Are we more corrupt than other nationalities?

[bender]

I just read an article in Slate titled "The Case of the Unpaid Parking Ticket
Why some people cheat, and others don't." Among others, it states that "A society where most people are doing something useful has a good chance of being rich; a society full of corruption will be poor." I don't want to state the obvious answer where our society lies. You can read the entire article here.

I was interested in knowing the level of corruption of our country versus others. In New York, diplomatic immunity meant that parking tickets issued to diplomats would not be enforced. This means that any diplomat can park anywhere and not worry about getting a ticket. Given that there was nothing stopping them from committing a violation, it was only the personal ethics of the diplomats that was preventing them from doing so. Using the number of violations as a measure of corruption, a study of violations of diplomats from 146 countries was done. After going through that study, we ranked 53rd out of 146 where the most corrupt is Kuwait and the least corrupt is Turkey. Given that Indonesia is 24, Thailand is 32,China is 65, Singapore is 93, Malaysia is 113, South Korea is 119 and Japan is 140, we compare somewhat favorably against our neighbors but not really saints either.

The entire study can be read here in pdf format.

[OTO]

Expect a lot of people to call the researchers "racists" or "bigots". Pray that the Manila city govt doesnt get wind of this or they'll call the report ****ographic and ban it.

Kidding aside people break the rules because there is little or no consequence in this temporal plane of exhistance. We see our leaders blunder the national treasury and decades later no sentences have been dealt out and there are talks of compromise.

We bribe our kids with promises of toys, PS2s and fast&furious cars if they make the grade or at least graduate. We use our religious & family connections to get our way and to hell with the rest. I dont think it is corruption per se but Philippine culture mismo. We stop when we're caught and make excuses. "Mabait pong bata si Junior. Marunong makisama sa lahat ng bagay." That's the common defense of the mommy of the accused.

I know of of drug dealer who got caught with a hundreds of thousands of ecstasy. He should be still in Munti despite his sentence being commuted to life but I saw him watching "Superman Returns" in a mall. Another fellow whose brother is a virtuous "Christian" was also caught peddling **** (it even came out online) also got off scott free.

Without the eye of the outraged public little or nothing will stick so long as you got money.

[wildthing]

That questions strikes a hard truth on Pinoys heart....sabi nga sa isang song ng ASIN.."likas sa pilipino ang pagiging magnanakaw..."

So perhaps, if we can simply say that - NO WE DON'T STEAL ANYTHING if we really DON'T STEAL ANYTHING - like this list: oras sa trabaho, hide sweldo from the wifey/hubby, cheat on the wifey/hubby/gf, deceive the boss on real work status, pay the right taxes that we should be paying, and the list goes on (i like oto's "teaching bribery on kids")...

Thing is, it is really easy to point a finger to another individual or race or country....but can we point it to ourselves?!

just my thoughts.

[Jun aka Pekto]

and the least corrupt is Turkey.

That seems to reflect its people as a whole, too. I've been to Turkey and remember saying somewhere that the Turks are some of the most honest people in the world. I rather spend my vacation in Turkey than any of its European neighbors because of the friendly and honest people.

[Flagg]

Aww sir jun, masaya din ang vacation dito, friendly din naman people... mura lang naman ang bribe e. Mga $2, hari ka na...

[OTO]

Kaso na lang we're proud of Pinoy values that are easily twisted to malicious ends. But then again graft & corruption are useful too. Imagine you're in a govt office and you need documents to be processed ASAP. Normal processing time may takes days but with a bit of grease money you get all the docs in a mere minutes.

When I have kids I'd empart to them values I feel would help our society. They may be alien to traditinal ways of thinking but it'll make our world a bit better./

[B2Bomber]

no. imho mas nafofocus lang siguro sa atin (dahil sa bigotry or steretyping) or baka mas bulgar lang tayo (siguro, thinking na di yun some sort of corruption) but then I'd say mas may mga talamak pa dyan na di ko na babanggitin. the thing is may mga part lang kasi ng kultura natin as stated in an earlier post na "naaabuso" like "pakikisama" and "utang na loob".

[redorange]

Just my opinion as Filipino-American having lived in both countries. It's funny and weird that Filipinos complain about corruption in government, but when a foreigner makes a comment it’s called bigotry/racism. Until Filipinos learn to accept constructive criticism the problem will continue. This forum alone is a good example of Filipino society, when a thread is started about getting caught by the police for a violation real or not other members encourage the payment of bribes because it is cheaper than paying the fine. Paying bribe money to government employees does not encourage government employees to do the job that the Filipino taxpayer is paying them to do. Filipinos always find a way to rationalize their actions even if illegal as long as they personally get some benefit. However, when they go to another country Filipinos know how to follow the law because if they don’t they can’t bride their way out of it.

[Jun aka Pekto]

the thing is may mga part lang kasi ng kultura natin as stated in an earlier post na "naaabuso" like "pakikisama" and "utang na loob".

That's true. While we were in Antalya Turkey, my wife's (then) Philippine passport was going to expire while we were vacationing. We had to take a bus to Ankara and arrived at the Philippine Consulate very early at sun up. The people there let us in at the back where we had breakfast with the staff. Kinda weird seeing them in shorts, sando, and tsinelas. But, they were happy to see other fellow Pinoys. They then gave my wife a new passport plus the visa from the old passport.

Edit, in this case, no abuse. The staff bent over backwards to accomodate us. It may not be the official way of doing things. They could've made us wait outside. But, they saw who we were and showed that good ol Philippine hospitality. We paid what we had to for the passport. But, no bribes, no politics. We were just Pinoys in a foreign land.

[Flagg]

Ay sus, kahit saan may ganun. Yung USA kunwari malinis e may dagdag/bawas din naman dun... Diba, sa Florida run-off nanalo si Bush courtesy of brother Gov. Jeb Bush.

[oldblue]

siguro tignan na lang natin pag pinadala mga pinoy drivers (public & private) sa America at gawin diplomat.

[empy]

i think all nationalities are born with the same tendencies for dishonesty and corruption. it's the environment and the opportunities that make it more or less.

for example, from my personal observations pinoys who have grown up here in the US are neither more or less dishonest than people of other races. by the same token, i'd like to see the americans, brits, indians, chinese, etc. who grew up in the Philippines and see if they are better or worse than the native pinoys.

[redorange]

i think all nationalities are born with the same tendencies for dishonesty and corruption. it's the environment and the opportunities that make it more or less.

for example, from my personal observations pinoys who have grown up here in the US are neither more or less dishonest than people of other races. by the same token, i'd like to see the americans, brits, indians, chinese, etc. who grew up in the Philippines and see if they are better or worse than the native pinoys.

I agree that enviroment plays a major part but the question becomes, why does the Philippine enviroment encourage these tendencies? Are Filipinos more corrupt? No, but they are not far from the top either, just ask anyone arriving into the country after they get asked for a bribe by the Customs offical. Can it be fixed? Sure with every generation there is always hope to change this if it starts at home.

[mazdamazda]

i think all nationalities are born with the same tendencies for dishonesty and corruption. it's the environment and the opportunities that make it more or less.

I agree.

For the Americans... think Enron. For the Koreans... think chaebols. For the Caribbeans... think about laundered money. For the South Americas... think about drug production. For Nigeria... think about email hoaxes. And so on and so forth. Every nation is always embroiled in some sort of scandal at any given time.

It is just that Filipinos are always gagging on their own self-pity (e.g. we are the most corrupt, we have the highest crime rate, foreign investments are down, blah-blah-blah) instead of trying to bring about change to themselves and the government. Filipinos have a vision of a messianic saviour who will single-handedly end corruption and start the Philippine's Golden Era - which is just plain BS.

[redorange]

I agree.

For the Americans... think Enron. For the Koreans... think chaebols. For the Caribbeans... think about laundered money. For the South Americas... think about drug production. For Nigeria... think about email hoaxes. And so on and so forth. Every nation is always embroiled in some sort of scandal at any given time.

It is just that Filipinos are always gagging on their own self-pity (e.g. we are the most corrupt, we have the highest crime rate, foreign investments are down, blah-blah-blah) instead of trying to bring about change to themselves and the government. Filipinos have a vision of a messianic saviour who will single-handedly end corruption and start the Philippine's Golden Era - which is just plain BS.

Good example with the Americans and Koreans but in both instances they were prosecuted for their crimes. Even when a Japanese or Korean Prime Minister is found to be involved in corruption they resign to save face and later prosecuted. Do you see Erap, GMA, et al doing the same? When pigs fly they will and then you have to make sure they don't steal the furniture from the Palace. Corruption exist in other countries it's just that when it is found they are prosecuted and jailed, in the Philippines they stay in power and flaunt how much money they have stolen.

[1D4LV]

i think all nationalities are born with the same tendencies for dishonesty and corruption. it's the environment and the opportunities that make it more or less.

for example, from my personal observations pinoys who have grown up here in the US are neither more or less dishonest than people of other races. by the same token, i'd like to see the americans, brits, indians, chinese, etc. who grew up in the Philippines and see if they are better or worse than the native pinoys.

i strongly agree with this. when i was assigned in china for a year, i've heard na meron ding corruption sa china, specially for large scale government infrastructural projects. yun nga lang sila hindi ladlaran kasi pag nahuli, firing squad.

dito sa pilipinas. parang part of life na ng mga officials natin ang "lagay". suppliers allocate a portion of their proposal figures as percentages for "lagay", etc. we are all aware that government officials do it, but we don't do anything.

sa states where i got to work for a year, meron din, specially on a local government scale. gaya nga ng sabi ni M54P, it would depend on the environment and opportunities.

[Flagg]

Sir M54, for excellent American behaviour in the Philippines, pls go to Fields Ave. beside Clark...

For Euro/British behaviour: Burgos St., Makati City

For Japanese behaviour: Pasay City

For Filipino behaviour: pls go to sir M2's gf thread at goon squad...

[wildthing]

sir flagg, wrong info ka...hindi na po amerikano ang pinakamataas na population ng nasa fields, clark....mostly germans and aussies na po.

[Gumusut_Amige]

We can exhaust and utter all the words to put across our displeasure but, reality is it's no clandestine that even us are sometimes not observing the normal protocol in dealing these government agencies. Let's state the premise that if we have a business dealing in a certain government agency and we know very well that we have an insider or connection inside, our old virtue or tendency dictates to approach them not to say hi/hello only but to get their help to speed up our deals. Albeit we didn't gave them anything after our dealing, we still twisted the right system that was long established and pity those guys who strictly followed the normal procedures. It's really good to hear someday that these so-called services rendered are audited or controlled by someone responsibly.

Have the same opinion to the earlier posters that the change shall begin from within ourselves not counting what others are doing. IMO, some of our "government servants" are really finishing their day as clock watchers and not looking to finish all those stacked works. They do have a choice to be efficient but... they choose to be... going back to the topic.

[KoKoNAT]

Being 'corrupt' is not endemic to any particular race. Thinking otherwise and you risk of doing generalisation. Generalisation is just one step to racial profiling.

We are no more inclined to be corrupt than any other person in this planet. Corruption, or doing bad things in general, is rampant and widespread in the Philippines only because the society tolerates it. The public tolerates it because either (a) it is doesn't care, or (b) it does care but is powerless to act on it.

Put a Filipino in a country that has no tolerance for bad behaviour and what does he do? Most likely he'll be a model of good behaviour, following rules like most everyone in that country. Is he corrupt because he is still Filipino?

If a foreign businessman in the Philippines breaks our laws, making bribes left and right, flouting environmental and moral codes, is he not corrupt simply because he is not Filipino?

That being said, if you really want to know which country is more corrupt, you have to go to every country and experience the society for yourself. Then your judgement can now be based on actual experience, and not by a cold article. Because doing otherwise is unfair...unfair and unjust to the country you just judged as corrupt because you read in some obscure article that they are more corrupt than anyone else.