"old school" diesels

[badkuk]

peeps, what would make an engine "old school"?

ano ung advantages niya, aside from possibly lower maintenance costs? pagkaintindi ko, engines like these will do well with flood fording, basta wag lang pasukan ng tubig ang intake. Very little electricals, so it should keep chugging along even when wet. tama ba?

meron pa bang mga old school diesels in the market?

[drey]

yep... for me, old school diesel engines are more dependable in hostile areas. They are more easier to maintain. Less electricals, no system box makes no hindrances in water fording.

[scharnhorst]

um, automatic ba na pag naturally aspirated, tapos mechanical injection, old school na?

or does it have to be older than that?

[vinj]

For me, as long as there's no ECU and it's not finicky to fuel quality then i consider it old school enough... D.I. can still fall under that maybe. Such engines are the 4D56, TD27, TD42, 4M40... and the Jeepney Isuzu diesels...

[OTEP]

May 'old school' automatic transmission din. Yung mga wala pang electronic controls.

Old school engines mostly yung from the 70's and 80's na in production pa din hanggang ngayon.

[mbeige]

Old school diesel engines are mostly built of cast iron which are very unlikely to have headgasket/warpage problems. This is the reason they are so darn reliable and bombproof. My MB diesel friends all have these, they range from the slow but uber reliable 240D's (2.4L inline-4 66hp normally aspirated diesels) to the 300DT's (3.0L inline-5 123hp turbocharged).

We once had a chance to own an '81 300TD with 369k miles on the odometer. I'm confident to say it's never been rebuilt although I could be wrong. It can still run 100++ kph on the highway no problems sobrang tibay talaga.

The old school diesels usually still have the glow plugs to warm the pre/chambers to start the engines. Meron pang old school diesels in the market pero syempre they're almost always second hand cars na unless some manufacturers still produce them to this day.

Doc Otep is right, even the transmissions of our cars are vacuum-controlled, not electric!

[Bogeyman]

For me, as long as there's no ECU and it's not finicky to fuel quality then i consider it old school enough... D.I. can still fall under that maybe. Such engines are the 4D56, TD27, TD42, 4M40... and the Jeepney Isuzu diesels...

By D.I., do you mean 'direct injection' or 'distribution injection'? If it's the former, AFAIK hindi kasama ang 4D56 since may prechamber pa siya.

[drey]

OT: What is vacuum door locks?

[niky]

Isuzu Crosswind. Can't get any more old-school than that.

No ECU, No CRDi, No timing belt or chain (direct gear-driven cams only).

No power, either, but you can't have everything...

The only things missing from the Crosswind to make it a perfect "Apocalypse" car is four wheel drive, a snorkel and locking differentials.

[rsnald]

Isuzu Crosswind. Can't get any more old-school than that.

No ECU, No CRDi, No timing belt or chain (direct gear-driven cams only).

No power, either, but you can't have everything...

The only things missing from the Crosswind to make it a perfect "Apocalypse" car is four wheel drive, a snorkel and locking differentials.

niky, i think the 4JA1 is still relatively newer school although late 80's sya ginawa. much older are it's older brothers the C-190 and C240. Indirect inject, w/ glow plugs pa and kelangan ng choke mechanism to kill the engine when you're turning it off. I once drove a fierra-look alike utility jeep in Mindanao. They call it zebra, isuzu C240 engine. when I was trying to turn off the engine, you had to pull a wire to choke the engine so that it would stop running. Nakikita ko yun dati sa mga old jeepneys that had isuzu engines.

siguro yung ng 4BA1's on jeepneys are samples the classic old school diesels of isuzu. mabibilis din tumakbo ang mga yan, I once followed a jeepney running at 120kph in a provincial road.

[4JGtootsie]

I am fan of anything diesel. Old and new school. During my younger years isuzu geminis redefined the auto/taxi industry by using diesel mills on cars (atleast sa P.I). I was so impressed with it that it began interest towards oil burners. With a keen eye on the past present and future, is see the series 60 of detriot diesel as a benchmark for design for a true world class engine. Here are some of the qualities i find impressive in this engine. Short ports for efficient air flow and pumping losses, Gasket eliminator for reduced service time, Iron crosshead pistons, they alloy the rings to be closer to the top to reduce dead volume above the top ring, Fluid weep hole that ensures external leakage and easy identification of source. The newest DD engine which replaces the series 60 is the DD15 which cost $1.5 billion in R&D. Its innovations are a Flywheel Turbine, Amplified Common Rail System (its between a HEUI and a common rail), Integrated Jacobs brake and the becomming standard EGR and DPF (diesel particulate filters).

[duskylim]

Dear Sirs:

I would call any non-electronically controlled injection diesel engine "old school", although there are a wide variety of types.

1) Those with Pre-Combustion Chambers - Mercedes (Daimler) Benz, Caterpillar engines

2) Those with Turbulence Chambers - (usually Ricardo Comet III to V series), like the Isuzu C-190, C-220, C-240 and the Gemini's 4FB1, Mitsubishi 4DRx series, Nissan SD series, Mazda WL-x and R series

3) Early Direct Injection engines - Isuzu mainly, some Nissans, the MAN diesels,

The earliest of these engines use in-line jerk pumps - ask dieseldude, while the later models used distributor-type pumps.

Since they are purely mechanical, no electronics were necessary to make them run. In fact, when they refused to start, the easiest way to get them to run was to push or tow them. Try that on your CRDi!

Best Regards,

Dusky Lim

[cripple_rooster]

Isuzu Crosswind. Can't get any more old-school than that.

No ECU, No CRDi, No timing belt or chain (direct gear-driven cams only).

I really don't like messing with belt tensioners. So maybe I should look for a D-Max with the 4JA1

[OTEP]

OT: What is vacuum door locks?

These are old school power door locks (popular on old Benzes) which used engine vacuum instead of electric motors to drive the central locking system.

I have converted to electric actuators already.

[4JGtootsie]

Newer diesel engines are all Electronically monitored and controlled.It has the ability to program engine to limp, derate and shutdown when it feels the engine is in danger. Efficiency and emission is there prime concern.

Old school has no electronics or engine management. You can run the engine until it explodes if you really want to. Easier to diagnose and predictable. Medyo mas malakas sa diesel than EFI.

Badkuk, old school engines have less problems in floods since electronic shorting and failure is non existent. Engine wash is not a nightmare.

[XTO]

sabi nga malakas sa basaan. engine bay washing is always included everytime i wash my auv. walang sayang sa tirang shampoo.

[larshell]

Can we say that old school diesel engine is more durable but not economical?
I remember Isuzu C-190 engine very durable but not economical. It is very slow and noisy.