Personally, di naman ako maiinggit sa Grandis when I'm driving a turbodiesel Innova... ...of course, I own neither, and I prefer a real sedan to a minivan that feels like one... hehehe... And, like I said, the Innova, while not completely car-like, drives tons better than older AUVs... almost car-like, and with only a minor penalty in ride-stiffness.

RE: Bench: Yeah, the bench would be more useful than captain's chairs, but it's nice to live a little.

RE: Fortuner: Innova = more value for money, and a better ride. The Fortuner's ultra-stiff anti-roll bars, tall ride height, and heavy tires translate to a ride that isn't as comfortable as the Innova's (strange that the Innova is the cheaper one)... Sure, there's more "dating" in the Fortuner, but the Innova is the more accomplished people mover, especially considering the Fortuner has no second row aircon and the lack of a step or rubber cladding on the rear bumper means loading cargo into the cargo bay of the Fortuner with the third seat raised is a pain.

Don't get me wrong, driving the Fortuner is pretty cool (it's fast and handles well for such a tall vehicle), but the Innova is painless to drive.

Still, if pogi-points are all that matter, Fortuner>Grandis>Innova... but practicality-wise, Innova over either.