clutch packs.

[butterpear]

**UPDATE DEC. 8**

-After my lack of success getting FGP to reply to my emails since October, my wife was finally able to contact them by phone about a week ago. She met with FGP at the casa on Wednesday (I was unfortunately at work)

-FGP said they are willing to share in the costs of replacing the transmission. As I stated in the original post, our feedback from Casa (who had called FGP in October to ask for the price of the transmission for this) was about P370k.

-FGP sent a proposal later in the week stating that the "official" cost of the transmission is P667,000. But they will give us a "special discount" and charge us only P363,000 for the part.

From our perspective, it looks like what they've done is to almost double the already crazy expensive price for the transmission from P370k to P667,000; then created an artificial discount by cutting it back to P363,000. I'm sure though that they have some internal document to support that price, ridiculous as it is.

Dealing with FGP has been extremely disappointing, frustrating, and expensive. I pulled the car out of the casa and have been looking for a transmission elsewhere as the prices from Ford are crazy and unaffordable. The only thing we've gained by dealing with Ford is a general diagnosis that the transmission is faulty and needs replacing. Just what exactly is wrong with it is a mystery. It cost us close to P22,000 and leaving the car 3 months with Ford to just find this out.

Unfortunately, Ford Focus parts aren't easy to find. The diesel DCT/powershift transmission seems particularly difficult (as there haven't been too many of these on the road), and I haven't been able to source one. Outside mechanics I've spoken to have no experience with the internals of the transmission, and are not confident they can do anything about this short of changing the entire assembly.

For those thinking of buying a Ford powershift/dual clutch transmission, you might want to consider that:

1. My transmission malfunctions do not seem to be isolated. Try googling to see all the complaints in other markets (like many Ford cars, the local Focus is a global model)
2. If something in your ford powershift transmission does go bad, it's a sealed unit and chances are that you will have to replace the whole thing and the Ford people themselves may not be able to tell you exactly what's wrong with it.
3. If you have to replace the whole thing, you can either: go to casa (bring P667,000, but maybe they'll give you a discount so you'll pay less than P400k); or source the transmission and have it fixed elsewhere
4. There aren't too many Ford powershift cars around. The powershift transmission itself is a relatively new technology. This means that not only is the transmission itself difficult to source, but mechanics don't have much experience in fixing it.

[ghosthunter]

I think you shouldn't settle for the quoted P363K tranny replacement price. As I mentioned before, it can be claimed as a product defect resulting in the early failure of the tranny. Although your car might be out of warranty, parts like the tranny should last the life of the car. Your car with only 25,000km on the odometer should not experience such a failure. FORD should honor the "goodwill warranty" claim on the Focus and replace the tranny with either no charge or minimal charge to the owner of the car. Minimal would be around P100K (more or less).

P373K is still way too much to pay for fixing something that can be seen as a factory defect resulting in early tranny failure.