Auto-LPG Conversion Thread

[ssalonga]

Yep, exactly what I had in mind. A five-gallon jug with an electric fuel pump inside would take up very little trunk space and have enough mileage to an autogas station. All items available at any surplus shop or ebay.

[ssalonga]

Dear Web & Ghost,

I thought this simple calculator would be helpful to explain the economic advantage of Autogas in Manila, and put an end to that recent flame.

This calculation is based on actual results with my 1999 Kia Pride GTX, manual trans.

Distance driven on a tank of gas 600 km/trip
Litres used on trip 60 litres/trip
Annual vehicle distance 30000 km/year
Propane economy as % of gasoline economy 75.00% conservative estimate
Price of gasoline 45 P/litre
Price of propane 27 P/litre
Cost to drive trip distance on gasoline P 2700/trip
Estimated litres of propane used on same trip 80 litres/trip
Cost to drive trip distance on propane P 2160/trip
Fuel Savings per km P 0.90/km
Annual Savings P 27,000 P/year
Cost to convert vehicle P 23,000
Payback 0.851852 years

[webmiester]

Dear Web & Ghost,

Distance driven on a tank of gas 600 km/trip
Litres used on trip 60 litres/trip
Annual vehicle distance 30000 km/year
Propane economy as % of gasoline economy 75.00% conservative estimate
Price of gasoline 45 P/litre
Price of propane 27 P/litre
Cost to drive trip distance on gasoline P 2700/trip
Estimated litres of propane used on same trip 80 litres/trip
Cost to drive trip distance on propane P 2160/trip
Fuel Savings per km P 0.90/km
Annual Savings P 27,000 P/year
Cost to convert vehicle P 23,000
Payback 0.851852 years

Thanks Steve... again its the "Annual Vehicle Distance" which is in contention. If the guy uses his car for like 100km/year, then it might not be worth it.

What is 30000km a year like anyway? If I make like 500km in 3 weeks, what will be my yearly distance?

[userfriendly]

Thanks Steve... again its the "Annual Vehicle Distance" which is in contention. If the guy uses his car for like 100km/year, then it might not be worth it.

What is 30000km a year like anyway? If I make like 500km in 3 weeks, what will be my yearly distance?

500 km/3 weeks = 167 km/week * 52 weeks/ year = 8684 km/ year

[ssalonga]

Thanks Steve... again its the "Annual Vehicle Distance" which is in contention. If the guy uses his car for like 100km/year, then it might not be worth it.

What is 30000km a year like anyway? If I make like 500km in 3 weeks, what will be my yearly distance?

Web, I figured my own mileage was about 100km/day average, 300 days of the year. My actual experience is very close to that every year. I live in Valley Golf and work in Pasig, my wife in Mandaluyong and I regularly use the car to get to appointments during the day, thus 100 day.

I have always believed that converting to propane is not for everyone.
To many people doing something that 98% of the people do not do, is reason enough, not to do it, any economy considerations be damned.

I was a great believer in diesel engine technology using vegetable oil fuel, as it was originally designed, but to this day many people still consider a diesel engined luxury car an oxymoron!

My point in posting my own cost-benefit statement is to show that to some of us it does make a lot of sense. If I drove only 8k kms/yr I'd buy that 1987 500SEL selling for 170T in todays Bulletin classifieds. But driving as much as I do, I'm happy with my KIA.

There will be moments this winter, when LPG will be in greater demand due to heating requirements in the temperate zones and will rise more aggressively than gasoline - but if you annualize the price cycle it probably evens out and will still reflect substantial saving for me.

On the other hand, many of today's car owners don't really care whether they save or not, they just keep ordering those new V6 and V8's. Makes you wonder?

steve

[ghosthunter]

Yep, exactly what I had in mind. A five-gallon jug with an electric fuel pump inside would take up very little trunk space and have enough mileage to an autogas station. All items available at any surplus shop or ebay.

why even risk using a five gallon jug?... You can always use a small racing fuel cell. Readily available plus its crash rated not to rupture.

[ssalonga]

Thanks Steve... again its the "Annual Vehicle Distance" which is in contention. If the guy uses his car for like 100km/year, then it might not be worth it.

What is 30000km a year like anyway? If I make like 500km in 3 weeks, what will be my yearly distance?

why even risk using a five gallon jug?... You can always use a small racing fuel cell. Readily available plus its crash rated not to rupture.

interesting ghost! I have no experience with these - how much fuel can it store? And where do I find surplus or used ones?

[ghosthunter]

interesting ghost! I have no experience with these - how much fuel can it store? And where do I find surplus or used ones?

Although I haven't really checked where to buy these locally, you can start with some of the tuner shops.

Here's a few websites where they sell/feature fuel cells:
http://wescoperformance.stores.yahoo...racecells.html
http://wescoperformance.stores.yahoo.net/ecfuelcel.html
http://www.atlinc.com/US/racing.html
http://www.amfuel.com/index_start.htm

[ssalonga]

Although I haven't really checked where to buy these locally, you can start with some of the tuner shops.

Here's a few websites where they sell/feature fuel cells:
http://wescoperformance.stores.yahoo...racecells.html
http://wescoperformance.stores.yahoo.net/ecfuelcel.html
http://www.atlinc.com/US/racing.html
http://www.amfuel.com/index_start.htm

Ghosthunter.

After looking these over, I think they are over-engineered for my needs. I will look around for those spare gas cans that are designed to bring extra fuel in your trunk. I saw one last christmas at handyman, made in england daw! Maybe I can just adopt those. Medyo mahal yung pang racing!

thanks anyway.

steve

[webmiester]

I recall we were manufacturing fuel tanks here locally na.Im wondering if a latero can make one safely.

So if Im only saving P9000/year, it will take me sometime to payback my LPG system... anyway, I really like the LPG system just the same. Our other vehicles would have benefitted better from them.

[ssalonga]

I recall we were manufacturing fuel tanks here locally na.Im wondering if a latero can make one safely.

So if Im only saving P9000/year, it will take me sometime to payback my LPG system... anyway, I really like the LPG system just the same. Our other vehicles would have benefitted better from them.

about the tank yes the local jeep manufacturers make some good tanks, I will check them out later this month....

As I said, its not for everyone, many guys I know converted even if it cost them more than what they could ever recover. Many 4x4 guys convert so their fuel delivery system doesn't fail in extreme terrain angles. Others just want to contribute to a reduction in greenhouse gases, since LPG presents the quickest, cheapest approach to an immediate reduction of effluents. That's the reason governments everywhere want their taxi and bus fleets converted to autogas and CNG.

Me, i love the high octane rating (103 to 105) and its clean even burn at low revs (something even fuel injected gasoline engines finds hard to do). It makes more torque, reduces stress and keeps the engine clean. It is also very good for turbo and supercharged engines (less knock with greater advance) due to its higher octane and better mixture characteristics under extreme pressure - the reason so many bike and rail dragsters are converting.

For these guys economy was their last consideration; performance, low pollution and longevity of the engine were their reasons -- and I guess as long as you enjoy it and it makes sense for your application-- then you should go for it!

cheers,

steve

[ghosthunter]

If you are on the cheap, why not just find a used scooter or motorbike fuel tank? With a few mods (for mounting purposes) it should do the job well.

[impulzz]

meron na bang nag convert ng CRV or vitara to lpg? saan ilalagay yung lpg tank?