2023 Toyota Innova (3rd Gen)

**17Sphynx17** · November 17th, 2022 02:09 PM

Originally Posted by ice15

agree... pero ano ba competition ng Corolla Cross/Altis Hybrid?

may iba pa bang sub-2M hybrid sedan (locally)?
sa Cross naman, mas mura yung Kicks, pero its also smaller -> we test drove both cars and mas maganda feel ng Cross over the Kicks... swerte ko lang di pa kailangan ni misis ng car, so we can wait and hopefully the Cross gets a 360 camera and a normal handbrake.

pansin ko this year. yung "rumored price" is actually true. I think even at a 500K premium... mas madaming bibili ng Innova over the Okavango.

Clarification for the Cross. It states in Wikipedia that the 1.8 Corolla Cross has a 6.5Ah NiMH (hindi din pala Li-ion). The hybrid system it does not state the voltage but I am assuming 400v right?

6.5 ampere hours x 400volts is 2.6 kWh? if it is 220Volts, then 1.43kWh? What voltage should be used?

In the reverse, the Kicks has a 2.06 kWh Li-ion Pack divide by 400volts is 5.5 Ah, if divide by 220volts it is 9.36Ah. Not sure which conversion to use to compare the two.

So for discussion sake, size of pack is similar but Toyota is using NiMH which is "cheaper" to produce (supposedly).

For competition of the Corolla Cross, the model that comes to mind was the Azkarra, but I just rechecked now, tumaas na pala price by around 200k php, asa 1.788m php na din price niya so, I can't say na mas "price competitive" yung Azkarra with the features. Formerly it was positioned at 1.5+mphp, and may discount pa na 100k php dati sa alala ko when we asked. Though mild hybrid lang din siya like the Okavango as far as I am aware. Kaya apples to oranges. hehe!

For Altis, I could make the case that Altis Hybrid should be priced closer to the Kicks, even pre-pandemic it should have already cost around that figure. Kahit TOTL Altis Hybrid price of Kicks TOTL, because subcompact SUV hybrid could equate to a Compact Sedan Hybrid, but the Altis costs about 100k php more when it launched in 2019 if you compare it to present price of Kicks TOTL (barring any increases). With kicks Mid trim for a possible equivalent to Altis Hybrid that isn't TOTL, it still costs (1.595mphp vs 1.309mphp) +/-286k php more than the Kicks which doesn't make more sense.

**ice15** · November 17th, 2022 02:51 PM

Originally Posted by 17Sphynx17

Clarification for the Cross. It states in Wikipedia that the 1.8 Corolla Cross has a 6.5Ah NiMH (hindi din pala Li-ion). The hybrid system it does not state the voltage but I am assuming 400v right?

6.5 ampere hours x 400volts is 2.6 kWh? if it is 220Volts, then 1.43kWh? What voltage should be used?

In the reverse, the Kicks has a 2.06 kWh Li-ion Pack divide by 400volts is 5.5 Ah, if divide by 220volts it is 9.36Ah. Not sure which conversion to use to compare the two.

So for discussion sake, size of pack is similar but Toyota is using NiMH which is "cheaper" to produce (supposedly).

For competition of the Corolla Cross, the model that comes to mind was the Azkarra, but I just rechecked now, tumaas na pala price by around 200k php, asa 1.788m php na din price niya so, I can't say na mas "price competitive" yung Azkarra with the features. Formerly it was positioned at 1.5+mphp, and may discount pa na 100k php dati sa alala ko when we asked. Though mild hybrid lang din siya like the Okavango as far as I am aware. Kaya apples to oranges. hehe!

For Altis, I could make the case that Altis Hybrid should be priced closer to the Kicks, even pre-pandemic it should have already cost around that figure. Kahit TOTL Altis Hybrid price of Kicks TOTL, because subcompact SUV hybrid could equate to a Compact Sedan Hybrid, but the Altis costs about 100k php more when it launched in 2019 if you compare it to present price of Kicks TOTL (barring any increases). With kicks Mid trim for a possible equivalent to Altis Hybrid that isn't TOTL, it still costs (1.595mphp vs 1.309mphp) +/-286k php more than the Kicks which doesn't make more sense.

Kicks is technically a Crossover... so unfair to compare it with the Altis.

kaya again... walang direct competitor si Innova (especially if its a full hybrid)
(kahit naman 1st & 2nd Gen Innova, walang direct competitor sa market)

**ice15** · November 17th, 2022 03:07 PM

2023 Toyota Innova: First pics of PH's best-selling MPV leaked online | Autoindustriya

**bxr monkey** · November 17th, 2022 05:29 PM

Originally Posted by ice15

2023 Toyota Innova: First pics of PH's best-selling MPV leaked online | Autoindustriya

Parang hindi match iyong interior dashboard image. May triangle window?

Sa exterior image, walang triangle window sa A pillar?

**thearsenal1205** · November 17th, 2022 07:23 PM

Render pa lang siguro ito ng isang Indonesian site. Not yet official from Toyota.

Sent from my SM-S901E using Tsikot Forums mobile app

**17Sphynx17** · November 17th, 2022 08:06 PM

Originally Posted by ice15

Kicks is technically a Crossover... so unfair to compare it with the Altis.

kaya again... walang direct competitor si Innova (especially if its a full hybrid)
(kahit naman 1st & 2nd Gen Innova, walang direct competitor sa market)

For the Innova mainly no contest.

But in the past, the only other models that were at least AUV at the time innova first gen sold was Mitsubishi Adventure and the Isuzu Crosswind, both of which I recall were put to pasture at the end of Innova 2nd gen lifetime (if I am not mistaken). For the gas model, while the Innova was still being sold with that option, similar pricepoint was also Mitsubishi Grandis I think (tama ba pangalan) and Nissan Serena but both of them could not compete as they did not have any diesel option.

Currently, only the Okavango seems to be duking it out with the Innova, but they could only "dent" it, not by much though through sheer marketshare of the Innova for its class/pricepoint. hehe!

I am honestly waiting for what this new gen Innova "will be" and price point.

Still can't believe an Innova E MT now starts at 1.3m php. When the first gen launched, less than 900k php back in 2005. But based on an Inflation Calculator,

Philippine Inflation Calculator – CreatifWerks

"₱ 865,000.00 back in 2005 is worth Purchasing Power Value of ₱ 1,618,947.96 in 2021" So I'm guessing the 1.3m php is a bargain =)

**bxr monkey** · November 17th, 2022 08:26 PM

Originally Posted by thearsenal1205

Render pa lang siguro ito ng isang Indonesian site. Not yet official from Toyota.

Ah okay. Hindi pala official image.
Sa teaser video, mukhang may triangle window pa din, mala MPV profile sa A pillar.

**thearsenal1205** · November 17th, 2022 09:25 PM

Originally Posted by 17Sphynx17

For the Innova mainly no contest.

But in the past, the only other models that were at least AUV at the time innova first gen sold was Mitsubishi Adventure and the Isuzu Crosswind, both of which I recall were put to pasture at the end of Innova 2nd gen lifetime (if I am not mistaken). For the gas model, while the Innova was still being sold with that option, similar pricepoint was also Mitsubishi Grandis I think (tama ba pangalan) and Nissan Serena but both of them could not compete as they did not have any diesel option.

Currently, only the Okavango seems to be duking it out with the Innova, but they could only "dent" it, not by much though through sheer marketshare of the Innova for its class/pricepoint. hehe!

I am honestly waiting for what this new gen Innova "will be" and price point.

Still can't believe an Innova E MT now starts at 1.3m php. When the first gen launched, less than 900k php back in 2005. But based on an Inflation Calculator,

Philippine Inflation Calculator – CreatifWerks

"₱ 865,000.00 back in 2005 is worth Purchasing Power Value of ₱ 1,618,947.96 in 2021" So I'm guessing the 1.3m php is a bargain =)

Don't forget the Mitsubishi Fuzion, also cross between SUV and MPV didn't compete the Innova because of no diesel option.

Sent from my SM-S901E using Tsikot Forums mobile app

**yapoy86** · November 17th, 2022 10:00 PM

Di masyado sumikat yan fusion.. during that period mga mpv medyo di patok sa pinoy.. like carens and livina.. mas gusto yung innova, adventure at crosswind..

Pero now, xpander, brv, ertiga.. gas pa lahat yan

**ice15** · November 18th, 2022 09:18 AM

Originally Posted by yapoy86

Di masyado sumikat yan fusion.. during that period mga mpv medyo di patok sa pinoy.. like carens and livina.. mas gusto yung innova, adventure at crosswind..

Pero now, xpander, brv, ertiga.. gas pa lahat yan

yup. other than the Innova, gas na lahat ng MPV sa market natin. kaya sabi ko walang kalaban ang Innova presently.

pero if the next gen is a full hybrid, malamang di na hahanapin yung diesel version. and ano naman magagawa ng buyer kung wala na talaga yung option?