Drive Belt and Timing Belt

[suysuy]

Magkapareho ba ito? Nalilito kasi ako eh. Ano ba ang kaibahan nito? Ive googled na kaso lito parin hehe. Yung timing belt ba hindi nakikita? dahil nasa loob ito ng engine? so yung nakikita mo is yung drive belt? yung may alternator compressor etc?

paki clarify nalang po hehe

[oj88]

Magkapareho ba ito? Nalilito kasi ako eh. Ano ba ang kaibahan nito? Ive googled na kaso lito parin hehe. Yung timing belt ba hindi nakikita? dahil nasa loob ito ng engine? so yung nakikita mo is yung drive belt? yung may alternator compressor etc?

paki clarify nalang po hehe

Timing belt, pwedeng exposed or hidden. Usually hidden, lalo na kung timing chain. In either case, eto lang tatandaan, ang timing belt or chain ang nagpapaikot ng cams, na sya naman nagbubukas/sara ng intake and exhaust valves. Simply, kailangan synchronized ito sa crank, hence the word "timing".

Drive belt naman ang nagpapaikot ng power steering, alternator, water pump at A/C. At di tulad ng timing chain, hindi ito kailangan naka sync sa crank.

[XTO]

timing belt - nasa loob, nagpapaikot sa engine internals

drive belt/s - external - driver ng water pump, power steering, a/c compressor and alternator. madalas tawag dito ay as fan belt

[suysuy]

hehehe thanks mga peeps! nalito lang talaga kasi ako. nabasa ko kasi sa net eh delikado maputol ang timing belt. so kung maputol if ever and drive belt, makakasira rin ba ito ng engine?

[Bogeyman]

hehehe thanks mga peeps! nalito lang talaga kasi ako. nabasa ko kasi sa net eh delikado maputol ang timing belt. so kung maputol if ever and drive belt, makakasira rin ba ito ng engine?

Pag drive belt ang naputol, pwede mo pang patakbuhin ang sasakyan (dahan-dahan nga lang).

Pag timing belt ang naputol, hindi lang makina ang lagot, pati bulsa mo.

[oliver1013]

^Mahirap maputulan ng timing belt..yung L300 ko naputulan...nabali lahat ng valves, nabingkong (bumaluktot) yung camshaft...umabot ng 20k damage...not to mention yung binayad ko sa tow truck...sabi ng mekaniko ko swerte pako dahil hindi nabutas yung cover ng engine ko...ibang expenses pa yung mga oil seals

[XTO]

kung drive belt/s ang naputol, hindi naman nakakasira ng engine. depende sa sasakyan kung alin ang magkakasama sa belt/s nila. kadalasan hiwalay ang para sa alternator, magkakasama naman ang a/c, p/s, water pump (sa crosswind doble ito kaya very safe)

kung alin sa kanila ang mapuputol. minsan 2 or more ang drive belts kaya depende kung alin. kung sa alternator, di kakarga battery, water pump - overheat at kung sa a/c- mawawala lamig.

[v6dreamer]

If your engine is non-interference you dont have to worry about, just replace the timing belt, time it then your on your way. If not when the timing belt breaks it will bend all your valves or valves have pushed holes through the piston crowns and if this happen, youll need a new engine. It really will ruin your car big time.

[4JGtootsie]

Aside from what has been mentioned.
Drive belts is designed to slip a little when load is applied allowing obsorbtion of force. While timing belt or chain should never slip, jump or slide so as to maintain proper synchronization of cam, balancers, injection pumps and crankshaft.
Engines with timing belts are more silent than those with chains and gears.

[oj88]

Aside from what has been mentioned.
Drive belts is designed to slip a little when load is applied allowing obsorbtion of force. While timing belt or chain should never slip, jump or slide so as to maintain proper synchronization of cam, balancers, injection pumps and crankshaft.
Engines with timing belts are more silent than those with chains and gears.

I don't think that drive belts (in a car's engine) are designed to slip. If so, you'll be hearing squeals every time the A/C kicks in, for instance.

In fact, squealing is one sign that the belt tensioner needs adjustment or that the belt itself has stretched beyond it's service life.

Most modern cars have wider multi-groove belts that mates with pulleys that have multi-grooves as well. This adds grip between the belt and the pulleys it's turning to mitigate slipping. And since there's less sliding, it's quieter.

(See cross-section of the belts below) The older or traditional belt which was prone to squealing is known as the v-belt (left). While the multi-groove belt is better known as the serpentine belt (right).

[4JGtootsie]

It does. Kaya ang serpintine belts have groves same direction as the belt. Kung hindi siya dapat mag slip then dapat pang timing belt (with teeth) ang gamit niya.
Kawawa ang makina pag nag stuck ang bearing ng alternator, aircon or hard steering.
Also imagine how fast the AC compresor clutch engages and the load it has if your belt doesnt slip ng kaunti then ramdam mo dapa ng makina.

[oj88]

It does. Kaya ang serpintine belts have groves same direction as the belt. Kung hindi siya dapat mag slip then dapat pang timing belt (with teeth) ang gamit niya.
Kawawa ang makina pag nag stuck ang bearing ng alternator, aircon or hard steering.
Also imagine how fast the AC compresor clutch engages and the load it has if your belt doesnt slip then ramdam mo dapa ng makina.

My context is that, it shouldn't slip under normal engine operation. Normal operation involves A/C cycling, high alternator or HPS loads, etc. The engine is designed to handle those loads, damped or not. If the belt slips under the above circumstances, the belt is probably not installed properly, is of the wrong kind or the belt and/or tensioner is already worn down, or there's oil/lubricant in the belt path. Slipping will cause accelerated belt wear and glazing, which will further make the contact surface more slippery.

With regards to the A/C clutch, the clutch will slightly slide upon contact and it shouldn't be the belt that's doing that. This is more to protect the A/C compressor from the sudden jerk than to protect the engine. If you look closely and you're familiar with leverage from physics class, it will be very hard for the serpentine belt to slip due to the relatively large diameter of the A/C pulley.

Though, in situations where a bearing or pulley becomes stuck and if the forces applied are beyond the frictional coefficient of the belt and the pulley, it will definitely slip. But then, this is already outside the engine's normal operation.

[4JGtootsie]

Assuming everything was installed properly, tension is good, pulleys are in order.
What causes wear in ordinary belt or serpentine type?
Why do we have to replace them once in a while?

[oj88]

What causes wear in ordinary belt or serpentine type?
Why do we have to replace them once in a while?

Friction, flexing, tension and heat.

Friction - Some rubbing naturally occurs as the belt lines up in and out of the pulley and grooves. This is analogous to tires. Rolling friction causes it to wear... doing burnouts or sudden acceleration and braking just speeds up the wear.

Flexing and tension - Most belts are bent more than 270 degrees as it goes around different pulleys... doing that while the tensioner keeps it tight enough to prohibit slipping. Rubber fatigue will eventually weaken the belt's construction.

Heat - Any material will change chemically when repeatedly exposed to heat. Think of it as the material's expiration date.

[4JGtootsie]

When it flexes do you mean it stretches? What causes it to flex?
Is it possible that slippage can cause friction?
Why does sudden braking and acceleration speed up wear?

[s_quilicot]

dapat preventive maintenance parati sa timing at drive belt to prevent hassle and unnceccesary occurence.

[oj88]

When it flexes do you mean it stretches? What causes it to flex?
Is it possible that slippage can cause friction?
Why does sudden braking and acceleration speed up wear?

Friction prevents slippage. But if there's slippage, it will cause heat.

I suggest you re-read my previous post about the analogy with tires.

[4JGtootsie]

The job of the tires is similar to the belt. Whether serpentine or ordinary.
Even if serpentine belt nag sislip yan.
We turn the engine to do timing by using all the pulleys connected to the serpentine belt and it still slips before turning the crank shaft pulley. Tensioner is loaded. We had pressure the belt so it will hug the pulleys.
How can that be explained?

[oj88]

The job of the tires is similar to the belt. Whether serpentine or ordinary.
Even if serpentine belt nag sislip yan.
We turn the engine to do timing by using all the pulleys connected to the serpentine belt and it still slips before turning the crank shaft pulley. Tensioner is loaded. We had pressure the belt so it will hug the pulleys.
How can that be explained?

It will still depend on where the force is coming from. Turn the crank, not the other pulleys. Again, leverage is your answer.

If you turn one of the smaller pulleys for instance, it will slip. But if you turn the crank, it will turn all the other pulleys. Ever notice how the serpentine belt is wrapped almost completely around the crank?

[4JGtootsie]

The belt doesnt almost completely wrap the crankshaft pulley because the compressor and power steering pumps is in the left and right side of the engine.
If a belt doesnt slip like you say, then kahit saan pulley mo iikot sasama lahat ng pulley especially the crank kasi siya ang may pinaka malaking contact sa belt.
Kung nag slip sa isang pulley whether ginamitan mo ng leverage o hindi will only prove na it does slip. Ordinary belts without tensioner are not tighten to the max and allow a little slack so that the it can slip a little so as to obsorb force whenever rapid increase and decrease of RPM occurs.
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