CARB TYPE ENGINE VS FUEL INJECTED ENGINE [merged threads]

[niky]

*woodfire, di ba may EFI na bolt-on kits para sa engine mo?

[woodfire]

*woodfire, di ba may EFI na bolt-on kits para sa engine mo?

yes, meron binibenta yung HOLLEY na multipoint EFI for small block V8's. For old classic cars, I still feel I have to go carb as what was intended by the manufacturer. Besides, a complete EFI system for an old V8 would be in the range of $2,800-3,200.00 (inclusive of the ecu).

what i did was just to install significantly better parts like a new generation carburetor, better breathing aluminum cylinder heads, intake manifold, larger intake and exhaust valves, ceramic coated headers, etc...

[niky]

3k dollars?!? Ngek. Puwede ka nang magpa-supercharge nun, diba? Still, an interesting mod for hot-rodding, though. I've always felt that it's the looks and the spirit of the car that count, not the originality... but then, ang sarap ng glug glug glug ng old-school set-ups.

[woodfire]

3k dollars?!? Ngek. Puwede ka nang magpa-supercharge nun, diba? Still, an interesting mod for hot-rodding, though. I've always felt that it's the looks and the spirit of the car that count, not the originality... but then, ang sarap ng glug glug glug ng old-school set-ups.

hehehe exactly! the glug glug glug and the broooom broooom of the old school V8 exhaust system (tri-Y H-pipe dual exhaust) is exactly what I'm looking for in a classic car. My wife is still wondering why I like such sound (which she considers annoying)... ahh women, they still don't get it, do they hehehe

[badkuk]

bumping...me tatanong lang sana ako B)

i noticed a few setups with Weber/Solex side-draft carbs; tinatry ko hanapin ung air intake/filter, til i realized na wala nga talaga.

is this really advisable? aren't you risking long-term damage to your engine that way?

[kamotecueman]

anu po ba ang advantages at dis advantages ng de-karburador at efi na makina??

[jick.cejoco]

anu po ba ang advantages at dis advantages ng de-karburador at efi na makina??

kamotecueman,
efi is the better solution to higher miles per gallon rating and air pollution reduction. with carburetors, we had hot idle compensator, high altitude compensator, early fuel evaporation systems, choke systems, throttle check pot or dashpot to name a few mechanical subsystems of the carburetor. most of them if not all had linkages that get stuck in time and needed to be adjusted. carburetor fed engines contributed to more carbon dioxide emissions, oxides of nitrogen, unburnt fuel and evaporated fuel from the carburetor float bowl. an act of congress passed in the united states called for increased mpg and lower evaporative and exhaust emissions. picture this, the efi systems involve computers to constantly adjust air/fuel mixtures to stoichiometric (14.7 pound of air used to burn 1 pound of gasoline). computers make all the adjustments which is very difficult to achieve if not impossible
jick

[jjmd3_787]

EFI engines emits cleaner fumes, more responsive, and have better fuel consumption.

Carburetor-fed engines emits more carbon, less responsive especially in cold starts, and less efficient in mixing & burning fuels. That's why it was considered obsolete in the US and other countries during the early 90's.

[tanfoglio380]

kamotecueman,
efi is the better solution to higher miles per gallon rating and air pollution reduction. with carburetors, we had hot idle compensator, high altitude compensator, early fuel evaporation systems, choke systems, throttle check pot or dashpot to name a few mechanical subsystems of the carburetor. most of them if not all had linkages that get stuck in time and needed to be adjusted. carburetor fed engines contributed to more carbon dioxide emissions, oxides of nitrogen, unburnt fuel and evaporated fuel from the carburetor float bowl. an act of congress passed in the united states called for increased mpg and lower evaporative and exhaust emissions. picture this, the efi systems involve computers to constantly adjust air/fuel mixtures to stoichiometric (14.7 pound of air used to burn 1 pound of gasoline). computers make all the adjustments which is very difficult to achieve if not impossible
jick

While it is true that carb fed engines has lots of adjustments to make, my experiences tell me that I can deal with carbs rather than efi engines. Meaning, it's easy for me to maintain carbs than efi, in case you get bugged down anywhere during trips.

[niky]

As opposed to the finicky EFI systems of yesteryear (60s to 80s), modern 90s and up EFIs are very robust and easy to maintain. Most of the problems you will get are vacuum issues, which you can fix by patching hoses. Electronic ignition control also means that you won't have distributor caps breaking down on you, either.

[bennisiozo]

well said for the advantages of EFI i certainly and definitely agree.but how about the disadvantages like if the computer fails, how much is that? what if the throtle position sensor, the crank angle sensor, the cam position sensor, the boost sensor,oxygen sensor etc... fails though it will not fail that early but how much are all of that if one fails? maintaining the EFI system is not a DYI thing and that where the advntage of the carburetor enters. though there is so manay maitenance and adjustments needed to it and the emission it creates it is still the foundation of gasoline fuel system that is a DYI thing for people who can not afford EFI engines. fuel consumption can also be adjusted to a carb engines though power will be sacrifice. simply what the EFI's advantages is the Carburetors advantages and vice versa.

[jick.cejoco]

well said for the advantages of EFI i certainly and definitely agree.but how about the disadvantages like if the computer fails, how much is that? what if the throtle position sensor, the crank angle sensor, the cam position sensor, the boost sensor,oxygen sensor etc... fails though it will not fail that early but how much are all of that if one fails? maintaining the EFI system is not a DYI thing and that where the advntage of the carburetor enters. though there is so manay maitenance and adjustments needed to it and the emission it creates it is still the foundation of gasoline fuel system that is a DYI thing for people who can not afford EFI engines. fuel consumption can also be adjusted to a carb engines though power will be sacrifice. simply what the EFI's advantages is the Carburetors advantages and vice versa.

bennisiozo,
that is one of the reasons why the united states congress enacted the clean air act to reduce greenhouse emissions by changing to a more precise and optimum use of fuel through the use of electronics. also, to reduce the chances of any mcgyver or tom, dick and harry who is not trained, equipped and experienced in this field. the cars now are not your calesa of decades ago. when your television breaks, do you complain that you have to bring it to a technician with equipment, parts, knowledge, expertise and skills to fix your t.v.?
jick

[loidch]

after Ondoy, the carburatted engine will be the earlier one to hit the road again, owing to its simplicity

[niky]

Depends on the engine and how robust the manufacturer makes the computer box. So far, in our club... a Focus, a Lynx RS, an Eve and a Ranger all ran after cleaning... ECUs survived the flood.

Barring flooding, an ECU will likely last up to 20 years or more.

well said for the advantages of EFI i certainly and definitely agree.but how about the disadvantages like if the computer fails, how much is that? what if the throtle position sensor, the crank angle sensor, the cam position sensor, the boost sensor,oxygen sensor etc... fails though it will not fail that early but how much are all of that if one fails? maintaining the EFI system is not a DYI thing and that where the advntage of the carburetor enters. though there is so manay maitenance and adjustments needed to it and the emission it creates it is still the foundation of gasoline fuel system that is a DYI thing for people who can not afford EFI engines. fuel consumption can also be adjusted to a carb engines though power will be sacrifice. simply what the EFI's advantages is the Carburetors advantages and vice versa.

Even the cheapest cars nowadays come with computer boxes.

ECU failures are quite rare... and gasoline fuel injectors can last for 200,000 to 300,000 kilometers without failure. I've never had to replace fuel injectors... ever. Even on high mileage secondhand cars. And the only time I've ever replaced an ECU was due to poor grounding on an engine swap.

The sensors on an EFI engine that are required for EFI, the MAF/MAP, cam position sensor and crank angle sensor, altogether, cost around 15,000 - 20,000 bucks. (estimated... varies per car)... additional costs would include the O2 sensors, but these are for emissions purposes... and even a brand new carbureted vehicle would need O2 sensors to meet emissions requirements.

A brand-new carburetor costs between 20,000 to 30,000 pesos. A brand-new distributor costs between 15,000 to 30,000 pesos.

I've lost quite a few distributors... they wear out pretty badly... good riddance to them. Carbs? They're finicky. You can repair them, but they'll get to a point where the jets don't work properly... and you have to check them every 5000 kilometers to keep fuel economy good.

EFI and electronic ignition may be more expensive by the numbers, if you consider replacement... but down the line, the savings outweigh the initial cost difference by quite a lot.

-

The one advantage a carbureted car still has... it will still run after a nuclear blast.

[oj88]

Good responses. Other advantages for EFI would be sparkplugs lasting longer, as well as the fact that the term "tune up" has been made obsolete because the computer does it in real time. And when something's not right, the check engine light (CEL) or malfunction indicator light (MIL) tells you take it to a qualified mechanic, usually before something more expensive breaks down.

[OTEP]

The Jazz I recovered from headlamp deep waters ran after 24 hours of drying off. So far, no engine problems seen but will still do the typical preventive stuff.

[speed unlimited]

For me the advantages of carburator type engine is easy to maintain , tune up cost less if you do it yourself and in case of engine trouble in the road easy to fix its just like gasoline and electric .

[youngrider]

With the forceful use of alcohol modified gasolines, parang di na practical bumili ng carburetor run engines.

So far yung napalitan ko lang sa electronic components ng EFI ko ay O2 sensor lang after about 200T km of running, not including the spark plugs & HT cables.

[bennisiozo]

bennisiozo,
that is one of the reasons why the united states congress enacted the clean air act to reduce greenhouse emissions by changing to a more precise and optimum use of fuel through the use of electronics. also, to reduce the chances of any mcgyver or tom, dick and harry who is not trained, equipped and experienced in this field. the cars now are not your calesa of decades ago. when your television breaks, do you complain that you have to bring it to a technician with equipment, parts, knowledge, expertise and skills to fix your t.v.?
jick

hey dont take it personally!
kamotecueman is asking what is the advantages and disavantages of EFI and Carburetor engines that's what i gave him that info. you only give the advantages of the EFI and the disavantages of the carburetor which it doesn't answer his question? you may provide a good information to him but its like fixing your said "television" without knowing what is the problem.

[bennisiozo]

bennisiozo,
that is one of the reasons why the united states congress enacted the clean air act to reduce greenhouse emissions by changing to a more precise and optimum use of fuel through the use of electronics. also, to reduce the chances of any mcgyver or tom, dick and harry who is not trained, equipped and experienced in this field. the cars now are not your calesa of decades ago. when your television breaks, do you complain that you have to bring it to a technician with equipment, parts, knowledge, expertise and skills to fix your t.v.?
jick

hey dont take it personally!
kamotecueman is asking what is the advantages and disavantages of EFI and Carburetor engines that's what i gave him that info. you only give the advantages of the EFI and the disavantages of the carburetor which it doesn't answer his question? you may provide a good information to him but its like fixing your said "television" without knowing what is the problem.
by the way if i woul take literally what you said about television, i can fixed my own television with out going to a technician.