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  1. Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    392
    #71
    Quote Originally Posted by EQAddict View Post

    You guys should pester Honda for a test drive even if you dont intend to buy one to see what I mean. Better yet, ask a friend who has one to lend it to you. I guarantee that this CVT will amaze you.
    Better pester Honda, I will NEVER lend my friend the car.... Mamatay na lang sila sa inggit. Best of Both worlds nga eh.... byebye clutch...

  2. Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Posts
    22,710
    #72
    Quote Originally Posted by EQAddict View Post
    I agree with Niky 99% on this except the part of the CVT giving you less control.

    I've owned and driven manuals for many years (matanda na yata ako) and currently also have a 1.3 vios manual. Thru the years I've been lucky to sample many flavors of automatics from toyotas (Prado and old gen camry) to benz (I miss my AMG E50) to honda (Civic and Accord) and mitsu (Pajero gen 2.5, Turbo 2.0 Eclipse, VR Galant 2.5) .Ive also extensively used the 'manu-matics' or steptronics in the BMW E46 325, X3 , 530d and the Pajero 3rd gen.

    But, and I emphasize the word 'but' .... nothing I have driven or currently drive (even my 530d's 6-speed steptronic) can compare to the CVT of the Honda Jazz. It has 6 modes of operation and when you choose the 7-speed mode in Sport or Normal trim it gives you TOTAL control. You can hold the gear in the redline for as long as you want. If you're on a 70kmh curve and wanna keep it in 2nd all the way? No problem (and hear that nice aural vtec sound while you are at it). Stuck in traffic behind some guy you're racing and you can see the road opening up ahead soon and want to 'hold' it in 1st gear to keep the rev's high? No problem --- this is where the Jazz would kick the butt of a Swift and a Yaris automatic... they'd be on 2nd gear (the ECU would put it there to save gas) and would have to take time to kickdown when the road opens up while you are already at max torque / hp curve of your engine hehehehe.

    The CVT of the Honda Jazz owns! It shifts instantly and yes I mean instantly when you press the button--- absolutely no 2nd guessing you at all (unlike many steptronics which think for about a second to shift or sometimes dont even shift at all). It holds gears when you want to, has 6 modes so you can choose whatever you want whatever the situation. The only time it will not shift is if you want to downshift and the engine would've exceeded the redline parameters. Makes you drive like a king and protects you from destroying your engine at the same time. I love it! In fact, I thought the manual mode of the BMW 530d was absolute garbage compared to it. Really.

    You guys should pester Honda for a test drive even if you dont intend to buy one to see what I mean. Better yet, ask a friend who has one to lend it to you. I guarantee that this CVT will amaze you.

    Oh and about the manual... I drove the Vios to work the other day. Sakit ng paa ko. Kawawa pa sapatos ko. No chance to relax at all in traffic along Edsa.

    Oops. What I meant to say was less control than a manual.

    Yes, I've driven the CVT Jazz (and loved every minute of it), and yes, it gives you a lot of control that you don't get with an AT. It'll give you the same or better acceleration than a manual much of the time, but personally, it's still more of a filter between you and the road than a standard manual... it's not quite there for sports drivers, not yet. It smoothens out the torque a little too much, hurting outright pace (versus a manual)... that's if you're a good driver (I wish I was... ). For 99% of the time, the CVT gives you enough control... then you drive the new Civic's manual variant, and you're reminded how sweet a good stick can be. Can't wait till they put the six-speed stick (yes, six!) from the CR-V onto the Civic.

    But then, I've noted this with Honda's 5-speed AT on the Civic, too. Honda's semi-auto programming is less of an annoying nanny than most, and I highly recommend either the Civic 2.0 SL or the Jazz 1.5 CVT to local speed freaks who can't live with a stick yet still want to swap cogs by themselves.

    Me? Give me a stick, anytime. When DSG becomes affordable on small cars, then I'll switch...
    Last edited by niky; March 2nd, 2007 at 01:25 PM.

    Ang pagbalik ng comeback...

  3. #73
    alam ko BMW lang nagoofer ng DSG....

    how about those used in F1/WRC, semi-autos ba yun, how about ung "clutchless-manuals"

  4. Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Posts
    22,710
    #74
    BMW's semi-auto tranny is SMG.

    It's a clutch-type transmission with a robot doing the clutchwork for you. (Forgive me for any errors, this is from dim memory).

    DSG is Volkswagen-Audi's take. It's a robotic tranny that uses two clutches, with gears on two separate assemblies. You're in second gear, for example, and the other assembly, which has first and third, is free-wheeling. Select third and the other assembly engages while the first disengages. Theoretically, there is no limit to how fast this can shift. It's almost as efficient as a manual, it'll hold more power than Honda's CVTs, and it's still lighter than the heavier duty mechanical CVTs and torque-converter based stuff.

    Ang pagbalik ng comeback...

  5. #75
    hehehe, ako din nagkamali, pareho kasing may "MG",e....

  6. Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    2,326
    #76
    Quote Originally Posted by niky View Post
    Oops. What I meant to say was less control than a manual.

    Yes, I've driven the CVT Jazz (and loved every minute of it), and yes, it gives you a lot of control that you don't get with an AT. It'll give you the same or better acceleration than a manual much of the time, but personally, it's still more of a filter between you and the road than a standard manual... it's not quite there for sports drivers, not yet. It smoothens out the torque a little too much, hurting outright pace (versus a manual)... that's if you're a good driver (I wish I was... ). For 99% of the time, the CVT gives you enough control... then you drive the new Civic's manual variant, and you're reminded how sweet a good stick can be. Can't wait till they put the six-speed stick (yes, six!) from the CR-V onto the Civic.

    But then, I've noted this with Honda's 5-speed AT on the Civic, too. Honda's semi-auto programming is less of an annoying nanny than most, and I highly recommend either the Civic 2.0 SL or the Jazz 1.5 CVT to local speed freaks who can't live with a stick yet still want to swap cogs by themselves.

    Me? Give me a stick, anytime. When DSG becomes affordable on small cars, then I'll switch...
    6? I don't get why they keep adding gears when I was perfectly happy with 4 gears before -- faster acceleration and less shifting in city driving. Sure maybe more gears can give better performance and efficiency in highway driving, but we have much fewer highways here. And the highway roads in the provinces have trikes and kuliglig's and sugarcane trucks you have to slow down for!

    Baka conspiracy yan para ipa-shift lahat ng mundo sa at para mas malaki benta ng oil companies ah!

  7. Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Posts
    9
    #77
    for local units, get d matic
    for surplus units, get d manual

  8. Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Posts
    237
    #78
    For me, if you want to be practical go for the M/T... most of the time M/T cars cost less than their A/T counterparts and are usually cheaper to maintain...

    Pero ang pinaka bonus ng M/T is mas masarap pang harurot...

  9. Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Posts
    1,310
    #79
    Quote Originally Posted by pup2 View Post
    6? I don't get why they keep adding gears when I was perfectly happy with 4 gears before -- faster acceleration and less shifting in city driving. Sure maybe more gears can give better performance and efficiency in highway driving, but we have much fewer highways here. And the highway roads in the provinces have trikes and kuliglig's and sugarcane trucks you have to slow down for!

    Baka conspiracy yan para ipa-shift lahat ng mundo sa at para mas malaki benta ng oil companies ah!
    Huh? Number of gears don't have much to do with fuel consumption... heck, it can be argued that 5-speeds accelerate better and consume less fuel than 4-speeds (at the cost of extra work for the driver)!

    If car manufacturers wanted oil companies to sell more, they could just detune engines or make clutches slip all the time. No diesel engines or locking torque converters and all that stuff. If that was the idea, well, 5-speed trannies would just cost... way too much.

  10. Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Posts
    15
    #80
    IMO since you're planning to buy a second-hand car, the manual would be a more cost-effective choice since it would probably be cheaper in terms of maintenance compared to the matic.

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