World economy talk

**badsekktor** · February 20th, 2009 03:48 PM

thanks for the info bro! very informative thread talaga!

**Monseratto** · February 20th, 2009 07:01 PM

One of the great achievements of the Bush Administration is they made the American Public so desperate that they voted for a complete noob for president...

**Monseratto** · February 20th, 2009 08:08 PM

The drawing is a reference to the mauling of a woman by a pet chimpanzee, which was then killed by police. In the cartoon, one of the officers tells the other, "They'll have to find someone else to write the next stimulus bill."

The Post said the cartoon was meant to mock what it called an "ineptly written" stimulus bill.

**tidus1203** · February 20th, 2009 08:55 PM

I am sure the economists surrounding Obama that doing nothing is also a solution and eventually the markets will sort itself out when prices are down enough. But they also know its the more painful route. Politics plays a lot in this that is why effective economics can't be implemented.

**tidus1203** · February 20th, 2009 11:29 PM

Oh yeah baby! GOLD is now above $1000 as of this posting... This is despite USD gaining in the FX market. Go GOLD, go for GOLD!

Fear of currency devaluation around the world, fear of sovereign defaults...

**tidus1203** · February 20th, 2009 11:47 PM

The US markets are now open and they are falling at the moment. I tell you if we break those November lows (which we did yesterday) we are in one serious hurt here we could see another leg down for the stock markets...

**uls** · February 21st, 2009 12:48 AM

Tidus:

I am sure the economists surrounding Obama that doing nothing is also a solution and eventually the markets will sort itself out when prices are down enough. But they also know its the more painful route. Politics plays a lot in this that is why effective economics can't be implemented.

Politics trumps economics eh

--

yep gold hit 1000 kanina and retreated a bit

--

Citigroup stock price sub-$2 kanina

**tidus1203** · February 21st, 2009 12:52 AM

Citigroup?? Its virtually worthless in my view. Its just another insolvent bank. That's the problem with paper once confidence is gone its worthless and we all know confidence evaporates before you know it. Pero GOLD it will never go to ZERO.

**uls** · February 21st, 2009 12:57 AM

like you said Tidus, price is everything

the stock price of C screams nationalization

shareholders will be wiped out

it's just a matter of when, not if

**tidus1203** · February 21st, 2009 12:58 AM

Yep PRICE is KING. I don't care if Vikram Pandit goes to the Congress under oath tells the world the Citibank is not insolvent and that Citibank is still strong. People lie, the prices never lie...

**mark_t** · February 21st, 2009 02:36 AM

Question lang po, which currencies are still backed by gold today?

**tidus1203** · February 21st, 2009 08:11 AM

^^Wala na po... Bretton Woods after WWII made all currencies in the world pegged to the USD and the USD is pegged to Gold. Since 1971 Nixon pulled the plug on gold backing (he also banned private gold ownership for fear of a run on gold) because of America's useless wars like Vietnam put a strain on the US ability to spend... Gold keeps government honest and accountable and they don't want that...

**uls** · February 21st, 2009 11:08 AM

UPDATE 6-Citi, B of A shares fall on nationalization fears
http://www.reuters.com/article/marke...20156620090221

NEW YORK, Feb 20 (Reuters) - Bank of America Corp (BAC.N) shares sank below $3 and Citigroup Inc (C.N) tumbled below $2 on Friday, hammered by growing fears that the U.S. government could nationalize the banks, wiping out shareholders.

In a roller-coaster session, the shares fell as much as 36 percent after Sen. Christopher Dodd, a Democrat who chairs the Senate Banking Committee, said it might be necessary for the government to take control of some banks. They recovered some losses after the White House said President Barack Obama favored a privately held banking system.

If Obama were inclined to take control of troubled banks -- and the bank rescue plan recently outlined by Treasury Secretary Timothy Geithner leaves that question unanswered -- he would be taking a political gamble as the country is showing signs of "bailout fatigue."
Citigroup shares closed down 56 cents, or 22.3 percent, at $1.95 after earlier hitting $1.61, their lowest level since 1990. Bank of America closed down 14 cents, or 3.6 percent, at $3.79, after falling to $2.53, their lowest level since 1984.

Both stocks have lost more than 90 percent of their value in the last year. Shares of Citigroup rose 27 cents to $2.22 after hours.

Through the close, Citigroup's market capitalization had shrunk to $10.6 billion, making it worth less than asset administrator Northern Trust Corp (NTRS.O). Bank of America, the largest U.S. bank by assets, was worth $24.2 billion.

Both banks have taken $45 billion of capital from the federal government since October, and gotten a federal backstop on losses related to toxic assets.

"The values of the companies seem so ridiculously depressed because no one believes in their values, and no one believes in their values because they think the government is going to take them over," said Ken Crawford, senior portfolio manager at Argent Capital Management.

Crawford said the government could be forced to nationalize Citigroup and Bank of America if their share prices keep falling and their survival is at risk.

SOONER OR LATER

**uls** · February 21st, 2009 02:03 PM

Fear indicator:

Movement of gold price last night

went past $1000

**Monseratto** · February 21st, 2009 05:33 PM

The market will be toast Monday. Better for Obama and co. to keep their yap shut on what to do with the banks cuz their causing them to collapse...

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=65dTUTFqcvM]Peter Schiff on CNBC 18th Feb 2009 1 of 2[/ame]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e1Krza4X1NE]Peter Schiff on CNBC 18th Feb 2009 2 of 2[/ame]

**Monseratto** · February 21st, 2009 05:58 PM

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pxvHT0wGfuo]Peter Schiff 2/13/09 - Oracle with Max Keiser [/ame]

Federal Reserve Board Abolition Act HR 833, what's that?

**Monseratto** · February 21st, 2009 06:12 PM

The Zimbabwe School of Economics

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=loa92ZG1KV8]Marc Faber 2/05/09[/ame]

**tidus1203** · February 21st, 2009 06:15 PM

Hahaha Jerry Boyer what a loser... Has long been a loser and is still a loser (natandaan ko nga dati pinagtatawanan nya si Peter Schiff, who's laughing now?). His calls are pathetic you would have lost a lot of money with this guy... Peter's on the other had has a terrific batting average except for his US Dollar call (he is still firm that it will fall later), his Gold call and stock market call has hit it right in the head.

**uls** · February 22nd, 2009 03:00 PM

Monseratto:

Federal Reserve Board Abolition Act HR 833, what's that?

it's a bill sponsored by Rep. Ron Paul

eto ang speech nya re the bill

http://www.house.gov/apps/list/speec...shtheFed.shtml

Statement of Congressman Ron Paul

United States House of Representatives

Statement on Federal Reserve Board Abolition Act

February 3, 2009

Madame Speaker, I rise to introduce legislation to restore financial stability to America's economy by abolishing the Federal Reserve. Since the creation of the Federal Reserve, middle and working-class Americans have been victimized by a boom-and-bust monetary policy. In addition, most Americans have suffered a steadily eroding purchasing power because of the Federal Reserve's inflationary policies. This represents a real, if hidden, tax imposed on the American people.

From the Great Depression, to the stagflation of the seventies, to the current economic crisis caused by the housing bubble, every economic downturn suffered by this country over the past century can be traced to Federal Reserve policy. The Fed has followed a consistent policy of flooding the economy with easy money, leading to a misallocation of resources and an artificial "boom" followed by a recession or depression when the Fed-created bubble bursts.

With a stable currency, American exporters will no longer be held hostage to an erratic monetary policy. Stabilizing the currency will also give Americans new incentives to save as they will no longer have to fear inflation eroding their savings. Those members concerned about increasing America's exports or the low rate of savings should be enthusiastic supporters of this legislation.

Though the Federal Reserve policy harms the average American, it benefits those in a position to take advantage of the cycles in monetary policy. The main beneficiaries are those who receive access to artificially inflated money and/or credit before the inflationary effects of the policy impact the entire economy. Federal Reserve policies also benefit big spending politicians who use the inflated currency created by the Fed to hide the true costs of the welfare-warfare state. It is time for Congress to put the interests of the American people ahead of special interests and their own appetite for big government.

Abolishing the Federal Reserve will allow Congress to reassert its constitutional authority over monetary policy. The United States Constitution grants to Congress the authority to coin money and regulate the value of the currency. The Constitution does not give Congress the authority to delegate control over monetary policy to a central bank. Furthermore, the Constitution certainly does not empower the federal government to erode the American standard of living via an inflationary monetary policy.

In fact, Congress' constitutional mandate regarding monetary policy should only permit currency backed by stable commodities such as silver and gold to be used as legal tender. Therefore, abolishing the Federal Reserve and returning to a constitutional system will enable America to return to the type of monetary system envisioned by our nation's founders: one where the value of money is consistent because it is tied to a commodity such as gold. Such a monetary system is the basis of a true freemarket economy.

In conclusion, Mr. Speaker, I urge my colleagues to stand up for working Americans by putting an end to the manipulation of the money supply which erodes Americans' standard of living, enlarges big government, and enriches well-connected elites, by cosponsoring my legislation to abolish the Federal
Reserve.

**tidus1203** · February 22nd, 2009 08:03 PM

Hillary Clinton the new Secretary of State for Barrack Obama is now in China as part of her Asian tour. Guess what she is telling the Chinese? Continue to support the Treasury markets by buying, wow almighty USA asking China for money... Interestingly China said that future purchase hinges on the investments safety (this no problem the US can print the money so default risk is 0%) and the preservation of their value ( now this is the big problem, the US under Obama's which already signed into law will run the printing press day and night 24/7)... They are interdependent I agree but China has the upper hand for sure. The US might not be the world's #1 consumer in the future. China can be its own consumer... Pero matagal pa yan, pero definitely signs of power shifts geopolitically happening right before our very eyes...

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?p...VMo&refer=home

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