Brand New Car - Scratches and Swirls All Over

[Ansatsuken]

I recently got a brand new Fortuner from this certain dealer in Metro Manila. I also opted to have paint protection installed inside the casa before the release (which the dealer offered, for a fee of course). When I saw the vehicle, it already had several hairline scratches and swirl marks all over. The agent acknowledged this but due to several reasons, I agreed to have the vehicle released to me. 5 days later, after much contemplating, I am requesting to have the dealer replace the vehicle. The vehicle is now parked at the dealership while I await their decision. What are my chances of having it replaced? Is it still in scope of the Lemon Law?

[MR_BIG18]

I recently got a brand new Fortuner from this certain dealer in Metro Manila. I also opted to have paint protection installed inside the casa before the release (which the dealer offered, for a fee of course). When I saw the vehicle, it already had several hairline scratches and swirl marks all over. The agent acknowledged this but due to several reasons, I agreed to have the vehicle released to me. 5 days later, after much contemplating, I am requesting to have the dealer replace the vehicle. The vehicle is now parked at the dealership while I await their decision. What are my chances of having it replaced? Is it still in scope of the Lemon Law?

i think not, they are just going to buff it, btw whats the color? black?

[MR_BIG18]

I recently got a brand new Fortuner from this certain dealer in Metro Manila. I also opted to have paint protection installed inside the casa before the release (which the dealer offered, for a fee of course). When I saw the vehicle, it already had several hairline scratches and swirl marks all over. The agent acknowledged this but due to several reasons, I agreed to have the vehicle released to me. 5 days later, after much contemplating, I am requesting to have the dealer replace the vehicle. The vehicle is now parked at the dealership while I await their decision. What are my chances of having it replaced? Is it still in scope of the Lemon Law?

i think not, they are just going to buff it, btw whats the color? black? what are the other reasons..?

[StockEngine]

In house paint protection... bad decision imo. You should've gone to other detailing experts

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[Ansatsuken]

i think not, they are just going to buff it, btw whats the color? black?

Color gray.

Who is at fault here? As far as I know, new vehicles come into the dealership very filthy, and they clean the car the moment it gets delivered to the casa. Those car wash guys probably used a single cloth to dry the entire vehicle, hence the swirls all over.

On the other hand, it could have been those guys who did the paint protection that scratched up the entire car.

Anyway, the dealership and I have already established that the vehicle was already scratched up even before the release. They say the paint protection guys will restore if I agreed - which I didn't. Asked for a replacement instead.

[eTups]

You can ask for also for an advice with DTI FTEB on this Sir...

Sent from my LG-H818 using Tapatalk

[Ansatsuken]

I actually returned the vehicle the very next day, and the paint protection guy tried buffing the hood, then reapplied paint protection. That same night, all scratches were still there upon inspection.

They had a guy from TMP earlier to check the thickness of the paint and clear coat. They said that brand new vehicles' paint have a thickness of 122 microns. The hood on mine now only has 118 microns - most likely as a result of the buffing, days earlier.

[Ansatsuken]

You can ask for also for an advice with DTI FTEB on this Sir...

Sent from my LG-H818 using Tapatalk

Thank you, Sir. Will do.

[MR_BIG18]

I actually returned the vehicle the very next day, and the paint protection guy tried buffing the hood, then reapplied paint protection. That same night, all scratches were still there upon inspection.

They had a guy from TMP earlier to check the thickness of the paint and clear coat. They said that brand new vehicles' paint have a thickness of 122 microns. The hood on mine now only has 118 microns - most likely as a result of the buffing, days earlier.

give us an update...

[dr. d]

I actually returned the vehicle the very next day, and the paint protection guy tried buffing the hood, then reapplied paint protection. That same night, all scratches were still there upon inspection.

They had a guy from TMP earlier to check the thickness of the paint and clear coat. They said that brand new vehicles' paint have a thickness of 122 microns. The hood on mine now only has 118 microns - most likely as a result of the buffing, days earlier.

so, despite the buffing and resultant thinning of the paint, the scratches were still there?
them scratches must be really deep. na-kakakapa ba ng kuko?

[homhomnova]

I think this will not be considered as lemon if the car is running fine. imo.

I am pretty sure as usual casa will just make promises to remove those scratches until the top coat completely wiped out but not the scratches.

If i were you, i'll just go to professional detailer to fix it and save the paint of your beloved brand new car.

Btw, i never availed any car wash or any other services from casa except the usual pms on the first 10k of my toyota cars. That's the most significant tip i got from the tsikot experts.

Casa mechanics and technicians "kuno" knows nothing about proper car maintenance. What they know is get your money alone.

[Lakwatsero]

Lemon Law isn't that wide scoping. Car manufacturers are given 3 tries iirc to rectify a problem before customer can push for a replacement unit. If the issue is paint, only thing they are obliged to do is repaint or detail if that will fix the problem.

If I were you, refund the payment for paint protection, let a detailer have a go at it, then charge the dealer for any trouble caused, and enjoy the car. Never ever have a dealer do anything with paint, detailing, or carwashing. They always find a way to screw things up.

[Ansatsuken]

Thanks for the replies.

The scratches are not deep, hindi nakakapa ng kuko, but deep enough kasi after buffing out 4 microns of clear coat, they're still there. Some hairline scratches are up to 2 feet long.

About the Lemon Law - the tricky part here is that the problem is the paint. No amount of "repairs" can really "fix" the "problem" because buffing the car will result to thinning of clear coat - which will shorten the lifespan of the car's gloss. They may offer to apply a new layer of clear coat, but to do so effectively, kailangan baklasin everything, and if they do that and put it all back together, how the hell can they say that the car is in brand new condition?

[danzen]

you might want to use the Consumer Act (on warranties) instead of the Lemon law sir... Lemon law requires 5 attempts before the dealer is mandated to replace or refund the purchase price (4th attempt - you must give a written notice[notice of availment] to the dealer and every attempt should be properly documented, after that you must still bring the vehicle for the 5th and final attempt and if the nonconformity is still there, you are entitled for replacement or refund)..

if you happen to file a complain with DTI, be sure to give a copy to the dealer and TMP. (might be faster that way if TMP was notified)

[Ansatsuken]

you might want to use the Consumer Act (on warranties) instead of the Lemon law sir... Lemon law requires 5 attempts before the dealer is mandated to replace or refund the purchase price (4th attempt - you must give a written notice[notice of availment] to the dealer and every attempt should be properly documented, after that you must still bring the vehicle for the 5th and final attempt and if the nonconformity is still there, you are entitled for replacement or refund)..

if you happen to file a complain with DTI, be sure to give a copy to the dealer and TMP. (might be faster that way if TMP was notified)

Hi sir, how will the Consumer Act help in my case more than the Lemon Law? Which part of the Consumer Act can I use to show TMP?

About nonconformity - due to the issue at hand (scratches everywhere), following basic logic, nonconformity will always be there even if they were given a hundred tries to fix the problem, unless the vehicle is sent back to the assembly line wherever it was manufactured, which I'm sure won't be the case.

[oj88]

I know the OP has every right to complain about the hairline scratches and all, but also consider that a perfect paint finish will never last for more than a few days... maybe a couple of weeks at most... especially if the vehicle is going to be used extensively. That's just a fact of life. With acres of surface area on an SUV, it's bound to get scratches sooner than you think. Anyway, if the scratch isn't at all obvious, I'd only go as far as asking for a rebate or refund on the new paint protection.

Lemon law? Fat chance. The complaint should have a substantial effect on the vehicle performance, value or safety (ie. under-performing brakes, stalling engine, abnormal noises, rust/corrosion under the paint, etc.) and one in which keeps coming back. They can repaint the panel and it will not affect its value since it's done at the dealer and it will never come up in your insurance.

[Ansatsuken]

I know the OP has every right to complain about the hairline scratches and all, but also consider that a perfect paint finish will never last for more than a few days... maybe a couple of weeks at most... especially if the vehicle is going to be used extensively. That's just a fact of life. With acres of surface area on an SUV, it's bound to get scratches sooner than you think. Anyway, if the scratch isn't at all obvious, I'd only go as far as asking for a rebate or refund on the new paint protection.

Lemon law? Fat chance. The complaint should have a substantial effect on the vehicle performance, value or safety (ie. under-performing brakes, stalling engine, abnormal noises, rust/corrosion under the paint, etc.) and one in which keeps coming back. They can repaint the panel and it will not affect its value since it's done at the dealer and it will never come up in your insurance.

They can't properly repaint the entire car without disassembling the doors, fenders, bumpers, etc., and if they dismantle the vehicle to do a proper repaint, then comes the obvious problem - they won't be able to put it back together to its brand new condition. Following that logic, it is technically impossible for the dealership to repaint the vehicle without substantially impairing its overall market value.

Or am I missing something here?

[danzen]

Hi sir, how will the Consumer Act help in my case more than the Lemon Law? Which part of the Consumer Act can I use to show TMP?

About nonconformity - due to the issue at hand (scratches everywhere), following basic logic, nonconformity will always be there even if they were given a hundred tries to fix the problem, unless the vehicle is sent back to the assembly line wherever it was manufactured, which I'm sure won't be the case.

well that's where it gets confusing because the issue was the paint.. i'm not really sure what is the advantage of the consumer act over the lemon law here because both laws provide the same remedies to the consumers. Consumer act(no repair attempts needed) is better than the lemon law in other cases because of the provision there that there is a need for several repair attempts..

Just try presenting your case to the DTI or dealer. I remember someone from DTI who told me that they once have a complain regarding bubbles on the paint of a brand new car and toyota replaced the unit. (not sure when did this happen).

Which part should you use? Use the provisions on warranty... Due to the scratches, the value of the brand new car had already deteriorated. Hope this helps.

[Ansatsuken]

well that's where it gets confusing because the issue was the paint.. i'm not really sure what is the advantage of the consumer act over the lemon law here because both laws provide the same remedies to the consumers. Consumer act(no repair attempts needed) is better than the lemon law in other cases because of the provision there that there is a need for several repair attempts..

Just try presenting your case to the DTI or dealer. I remember someone from DTI who told me that they once have a complain regarding bubbles on the paint of a brand new car and toyota replaced the unit. (not sure when did this happen).

Which part should you use? Use the provisions on warranty... Due to the scratches, the value of the brand new car had already deteriorated. Hope this helps.

Very helpful. Thank you very much, sir.

My agent actually tried to help me with a warranty claim during my 5th day of owning the car, but was subsequently denied. Maybe with this Consumer Act, there's a chance of something good for me happening. Just a very small chance, I'm afraid, but I'll still take it.

[danzen]

Very helpful. Thank you very much, sir.

My agent actually tried to help me with a warranty claim during my 5th day of owning the car, but was subsequently denied. Maybe with this Consumer Act, there's a chance of something good for me happening. Just a very small chance, I'm afraid, but I'll still take it.

or Try the services of FTEB maybe they can help you with something.