UP and the SUCs: Anti-Poor???

[jpdm]

I hope this is remedied by the government....UP-the best university in the country, should serve both rich and poor, deserving and qualified students....

Manila Standard
August 2-3, 2008

UP failing to serve poor students, study says By Roderick T. dela Cruz


STATE colleges and universities led by the University of the Philippines are not serving poor students as they are mandated to do, according to a study commissioned by the Asian Development Bank.
“Philippine education is in a deep crisis and sees little hope of recovery unless drastic reforms beginning with higher education are immediately implemented,” the report says.
The report is part of the bank’s technical assistance to the Education Department, and it found “a disproportionately small number of poor students in the state universities and colleges,” or a mere 6.7 percent of the student population.
It says one reason is that poverty prevents poor students from properly preparing for a college education, and the result is that many of them flunk the entrance tests given by state colleges and universities.
“The poor are discriminated more seriously in the better quality prestigious state universities and colleges like the University of the Philippines Diliman, for they do not possess competitive college preparatory education,” the study says.
It says the high and persistent incidence of poverty and income inequality also leads to inequality in education, as the poor appear less able to compete with their richer counterparts in state universities and colleges that have restricted admission.
Basic education has its own problems, the report says, noting that student performance is only about 50 percent in the national achievement tests for elementary and high schools, and in the international mathematics and science tests for 13-year-old students.
At the college level, the passing rate in the various professional board examinations except for medicine is below 50 percent.
“There is also evidence that majority of schools at all levels operate inefficiently,” the study says.
Resources in the public school system are concentrated in personnel inputs—representing 90 percent of the total—while financial support for learning materials makes up just 1 percent.
And as a result of poor education and training in high school and even in college, many graduates end up without jobs.
“The unemployment rate among the high school and college educated has persisted over the last two decades at 9 percent or more,” the study says.
“This is the gridlock of Philippine education.”
The report partly traces the problem to the government’s education policy, particularly that relating to higher education.
“Much of the problem is rooted in finance, especially the financial management of state universities and colleges,” the study says.
“Revolutionary reforms in the state universities and colleges’ finance would be required for dismantling the gridlock.”

[A121]

UP and the other SUCs are not anti-poor. Basic education is the problem that should be addressed soon. Students should be equipped with the necessary tools to enter these colleges. These universities can not lower their standards to accommodate more students.

[jpdm]

Im quite curious as to how Asian Development Bank (ADB) arrived at this conclusion especially about UP Diliman not serving the poor...

[empy]

basically the ADB is saying that poor students dont get the higher quality high school and college prep education than wealthier students, so the deck is stacked against them when it comes to entrance exams.

but why then do they say that UP "discriminates against poor students"? they don't have any different standards!!!! :screwloose: it's the function of the student's family income that they can't get the pre-college education they need - so go lay the blame on socioeconomic inequality or the public school system or something.

what i think ADB really means is "UP should discriminate against wealthier students by creating a different admission standard for them and poorer students"

[empy]

dubul pust...!!

[nicolodeon]

poverty and intelligence dont mix.

if people are intelligent but poor, most of them symphatize with their own. maybe that's why we have a new UP now. they want to end the endless cycle of bright students turning activists/complainers.

nasasayang ba talino

I smell an old blue....

[uls]

rich kids get into UP coz they had better pre-school, elementary, and high school education than poor kids.

It's not UP's fault if the poor kids can't pass UP's entrance exams.

[fourtheboys96]

UP and the other SUCs are not anti-poor. Basic education is the problem that should be addressed soon. Students should be equipped with the necessary tools to enter these colleges. These universities can not lower their standards to accommodate more students.

very true especially for UP. if ur poor but is not up to academic standards, then sorry for you. but FYI, UP has alotted a certain percentage of slots for students in the provinces.

Im quite curious as to how Asian Development Bank (ADB) arrived at this conclusion especially about UP Diliman not serving the poor...

it's not ADB who made this conclusion. its the writer / news paper so that they can sell the story. i'm surprised the article is not from inquirer.

[Galactus]

^^^ It's not the writer/newspaper who made the conclusion. As stated clearly in the original article, the conclusion was arrived at by a study commissioned by the ADB, which doesn't necessarily bind the ADB to its findings. The reporter, (naturally) merely reported the findings, and did not make his own conclusion

Medyo hilaw yung report. The author/proponent of the study was not named, and hindi rin stated yung objective/s.

One of the goals of UP is to get the best and the brightest students, regardless of their social and economic standing. During my time, marami din akong naging classmate na sobrang talino, kahit laking probinsiya at may kahirapan sa buhay. Poverty should never be a hindrance. Accepting a student just because he's poor (eventhough academically deficient) is a form of reverse discrimination.

[Galactus]

Sowee, double post!

[jpdm]

I think UP should remain true to its commitment of admitting the best and the brightest Pinoys, rich or poor....

....of course the state should provide more support to the poor.....The rich can afford Ateneo and La Salle--among the best schools in the country....(with UST of course!)

[CVT]

I agree that the State University should strictly adhere to its academic standards, irregardless of the social standing/status of its students. The challenge of bringing up the standard of education should be passed on to the public high schools to be able to cope up with the ever-changing landscape of education, for us to be globally competitive....

6505:Bath:

[Galactus]

^^^ Fee fi fo fum, I smell the stink of OB logic...

[Dr.Kamiya]

So now it's the university's fault for poor people being stupid?

I'd blame it more on the lower-level public school system. It's their responsibility to churn out students smart enough to pass the entrance exams.

[nicolodeon]

TE=Dr.Kamiya;1111490]So now it's the university's fault for poor people being stupid? .

[SIZE="3"]Guys, please avoid generalization.[/SIZE]

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Not all poor people are stupid. In the same manner, not all rich people are bright/intelligent.

[mazdamazda]

The news article is very poorly written and can become confusing, this goes the same for the title of this thread... hence, the reader sometimes jumps to a wrong conclusion based on the limited facts presented.

Basically, what ADB is saying is that poor students are less competitive than their rich counterparts... in effect less of them are able to gain entrance to state universities and colleges. But they blame it on the fiscal position of the SUCs - WTF?

From what I've seen, it is the students themselves (regardless if they are rich or poor) that have no drive to study harder or excel in what they are doing. A lot of them are wasting their time and effort on such mundane things. Though collaborating with the story, this is more persistent in non-science public schools.

[jpdm]

The news article is very poorly written and can become confusing, this goes the same for the title of this thread... hence, the reader sometimes jumps to a wrong conclusion based on the limited facts presented..

This is the problem. You made poor and erroneous conclusions. And you keep on jumping on wrong conclusions based on limited facts that you present.

I suggest read the article and thread carefully and stop making poor generalizations.

Basically, what ADB is saying is that poor students are less competitive than their rich counterparts... in effect less of them are able to gain entrance to state universities and colleges. But they blame it on the fiscal position of the SUCs - WTF?

From what I've seen, it is the students themselves (regardless if they are rich or poor) that have no drive to study harder or excel in what they are doing. A lot of them are wasting their time and effort on such mundane things. Though collaborating with the story, this is more persistent in non-science public schools

This is a hasty generalization....you are trivializing the problem....

[wahaha318]

Very interesting article and conversations… I don’t think UP is anti-poor… They’re just not pro-poor… It’s not always going to be black and white for these types of topics. Again, very interesting.

[niky]

It's not just the students... it's also the schools. I taught for a year at a public school... and the number of students passed up to Grade Six who are nearly illiterate is disheartening. The quality of our basic public education is pure crap. We have good teachers here and there, but with not enough resources in the schools and no home support for the children, who often have to change out of their uniforms and into rags to go back out onto the streets to beg or peddle because their parents are underemployed, how the heck are these kids going to get to college?

But Mazdamazda is right... the article and the study come to a conclusion at a complete 90-degrees to the study findings itself:

“The unemployment rate among the high school and college educated has persisted over the last two decades at 9 percent or more,” the study says.
“This is the gridlock of Philippine education.”
The report partly traces the problem to the government’s education policy, particularly that relating to higher education.“Much of the problem is rooted in finance, especially the financial management of state universities and colleges,” the study says.
“Revolutionary reforms in the state universities and colleges’ finance would be required for dismantling the gridlock.”

Where in the study does it show that that 9 percent unemployment is the fault of state universities? Do they have supporting data showing that all of those students are from state schools? I can tell you right now... they're not. Some of those, unfortunately, are from our own (private) school.

Those of us in the education business can already tell you some of the reasons for unemployment.

There is a grave mismatch between graduates produced and jobs available. With many small jobs and part-time jobs requiring applicants to be college students or to have a college degree, students are needlessly filtered into college courses even if their aptitudes make them fit for technical courses (under TESDA) which give useful employment opportunities.

Students also often go for the "course of the hour". For the past few years, this has been nursing. With the lack of teeth and budget for the CHED in its ability to police "diploma mills", the reactions of the regulatory bodies overseas to poor student quality, making them discriminate against Filipino students in general, and the increasing number of requirements foisted upon these students by the government (pay 100$ for this, 100$ for that... oh... and you have do this and this and this...), it's much harder for these students to go abroad... thus, thousands upon thousands of graduates with no place to go.

Pulling one statistic out of the air and blaming it all on the fiscal policy of state schools does not compute.

Now... I'm not going to defend UP's fiscal policy as solid. Hell... no government-run system has a good balance sheet... anywhere in the world... but what does UP's fiscal status have to do with the fitness of graduates?

UP graduates have a good employment rate... when the graduates themselves show the drive to achieve. And UP itself is not anti-poor. I have many classmates who came from poverty and low-income families who were supported by UP STFAP system for the four or five years they were in college. This system allowed them to finish, find good jobs, and move up from low-income to lower-middle class status. If that's not serving the poor, I don't know what is.

But the big problem is: UP needs to maintain its status as a premiere university. Which means it needs to be strict in terms of the quality of students it accepts. This doesn't prevent lazy students from getting in, but those students get themselves kicked out in due time. But this does prevent students with poor high school education from getting in... but is this UP's fault?

Why don't we ask the government about the DECS budget... which perennially falls short of meeting the needs of students. Or the budget that Congress refuses to give to UP, which could support more poor students (with less Congressional subsidy, UP must now charge over 1000 pesos a unit). Or we can ask the UP activists, who continually oppose any plans to capitalize on UP's land assets to support its academic operation.

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Granted, State Schools need the wake-up call. Many people inside UP live in a perpetual haze... basking in the afterglow of their "glory days". And many State Schools are, granted, inefficient in the way they use money.

But there's not enough money.

And there's a general malaise affecting our entire educational system. Where subjects, courses and content are injected, removed, re-instated and added onto by political whim (remember the English-Filipino controversy)... and College Curriculums and requirements set forth by our regulatory bodies are also dictated by politics (the local, academic and professional kind) rather than industry needs. Nurses don't need one-and-a-half years of liberal arts... do they? But politics dictates they do. Those politics dictate the equipment you need to buy, the courses you need to offer, etcetera...

The real disjunct is where education meets employment. That's why many schools are now working directly with the industry... to provide them exactly the kind of graduates they need. And Government, likewise, has to see to it that its educational policy provides for maximum employability, instead of being tailor-fit to satisfy the personal, selfish interests of some in power.

[Galactus]

^^^ OB alert!!! Certified Idiot on Board!!! OB alert!!!

Bakit ba gustong-gusto niyang magpost sa UP thread na to??