Is it contact point, condenser or battery ang problema??

[AcidBurn]

Mga sirs,

May kinalaman ba ang contact point at condenser sa pag baba ng rpm everytime I open my headlights?

Heres the scenario...since kalilipat lang namin ng bahay at wala pang kilalang trusted mechanic sa lugar, sinubukan kong magpatune up sa isang talyer nearby at pinabili ako ng mekaniko ng contact point at condenser, nung nilagay na un binili ko ay ayaw mag-start at inabot kami ng hapon sa pag troubleshoot. Mantakin nyo, simpleng tune-up lang inabot ako ng isang araw sa talyer at kaya lang umistart ang auto ay binalik nya ang lumang pyesa at sinabi sa kin na sira daw parehas un nabili kong contact point at condenser, hehe, samantalang nakakahon pa ang mga un...biruin nyo P400 ang nalagas sa kin dahil hnde ko na naman masosoli un kasi pinutol na nya at pinagdugtong...siraniko ata ang napuntahan ko.

Anyways, after that napansin ko sa twing bubuksan ang HL ay bumababa rpm ko na dati namang hinde. Battery ko po ay 10 mos old pa lang (Motolite Enduro) at months before ako magpatune-up sa siranikong un ay pinacheck ko pa sa electrical shop sa dating lugar namin ang alternator ko at maayos naman daw na kumakarga.

So, Im wondering if possible culprit po ba ang contact point at condenser since itong luma pa din ang nakakabit? Or does it have something to do with the battery at kelangan kong ipacheck kung kumakarga pa? Ive read some posts po kasi dito na wala pang 1 yr batteries nila pero bumigay na...too bad, around 3k pa naman ang bili ko dun last august.


Your immediate response would be very much appreciated. Thanks

[jick.cejoco]

Mga sirs,

May kinalaman ba ang contact point at condenser sa pag baba ng rpm everytime I open my headlights?

Heres the scenario...since kalilipat lang namin ng bahay at wala pang kilalang trusted mechanic sa lugar, sinubukan kong magpatune up sa isang talyer nearby at pinabili ako ng mekaniko ng contact point at condenser, nung nilagay na un binili ko ay ayaw mag-start at inabot kami ng hapon sa pag troubleshoot. Mantakin nyo, simpleng tune-up lang inabot ako ng isang araw sa talyer at kaya lang umistart ang auto ay binalik nya ang lumang pyesa at sinabi sa kin na sira daw parehas un nabili kong contact point at condenser...biruin nyo P400 ang nalagas sa kin dahil hnde ko na naman masosoli un kasi pinutol na nya at pinagdugtong...siraniko ata ang napuntahan ko.

Anyways, after that napansin ko sa twing bubuksan ang HL ay bumababa rpm ko na dati namang hinde. Battery ko po ay 10 mos old pa lang (Motolite Enduro) at months before ako magpatune-up sa siranikong un ay pinacheck ko pa sa electrical shop sa dating lugar namin ang alternator ko at maayos naman daw na kumakarga.

So, Im wondering if possible culprit po ba ang contact point at condenser since itong luma pa din ang nakakabit? Or does it have something to do with the battery at kelangan kong ipacheck kung kumakarga pa? Ive read some posts po kasi dito na wala pang 1 yr batteries nila pero bumigay na...too bad, around 3k pa naman ang bili ko dun last august.


Your immediate response would be very much appreciated. Thanks

sorry for what happened to you wasting about a day of your life because of incompetent "mechanic". lessons learned:1- do not just trust any tom, dick or harry who has busted and greasy knuckles who knows how to turn a screwdriver, 2- you get what you pay for, 3- look for some kind of certification of training, diploma or positive reputation if you do not know this "mechanic", 4-even with an engine that still runs on points and the "mechanic" turns to guess and hope (try to guess the problem and hope you fixed it), how much more if the vehicle runs on computer aided network (CAN BUS), then it would take a miracle and a lot of prayers to figure out. the dropping of idle speed is more than likely a result of the alternator trying to produce more current to the now low in charge battery from failed attempts to start the car for as you mentioned around the whole day to figure out or guess and wait for luck

[AcidBurn]

Noted sir jick. I thought the job would be a snap of a finger for him since maraming sasakyan nagpapagawa (or nagpapasira) sa taong un. Mas oks pa ata kung sa gasoline station na lang muna ako magpatune up habang wala pang kilalang matinong mekaniko sa lugar.

Bale ang sinasabi mo ay walang kinalaman ang lumang contact point / condenser sa problema at ang battery ko na hinde na masyadong kumakarga ang possible culprit, tama po ba?


Thanks sa reply boss

[jick.cejoco]

Noted sir jick. I thought the job would be a snap of a finger for him since maraming sasakyan nagpapagawa (or nagpapasira) sa taong un. Mas oks pa ata kung sa gasoline station na lang muna ako magpatune up habang wala pang kilalang matinong mekaniko sa lugar.

Bale ang sinasabi mo ay walang kinalaman ang lumang contact point / condenser sa problema at ang battery ko na hinde na masyadong kumakarga ang possible culprit, tama po ba?


Thanks sa reply boss

retest with a fully charged battery. if the idle speed still drops drastically, there is a problem with the battery or the ability of the alternator to charge. as with the tune up, i.e. ignition both primary and secondary circuits, fuel pressure and volume, air induction and charging and starting system checks should have been done. carburetor base idle, fast idle speed and idle speed actuator be adjusted per repair manual

[reym]

Sorry for what happened to you. Jick is right don't trust any mechanic.
Your problem could be a low alternator output or the idle adjustment by the master mechanic is too low.

[AcidBurn]

Sir, up ko lang po uli tong thread. Just had my battery and alternator checked in a nearby motolite shop this morning and the results are maayos naman daw kumakarga ang baterya at alternator ko...ilang beses sya nagtrouble shoot while on ang a/c, on ang HL then of ang a/c and HL...pero kumakarga pa rin naman daw ng tama ang alternator at battery.

What could be the culprit sa pagbaba ng rpm everytime I open my HL...or normal lang po ba talaga na bumaba around 2 guhit ang rpm pag nagbukas ng headlights (from 900 to 700)? And sometimes pa ay parang paos ang busina...pero minsan naman hinde :-(

Needs more advise sir kung ano pa mga dapat ipacheck sa auto. TIA

[imperialv]

pa adjust mo na lang yung minor mo.. baka makuha...

[kinyo]

maaring meron bad/loose/corroded contact sa wiring ng battery and/or main fuse ... pa-check na lang sa electrician ang wiring

[Chef Noob]

Check for grounds...here's how I do it.
1. Switch off ALL electrical devices.
2. Remove ground wire on battery.
3. Slowly replace the batt lead to the neg. pole. If a light spark occurred, there's something eating your power...pag malakas ang spark, malakas ang ground.

Possible na batt mo ang may problema. I doubt na its your alternator causing your coil to fluctuate, since hindi naman wired ang ignition coil directly dun.
Dependent ang coil sa battery. No battery, No spark...Ang problema ngalang, dependent din si battery kay alternator...hehe! So pag No charge...No Battery...No Spark.

Honestly, isa lang masasabi ko sa Motolite Enduro..."BULOK". Naka 3 nako nyan, hindi talaga tumatagal. Mahina talaga output current. Try mo e measure voltage niya using multitester na naka on Low Beam, bumababa ng less than 11v ang voltage...

[AcidBurn]

Check for grounds...here's how I do it.
1. Switch off ALL electrical devices.
2. Remove ground wire on battery.
3. Slowly replace the batt lead to the neg. pole. If a light spark occurred, there's something eating your power...pag malakas ang spark, malakas ang ground.

Possible na batt mo ang may problema. I doubt na its your alternator causing your coil to fluctuate, since hindi naman wired ang ignition coil directly dun.
Dependent ang coil sa battery. No battery, No spark...Ang problema ngalang, dependent din si battery kay alternator...hehe! So pag No charge...No Battery...No Spark.

Honestly, isa lang masasabi ko sa Motolite Enduro..."BULOK". Naka 3 nako nyan, hindi talaga tumatagal. Mahina talaga output current. Try mo e measure voltage niya using multitester na naka on Low Beam, bumababa ng less than 11v ang voltage...

Boss Noob,

Mejo hinde tayo knowledgeable when it comes to electrical...just a few clarifications before diy. On item nos 2 and 3...
1) Ang ibig bang sabihin ay alisin ko ang ground wire na nakakunekta sa baterya at idikit ko sa negative terminal, tama po ba?
2) Pag may umispark it means na may grounded connections some where ang auto?

Thanks

[AcidBurn]

maaring meron bad/loose/corroded contact sa wiring ng battery and/or main fuse ... pa-check na lang sa electrician ang wiring

*kinyo, noted sir, will do. thanks

pa adjust mo na lang yung minor mo.. baka makuha...

*imperialv, negative sir...pag tinaasan ko ng minor, bumababa pa rin talaga ang rpm pag nakabukas ang headlights. thanks

[jick.cejoco]

Boss Noob,

Mejo hinde tayo knowledgeable when it comes to electrical...just a few clarifications before diy. On item nos 2 and 3...
1) Ang ibig bang sabihin ay alisin ko ang ground wire na nakakunekta sa baterya at idikit ko sa negative terminal, tama po ba?
2) Pag may umispark it means na may grounded connections some where ang auto?

Thanks

it will have a spark regardless the ignition switch is off. all the circuits that maintain memory charges their capacitors. some parasitic loads will have bigger capacitors. this is not a very reliable method. use a digital multimeter connected between the battery negative terminal (black test lead) and the battery cable clamp ( red test lead) set on millliamps. temporarily jumper the battery post and the cable while the DMM is connected to charge the capacitors. then, the current reduces and that's your parasitic drain. if it is above 40 milliamps, rest assured there is a short somewhere that is not big enough to blow the fuse. this test is done with the doors closed, trunk lid( if it has trunk light) closed, ignition switch off so are the other switched loads have to be in the off position

[jvnj]

Sir AcidBurn,

Try also checking your connections (Negative terminal, Positive terminal and the grounding connections [Battery to body, Battery to Engine, etc.]). Loose / poor connections can also cause / contribute the mentioned symptoms. Be sure all contacts are clean from any corrosion and are properly tightened.

Also, while your car is on idle, turn-on your headlights and observe if your cable/s are warm or warming. Possible cause can be a loose connection or undersized wire. Please keep us posted.

Thanks

[AcidBurn]

Sir AcidBurn,

Try also checking your connections (Negative terminal, Positive terminal and the grounding connections [Battery to body, Battery to Engine, etc.]). Loose / poor connections can also cause / contribute the mentioned symptoms. Be sure all contacts are clean from any corrosion and are properly tightened.

Also, while your car is on idle, turn-on your headlights and observe if your cable/s are warm or warming. Possible cause can be a loose connection or undersized wire. Please keep us posted.

Thanks

Will do sir jvnj thanks

[AcidBurn]

Mga sirs,

Not sure if this is normal, napuna ko lang yesterday nung inistart ko un auto while the rpm is not yet on its normal level ay inopen ko ang HL pero hinde bumaba ang rpm...nasa 700 pa lang ang rpm ko that time at pag uminit na makina ay babalik na sa normal level na 900...pero sa scenario na un ay nag-stay lang sa 700 ang rpm while open ang headlights

Naobserbahan ko lang na pag nsa normal level na ang rpm at binuksan ang headights thats the only time na bumababa into 700?? Weird po ba :-)

Ano kaya possible cause nito...wala naman sigurong kinalaman ang mga lumang pyesa na last year pa napalitan which is the spark plugs, contact point, condenser, etc or ano po kaya ang mga dapat ipacheck pag ganito ang naeencounter? TIA

[Chef Noob]

it will have a spark regardless the ignition switch is off. all the circuits that maintain memory charges their capacitors. some parasitic loads will have bigger capacitors.

True, but the fact that his car still uses the points just like mine, I would assume that the only gadget he had thats got memory is the clock.

Boss Noob,

Mejo hinde tayo knowledgeable when it comes to electrical...just a few clarifications before diy. On item nos 2 and 3...
1) Ang ibig bang sabihin ay alisin ko ang ground wire na nakakunekta sa baterya at idikit ko sa negative terminal, tama po ba?
2) Pag may umispark it means na may grounded connections some where ang auto?

Thanks

Acid Burn,
Yup...Basically, tatanggalin mo lang syung negative terminal at e dikit/patong ulit dun sa pinag tanggalan mo na poste...just to check pag may ground.
Actually, better ang method ni jick stated above since more scientific aka "surebol" yun...provided you have a Digital Multimeter which has an amp setting.

Just to clarify his post. Dapat mong e series ang tester within the circuit. Meaning, one lead (-) goes to the neg side of the battery, the other (+) goes to the GROUND CABLE of the car. NEVER use it across the terminals of the battery(positive to negative)...kundi uusok yang tester mo!

The method I suggested was a crude way of finding it... but it does work most of the time for older model cars.

Btw, the reason hindi mo napapansin o walang pagbabago ang menor pag kaka start mo palang kasi hindi pa vaporized maigi ang fuel...meaning malamig pa makina mo.

Can I ask what make & model auto mo?

[AcidBurn]

True, but the fact that his car still uses the points just like mine, I would assume that the only gadget he had thats got memory is the clock.





Acid Burn,
Yup...Basically, tatanggalin mo lang syung negative terminal at e dikit/patong ulit dun sa pinag tanggalan mo na poste...just to check pag may ground.
Actually, better ang method ni jick stated above since more scientific aka "surebol" yun...provided you have a Digital Multimeter which has an amp setting.

Just to clarify his post. Dapat mong e series ang tester within the circuit. Meaning, one lead (-) goes to the neg side of the battery, the other (+) goes to the GROUND CABLE of the car. NEVER use it across the terminals of the battery(positive to negative)...kundi uusok yang tester mo!

The method I suggested was a crude way of finding it... but it does work most of the time for older model cars.

Btw, the reason hindi mo napapansin o walang pagbabago ang menor pag kaka start mo palang kasi hindi pa vaporized maigi ang fuel...meaning malamig pa makina mo.

Can I ask what make & model auto mo?

Noted sir...ride is nissan stanza 86. thanks

[paulgozon]

Changing or re-installing contact point, whether new or old will surely affect its timing,. Better re-check timing and also the idle mixture and idle speed. These are the most common thing to do. Before concluding that the alternator is the problem.

[AcidBurn]

Changing or re-installing contact point, whether new or old will surely affect its timing,. Better re-check timing and also the idle mixture and idle speed. These are the most common thing to do. Before concluding that the alternator is the problem.

Sir paul, you mean I should also consider the old contact point and condenser na binalik nung mekaniko sa problema ng auto?

We already tried other solutions by fellow tsikoteers, we adjusted the mixture and idle speed, pero pag nakaload na ang HL ay talagang bumababa ng 200 ang rpm...aside from that, mejo lumakas pa fuel consumption kaya binalik ko na uli sa dati :-)

Thanks

[Chef Noob]

Sir, may I ask what type of lights are you using? and whats the wattage output? baka kasi masyadong malakas para sa battery mo.
Also, do you have any electrical vaccum pumps?(i.e. aircon actuator, etc.)

Also, using a multimeter/voltmeter, check the voltage of the battery with the lights on & off...dapat less than 1volt lang ang difference.

One possibility is bumababa masyado ang output voltage ng batt mo...

Check back on this once you have the details...