Protest against Petroleum Companies

[True Faith]

so does it mean na hindi ito applied sa pag rollback?

It seems selective, and it does not apply to roll backs...

[[archie]]

Honestly, I find ULS explanation a mystery.....

its not a mystery para sakin... kaya lang nagiging mystery siguro kasi he expounds on the REAL variables.

so does it mean na hindi ito applied sa pag rollback?

of course applied yan, the real effect would been seen after 2-3 months. if the current prices stabilize at the current $65... continuous rollback until wala na deficit. kaso masyado volatile market ngayon mahirap rollback ng malaki when OPEC plans to decrease supply, speculators are rising the prices, etc.

parang ganto lang yan... example, (all variables neglected) last month, binili nila yung current oil nila at $147 per barrel, tapos na biglang baba yung prices of crude oil na nabili nila for the next delivery to a low of $65... bababa ng bababa yung prices as the expensive oil depletes... hindi pwede isang bagsakan kasi every time na bibili sila ng oil magiging volatile din prices... kung nagpeak at $147 per barrel then apply natin biglang bagsak o taas eeeeehhhh baka sabihin niyo sobra naman sila. malalmang nasa 70/liter pa rin tayo hangang maubos yung expensive oil.

[Eismann]

:pope: bless these oil companies if they will heed the public protests.
The protest should result to something like a big rollback, right?

[scharnhorst]

I might get flamed for these statements, but here goes.

The oil industry is far, far from an ideal market economy which follows the laws of supply and demand, due to the presence of oligopolies and monopolies who can dictate prices at their whims and greed.

The thing is, we, the workforce/consumers, have little say in the price of commodities, even if we are the reason that keeps the market rolling. Especially in the Philippines! Protesting here - which should be a basic right of citizens - is frowned upon, and ruthlessly put down by the state, which is nothing more than a lapdog to people with power, money, and influence.

This is the same state that is convinced that siomai and siopao production at a certain chinese restaurant is an industry INDISPENSIBLE to the state, that it is a matter of NATIONAL ECONOMIC SECURITY... by issuing an assumption for jurisdiction for this certain restaurant's owner, against its protesting multi-decade-serving, and underpaid workers.

Hay. Welcome to the Philippines.

If these transport groups really want to put pressure on the state - maybe enough for it to intervene - they should ALL go on strike, for MULTIPLE days, and not just one or two transport groups, going on strike for half day.

Everybody is going to suffer. Even the private car owners might want to add toppings to the cake by not going out on those couple of days. Para sigurong puro laban ni manny pacquiao sa mga araw na yon - walang kakotse kotse sa mga kalsada.

The problem with this kind of action is that, most likely the state will just respond with lethal force, and that the drivers/workers don't have the will to carry on such a plan - their main concern is food on the table, not knowing that some sacrifice is truly needed for measurable gains.

Right now, we simply have to face a fact that we live in a corrupt, base, and generally hopeless society.

[[archie]]

:pope: bless these oil companies if they will heed the public protests.
The protest should result to something like a big rollback, right?

no question that companies WILL rollback.. the only question now is the rollback everyone is wanting, realistic????

[[archie]]

I might get flamed for these statements, but here goes.

The oil industry is far, far from an ideal market economy which follows the laws of supply and demand, due to the presence of oligopolies and monopolies who can dictate prices at their whims and greed.

The thing is, we, the workforce/consumers, have little say in the price of commodities, even if we are the reason that keeps the market rolling. Especially in the Philippines! Protesting here - which should be a basic right of citizens - is frowned upon, and ruthlessly put down by the state, which is nothing more than a lapdog to people with power, money, and influence.

This is the same state that is convinced that siomai and siopao production at a certain chinese restaurant is an industry INDISPENSIBLE to the state, that it is a matter of NATIONAL ECONOMIC SECURITY... by issuing an assumption for jurisdiction for this certain restaurant's owner, against its protesting multi-decade-serving, and underpaid workers.

Hay. Welcome to the Philippines.

If these transport groups really want to put pressure on the state - maybe enough for it to intervene - they should ALL go on strike, for MULTIPLE days, and not just one or two transport groups, going on strike for half day.

Everybody is going to suffer. Even the private car owners might want to add toppings to the cake by not going out on those couple of days. Para sigurong puro laban ni manny pacquiao sa mga araw na yon - walang kakotse kotse sa mga kalsada.

The problem with this kind of action is that, most likely the state will just respond with lethal force, and that the drivers/workers don't have the will to carry on such a plan - their main concern is food on the table, not knowing that some sacrifice is truly needed for measurable gains.

Right now, we simply have to face a fact that we live in a corrupt, base, and generally hopeless society.

if the strike and private owners did stop for some days... then the country will loose millions or maybe billions of pesos and investors would be thrown off. hence, the country will be in deeper s*it. thats the problem of pinoys, we do not consider holistic concept, rather see it as a single economic function, their families... never mind if the Philippines will go down into flames because of my actions, as long as i can feed my family. stick it to the man!

[uls]

ulit:

May produkto ka binebenta... ang puhunan mo P100

Bago maubos ang paninda mo, nag order ka uli sa supplier

pero nagtaas na ng presyo ang supplier mo... P120 na.

so ano gagawin mo?

hindi mo ba tataasan ang presyo ng lumang paninda mo?

Para maka bawi dun sa magiging mas mataas na puhunan?

---

rollback:

so right now, ang produkto na binebenta mo ay ung P120 ang puhunan

nag order ka uli sa supplier...

bumaba ang presyo... P90 nalang

pero ang binebenta mo ngaun P120 ang puhunan...

irorollback mo ba agad?

hinde.

uubusin mo muna...

then pag dating ng produkto na P90 ang puhunan, dun ka na mag rollback.

---

ewan ko lang kung kulang pa sa linaw yan.

pero i'll be expecting sasabihin nila walang kwenta ang na-post ko.

[scharnhorst]

What uls is saying is quite logical, actually... pero mukha kasing hindi yan ang nangyayari sa pilipinas.

anyway, everybody has their opinions, sana wag nalang tayong magkapikunan

[uls]

explanation ko lang po yan sa tanong na:

Baket pag nagtaas ang presyo sa world market, nagtataas agad ng pump prices,

Pagbaba naman ng presyo sa world market, di naman binababa agad ang pump prices.

[mazdamazda]

imho admittedly, the cost of fuel per liter is not commensurate with the price of oil in the world market.

admittedly too, that the industry is deregulated. no one can dicate them to lower down their prices.

what i think the best thing to be done is for the independent and small players to have them lowered based on the price of crude in the world market, and the motorists should just go there. that is the price and advantage of free market. kaya lang, based on what i've been currently seeing, hindi din ganung ka willing ang small players to push through with the big rollback. i guess its just business.

This is what a lot of people do not understand.

With a little bit of knowledge they try to stretch the truth to justify their so-called protests.

These so-called transport groups should be doing the following concrete actions instead of their all-talk-no-action charade:

Organize the deployment of public jeepneys and buses so that every trip is maximized. Give every driver a rotating schedule on when to ply his route... instead of leaving dozens of drivers the said choice of when they should ply the route.

That will mean less trip and expense per PUV but it will still give them the same amount of income.

===

Minimize the amount of waiting time of PUVs, they protest that diesel price is high but they are wasting a lot of fuel just idling and waiting for passengers.

[Eismann]

And causing traffic while they clog the "kanto" waiting for passengers.
A wasteful cycle fo all.

[jpdm]

the poor WILL become POORER if there is no progress sa country...

would you like to lose your job kasi bagsak lalo economy dahil sa stop of transport due to strike and investors flee the country?

the Philippines economy is fueled by foreign investors... pag nawalan ng gana yan... ubos ang trabaho sa pinas. well hindi naman ubos pero 10X worst ng unemployement ngayon for sure... baka worst pa.

Kaya bagsak ang ekonomiya dahil mahal ang gas at langis ng mga oil companies..dahil sa kanila.....

...mahal ang pamasahe...

...kasi mahal ang krudo...

...mahal ang delivery...

...kaya mahal lahat ng commodity...

dahil sa mahal lahat dahil sa mahal na langis sa bansa...

...bagsak ang real wage ng tao...

...hindi naman puedeng itaas ang nominal wage...

...kasi it will fuel inflation....

...lalo ng magmamahal lahat...

...mahina ang purchasing power...

...Kaya tandaan...

...Consumption-led ang GNI or GDP growth ng pinas...

...kaya kahit anong manipulation ng data ng gobyerno natin sa growth rate sumama ang ekonomiya dahil sa pagtaas ng costs ng lahat dahil sa high oil prices...

ngayon..

...kung ibaba ang presyo ng langis...

...ayon sa computation ng NEDA...

...Diyos ko mahabagin....

...panigurado..

....napakaraming sasaya...

...at indi yung oil companies lang at mga kaibigan nilang "cold blooded profit oriented capitalists na may pagka Social Evolutionist (i.e. Darwinian) at Charles Darwin fans"


.

[actor21]

hmmm...no wonder some posters act negatively against your posts..because you are also guilty of doing what you are saying...


I also dont understand why you and niky are zeroing on JPDM

Whereas, he is not the only one denouncing the oil companies...




I thought you said this is a useless thread, why explain your side of the story...

Kaya bagsak ang ekonomiya dahil mahal ang gas at langis ng mga oil companies..dahil sa kanila.....

...mahal ang pamasahe...

...kasi mahal ang krudo...

...mahal ang delivery...

...kaya mahal lahat ng commodity...

dahil sa mahal lahat dahil sa mahal na langis sa bansa...

...bagsak ang real wage ng tao...

...hindi naman puedeng itaas ang nominal wage...

...kasi it will fuel inflation....

...lalo ng magmamahal lahat...

...mahina ang purchasing power...

...sa tandaan...

...consumption-led ang GNI or GDP growth ng pinas...

...kaya kahit anong manipulation ng data ng gobyerno natin sa growth rate sumama ang ekonomiya dahil sa pagtaas ng costs ng ahat dahil sa high oil prices...

ngayon..

...kung ibaba ang presyo ng langis...

...ayon sa computation ng NEDA...

...Diyos ko mahabagin....

...panigurado..

....napakaraming sasaya...

...at indi yung oil companies lang at mga kaibigan nilang "cold blooded profit oriented capitalists na may pagka Social Evolutionist (i.e. Darwinian) at Charles Darwin fan"


.

ang punot dulo kase ng usaping ito ay:

hindi tama ang presyo ng langis sa atin or hindi makatarungan as against sa price sa world market..yun lang naman yun e..mahirap ba intindihin na maraming nahihirapan dahil sa kaganiran ng ilan?

[budo]

This is what this useless thread is all about. You complain about this and that...but fuel prices are going down, though not at the rate most of us like. Its harder for big oil to bring prices down since they bought it at higher prices, and their distributors must also make a marginal profit. They have something called an inventory afterall. Instead of squeeling on something you don't have any control on or challenging other posters to a word war...go get a life!

You're quite out of line bro.. It's not right to brand and judge those who feel strongly against these oil companies as being lifeless and ...

They may not always be right but so are the others here. The thing is, they are advocating something which I myself find to be worth pursuing. They didn't go here to challenge people to a debate and a fistfight.

Marginal profit? Yeah right tell that to the marines!

[budo]

This is what a lot of people do not understand.

With a little bit of knowledge they try to stretch the truth to justify their so-called protests.

These so-called transport groups should be doing the following concrete actions instead of their all-talk-no-action charade:

Organize the deployment of public jeepneys and buses so that every trip is maximized. Give every driver a rotating schedule on when to ply his route... instead of leaving dozens of drivers the said choice of when they should ply the route.

That will mean less trip and expense per PUV but it will still give them the same amount of income.

===

Minimize the amount of waiting time of PUVs, they protest that diesel price is high but they are wasting a lot of fuel just idling and waiting for passengers.

Ideally, yes they should be thinking beyond their usual street actions but this is better said than done. We can't even discipline these PUV drivers on the streets- how much more on forcing them to adhere to a scheme such as this?

Mga bus drivers nga sa Edsa nagkakarerahan pa rin kahit na may nangyari ng aksidente. The point is, it is the right of these PUVs drivers and operators to cry out their disdain for these oil companies but they should also see to it that they find other innovative ways to address this issue.

[jpdm]

wag ka mag alala tol, hindi tayo patatalo sa kanila basta nasa tama lang tayo...maski tawagin pa nila ng kung ano ano ang buong angkan ko..di ako titigil kaka tuligsa sa mga ganid na Big three Nuthuggers

Agree here.

Anyway,

in the news transport group just staged a rally against the oil companies for not lowering their gas prices..

I hope more will come to pressure the government if not the oil companies to lower down their prices...

__________________________________________

Roll back!Rollback!

[scharnhorst]

Ideally, shouldn't there be a significant delay between the rise of refined products and the price of crude oil? Since there's still the inventory bought at a lower price. So there should be a delay in price lowering, also -that's understood.

But the real trend with local prices is that the increase in the petroleum products coincide with the world crude oil price. Ano yun? Biglang nagmahal yung value nung inventory nila na nakuha nila na mas mura?

Kind of wrong, isn't it?

Then again, FVR left the government toothless against this.

By the way, Royal Dutch Shell posted record high profits during this time of financial crisis. I hope they do some CSR for the world and stop this state of artificial shortage.

the Philippines economy is fueled by foreign investors... pag nawalan ng gana yan... ubos ang trabaho sa pinas. well hindi naman ubos pero 10X worst ng unemployement ngayon for sure... baka worst pa.

And this is why few have the will to do actions to upset the status quo. Because we did not develop our own industries - that we became so reliant on others - means that this country is ever at a choke hold by oppressive foreign forces.

Quite a sad fact, really.

Now imagine, if the Filipino people did dare. I wonder.

[[archie]]

Kaya bagsak ang ekonomiya dahil mahal ang gas at langis ng mga oil companies..dahil sa kanila.....

...mahal ang pamasahe...

...kasi mahal ang krudo...

...mahal ang delivery...

...kaya mahal lahat ng commodity...

dahil sa mahal lahat dahil sa mahal na langis sa bansa...

...bagsak ang real wage ng tao...

...hindi naman puedeng itaas ang nominal wage...

...kasi it will fuel inflation....

...lalo ng magmamahal lahat...

...mahina ang purchasing power...

...Kaya tandaan...

...Consumption-led ang GNI or GDP growth ng pinas...

...kaya kahit anong manipulation ng data ng gobyerno natin sa growth rate sumama ang ekonomiya dahil sa pagtaas ng costs ng lahat dahil sa high oil prices...

ngayon..

...kung ibaba ang presyo ng langis...

...ayon sa computation ng NEDA...

...Diyos ko mahabagin....

...panigurado..

....napakaraming sasaya...

...at indi yung oil companies lang at mga kaibigan nilang "cold blooded profit oriented capitalists na may pagka Social Evolutionist (i.e. Darwinian) at Charles Darwin fans"
.

talaga naman real and not the nominal ang batayan di ba?

as ive said, oo gaganda talaga economy kung bumaba ang cost of fuel pero kung hindi nga kaya ng oil companies... hindi talaga papayag yan. yung mga small players di ba konte lang binaba nila? 2 pesos max... wala na marketing and high maintenance of gas stations yun.

yung mga computations niyan malamang hindi consider variables that will come into play like current at hand crude oil price when they got it months ago. assumptive lang ng NEDA IF they are computed at $70 per barrel... paano yung totoong cost?

And this is why few have the will to do actions to upset the status quo. Because we did not develop our own industries - that we became so reliant on others - means that this country is ever at a choke hold by oppressive foreign forces.

Quite a sad fact, really.

Now imagine, if the Filipino people did dare. I wonder.

di ba petron gawang pinoy? ano nangayari???

[uls]

Ideally, shouldn't there be a significant delay between the rise of refined products and the price of crude oil? Since there's still the inventory bought at a lower price. So there should be a delay in price lowering, also -that's understood.

But the real trend with local prices is that the increase in the petroleum products coincide with the world crude oil price. Ano yun? Biglang nagmahal yung value nung inventory nila na nakuha nila na mas mura?

Kind of wrong, isn't it?

again again again...

This time, i use CELLPHONE as example

PRICE HIKE:

Nagbebenta ka ng cellphone.

puhunan mo P5,000, binebenta mo ng P6,000

you have 5 pcs. in stock.

you were able to sell 3.

You call up your supplier and order 5 more.

But supplier said he is now selling at P5,500 each.

what do you do?

A) Continue selling you old stock at P6,000, eventhough you have to pay P5,500 for the new stock?

OR

B) Raise the selling price of your old stock to P6,500. so you can maintain your profit margin when you pay for the new stock.

---

ROLLBACK:

Old stock P5,500 puhunan, selling at P6,500.

New stock P5,000 nalang ang puhunan.

Ano gagawin mo?

A) I-roll back agad to P6,000 ang old stock kahit P5,500 ang puhunan?

OR

B) Di muna rollback. Ubusin muna ang old stock at P6,500. pag dating ng new stock then sell at P6,000.


malinaw ba? O walang kwenta parin explanation ko?

[CoDer]

Old stock... Hindi ata uso yan nung uptrend ang presyo ng langis?