Auto-LPG Conversion Thread

[tediber]

update lang hehehhee mahirap nga talga tantiyahin ang FC just by looking at the LED or even the pressure guage attached to the LPG TANK ....... anyways gusto ko na ubusin LPG ko but it just keeps going hehehehe almost 240kms na natakbo ko .... the pressure guage at the tank indicates almost empty pero me laman pa din e. isang araw pa siguro maubos ko din yan.

1.6E A/T Altis .... on petrol i know i do 8.5km/liter

[ezem]

* Sir GH

pwede kaya yung speedlab tuning sa non-SGI kits?

__________________
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[ezem]

* Sir GH

pwede kaya yung speedlab tuning sa non-SGI kits?

__________________
passion for fashion? craving for savings?
visit MAI PASSION boutique at the fashion village * Tiendesitas

[ghosthunter]

hi niky, tanong ko lang.. how much did it cost you to have your car tuned from speedlab?

Dyno tuning rates applied. But I'll leave it to Niky to answer.

sir GH pwede kaya EROOM kits dito?

pwede if EROOM would lend their laptop. I am assuming you're talking about the closed loop venturi mixer kits.

[Mile2]

Does anyone here have this product installed in their LPG equipped car?

FlashLube electronic kit.
http://www.flashlube-europe.com/en/p...saver-kit.html

[ghosthunter]

For those guys who have already been using AUTO-LPG on their vehicles...

What is your vehicle and how is your vehicle doing on Auto-LPG?


As for me:
1999 Toyota Corolla GLi A/T (NAIADSS venturi-mixer w/ emulator) - doing well after two years, recently converted my korean LPG filler valve to the italian/euro style filler. Generally no problems with my auto-lpg system as long as I keep my air filter clean. One weird result of changing my filler valve, my system seems to be filling up way beyond the 85% typical cut-off which results in more LPG in my tank and added range when driving before needing to fill up.

[niky]

Ferman says any SGi kit can be tuned if the vendor is willing to lend him their laptop. If it's Greenfuel, no problem, Speedlab and Greenfuel are already partners.

Standard dyno-rates should apply. My car was a test-case to see if they could do it successfully. Speedlab charges about 4500-5000 pesos per hour for dyno-tuning. We can't say it'll have the same dramatic effect on all cars... but it's a good bet that your car will run about 5%-10% more powerful after tweaking, and any "flat-spots" caused by incompatibility between the kit and your car's stock ECU can be ironed out.

Of course, I don't know yet what the effect on fuel consumption is... usually, when we dyno-tune, adjusting fueling of the car on gasoline for maximum power makes it run leaner than stock (some stock cars run pig-rich), resulting in lower consumption. I don't know what Ferman had to do with the Lynx. I'm going to ask him later.

It's not necessary to have your kit dyno-tuned. But if you have hangups about poor power or want to ensure maximum reliability, this type of tuning can refine your SGI LPG map so that your car will run as smoothly as possible, with no dangerous lean spots or fuel-wasting rich spots.

[Josh0027]

I've been reading these pages and sadly I'm just at page 60+ at narerepeat ko pa... hirap pag halo work at research hehehehehe. But I think all my questions have been answered on lpg! Love this site.

Sir Nicky usually how many hours are spent typically in a dyno run? I'm planning to get an open-loop emulator type but first I'm going to fine tune my car. Di ko na halos magamit dahil sa taas ng gas ngayon, and I think I've already skipped my last PMS. Tingin ko pa rich ang run niya.

Thx!

[niky]

Usually, an experienced operator like Ferman can finish everything in just one hour.

BUT: You'll need the following for dyno-tuning:

For older EFIs with distributor: A piggyback controller like an APEXi SAFC.

For newer EFIs with direct ignition: A piggyback controller like the Unichip, which can control ignition.

Dyno-tuning is not a band-aid for an improperly working engine... a simple tune-up and some work to fix whatever's causing it to run rich is a more cost-effective solution.

With an open-loop, I don't know if dyno-tuning will give the same resolution and smoothness as with an SGI kit (the SGI has its own computer, which varies fuel delivery based on RPM and stock injector cycles).

[Josh0027]

Usually, an experienced operator like Ferman can finish everything in just one hour.

BUT: You'll need the following for dyno-tuning:

For older EFIs with distributor: A piggyback controller like an APEXi SAFC.

For newer EFIs with direct ignition: A piggyback controller like the Unichip, which can control ignition.

Dyno-tuning is not a band-aid for an improperly working engine... a simple tune-up and some work to fix whatever's causing it to run rich is a more cost-effective solution.

With an open-loop, I don't know if dyno-tuning will give the same resolution and smoothness as with an SGI kit (the SGI has its own computer, which varies fuel delivery based on RPM and stock injector cycles).

Thanks for the advice! Yung A/F nalang ang unahin ko i-solve. Read muna ako ng other posts uli.

[v22]

anybody here have flash lube installed in their system? Do those SGI systems automatically introduce gas from time to time to lube the valves?

[niky]

anybody here have flash lube installed in their system? Do those SGI systems automatically introduce gas from time to time to lube the valves?

Nope.

Note that flash lube is being sold both for LPG and for cars that require leaded gasoline. The last cars that actually required leaded gasoline to work properly were built between 1986 and 1988. Most post-1990 cars should run properly without additional valve lubrication.

You can start and stop your car on gasoline if it worries you. While some people overseas have had problems with valve seat recession, it's highly dependent on the vehicle. Most vehicles are supposed to have hardened valves nowadays, as a requirement for using unleaded gasoline (which is also bad for unhardened valves in older engines), and should suffer no problems with LPG.

That's should. Obviously, some people have had problems with LPG conversions, while others haven't. Most word-of-mouth problems I've found online are from people working with older kits on old-design engines or older engine designs. The big problem is, with LPG, you're running the car on a fuel it wasn't programmed for in the first place. LPG runs fine on the ignition timing used for gasoline, and LPG kits control their own fueling, but LPG burns leaner and hotter than gasoline.

Now running lean is not good for your engine. It's because you run lean that you run hot. If your kit is programmed or set up to run lean, then your engine will run hotter. If your engine runs hotter, things wear out quickly... like valve seats. This will happen whether you're running LPG, gasoline or alcohol.

The answer, obviously, is to not run hot. Use better coolant, synthetic oil, and colder spark plugs to bring temperatures down. If your engine is a newer one that can advance ignition to take advantage of the extra octane, that extra ignition advance will help the car run cooler. And make sure your installer knows what he's doing. If they make your kit run too lean just for that little bit of extra savings in fuel, that could be all she wrote for your engine.

If you're really worried about LPG's effects on your car in the long term, then get the more expensive SGI kits. With more precise fuel metering and the capability for fine-tuning, they should technically be better for your cylinder head than the Venturi kits. If that doesn't reassure you, then you might want to wait for the upcoming liquid injection kits, which should run exactly as well as gasoline... or most likely, better, since they have the same cooling charge as liquid gasoline, and the high-octane advantage of LPG.

[paolorenzo]

Ferman says any SGi kit can be tuned if the vendor is willing to lend him their laptop. If it's Greenfuel, no problem, Speedlab and Greenfuel are already partners.

Standard dyno-rates should apply. My car was a test-case to see if they could do it successfully. Speedlab charges about 4500-5000 pesos per hour for dyno-tuning. We can't say it'll have the same dramatic effect on all cars... but it's a good bet that your car will run about 5%-10% more powerful after tweaking, and any "flat-spots" caused by incompatibility between the kit and your car's stock ECU can be ironed out.

Of course, I don't know yet what the effect on fuel consumption is... usually, when we dyno-tune, adjusting fueling of the car on gasoline for maximum power makes it run leaner than stock (some stock cars run pig-rich), resulting in lower consumption. I don't know what Ferman had to do with the Lynx. I'm going to ask him later.

It's not necessary to have your kit dyno-tuned. But if you have hangups about poor power or want to ensure maximum reliability, this type of tuning can refine your SGI LPG map so that your car will run as smoothly as possible, with no dangerous lean spots or fuel-wasting rich spots.

Hi bigfootoz. PM'd you about the possibility of lending the EROOM ECU reader for a dyno-tuning session at Speedlab. ;)

[n5110]

Got mine converted at Greenfuel last thursday. emulator + toroidal tank. went there in the morning at natapos din kami ng mga 4pm. After mag initial filling ng 8 liters sa petron tune up naman. mabilis naman nakuha ang pag tune up. in terms of power tama naman at halos hinde ko mapansin ang pagkakaiba ng petrol and lpg, ang minor problem lang ngayon idling din, kasi nung fina fine tune nila yung kotse ko naka neutral lang + aircon. mukang dapat ata naka drive + aircon (EK matic) para ma compensate yung small power loss. overall i can say 90% satisfied with the conversion process at performance ng car on the initiall stage, kung maayos lang itong idling problem ko ayos na ayos na. ang ginagawa ko ngayon, off ang compressor pag nakatigil. will try to tweak the idling screw pag hinde pa rin umayos ang idling ko.

[Carlos Lasa Jr]

I would like to ask Ghosthunter about the performance of the Expedition (Gen 1) after LPG conversion. Is it possible to install SGI kit on a 2000 Expedition XLT Limited?

[ghosthunter]

I would like to ask Ghosthunter about the performance of the Expedition (Gen 1) after LPG conversion.

Well, The XP is really my brother's and the last time I drove it was when I was taking it from Greenfuel to my brother's place. Switching between petrol and lpg, I couldn't feel any difference. The only problem I found was the switch over itself, if I didn't hold the engine to a certain RPM, the engine stalls.

Is it possible to install SGI kit on a 2000 Expedition XLT Limited?

Possible. Best to call up your prefered LPG kit installer.

Personally, keeping an XP, even switching to LPG, isn't going to save you much money. Also the XP's air-ride suspension will one day fail (especially when you aren't running it often) and fixing it will cost you over P100K. So unless you really really really need an XP, it might be best to sell it off and replace it with a smaller vehicle and convert that to LPG.

[bigfootoz]

Good Day Sir GH and sa lahat ng mga brothers...

Sir juut liek to inform everybody that we can now successfully install MB124 untis. or the 230E, 260E Benz. Also with the close loop system.

Had already installed 2 units and is running well...

Thanks sa lahat...


COOLMATE CORPORATION
DENSO Service Center
EROOM LPG Conversion

3005 Vito Cruz Ext. cor. Kakarong St. Makati CIty
8959540 / 8956587 Email: eroomlpg*yahoo.com

[niky]

Just ask my wife. She can't tell at all when the car is on LPG or not. Not by sound, not by smell, not by the way it runs. An SGI system is completely transparent, completely odorless and completely invisible if you upgrade to a toroidal tank like I did. Just do it. Run it for two weeks. And then ask your wife... puwede ba, hon? If she says no, then drop the bomb on her that she's been riding in an LPG car all this time...

*BigMike: So there's a pre-determined "pulse" of gasoline every few minutes? Hmmm... is there a control in the computer to alter this? Ghosthunter and I were talking last night about enriching the charge with a bit of gasoline at over 6000 rpms to remove the power dip at 6500 rpm. If you remember the dyno, Mike, Ferman had it almost exactly the same as gasoline on LPG except at redline. Was thinking letting the gas injectors go on a crack at redline would cure this? (But it's not a big deal...)

[aamd]

Is there a way to monitor the performance of carburator venturi kit if it is running on lean or rich mixture?

As i understand, one way is to physically check the spark plug of the engine.

Is there another way?

[ghosthunter]

Is there a way to monitor the performance of carburator venturi kit if it is running on lean or rich mixture?

As i understand, one way is to physically check the spark plug of the engine.

Is there another way?

Well, there is the Oxygen sensor and meter retrofit. You can find these being sold on some online autoshops. $200+ prices though. If your car is alreadt equipped with an oxygen sensor, you can try looking for someone just selling the meter. I would advise you to get the self-heated oxygen sensor since still will give you a more stable reading. Single wire O2 sensors tend to jump around too much especially if the radiator fan blows air on it.

Or simply do the sniff test after you have warmed up your engine. If your engine is running correct, the exhaust should only smell lightly of LPG. If the scent is strong, you might need to clean the air filter or adjust the venturi system.