Venezuela Takes Control of Oil Fields

[Isuzoom]

peace.....bomb hugo

[wildthing]

typical pinoys... everything or anything ANTI-AMERICAN is still considered 100% evil, anarchy, communist...

Save America!!! (while america doesn't even care a damn about pinoy's or any third world country).

How I love this country (USA)!!! (in a sarcastic way)

If people can only look "closely" on the government rulings, policies and acts of USA, one would see that all of their intensions was to save their (USA) ass and not their offended third world "partners".


sabi nga sa isang chant ng mga aktibista - "diktaturang US.... ibagsak, ibagsak!!!"

[GasJunkie]

For the love of god give the man some meds.




:fly:

[mazdamazda]

hahahaha... why did this turn out to be an anti-american topic when most of the oil investors in venezuela are europeans? :bwahaha:

[niky]

i thought you're way smarter than this...

Does a ten year old need an excuse to watch mindless drivel on TV? Oh, yeah... two of my favorite things on TV when I was a kid besides Sesame Street were televangelists and pro wrestling. You might say that when I found out the truth about both (televangelists and wrestlers, I mean, not Sesame Street... I always knew they were puppets), my outlook on those issues became a little more... realistic.

That's the last post I'm making off-topic.

-----

*wildthing: I don't know what your beef is, man. This isn't a "rah-rah-I-love-America" thread (despite what oldblue might say... ). It's a discussion of whether Hugo Chavez has the right or is right in his decision to nationalize his oil industry.

As a recap: yes, maybe he has the right (it's his country, after all...) but is it right? What does it mean for us consumers?

And why resort to violent rhetoric and not stick to the facts? That's the whole reason that I soured of the activist scene in my years at UP. Every time we protest something, for protesting's sake, they have to turn it into a political issue... push their own damn agenda.

Do you know how freaking frustrating it is being a liberal, and not liking what the government is doing, and yet feeling constrained against joining the rallies simply because the communists will be there? How many times some idiot neo-conservative has labelled me a "commie"? (If this weren't the internet, I would've punched his lights out) How many times I've talked a leftist into a circular argument, where they couldn't defend their views and returned to the same point, again and again... the UP-Mall debate was enlightening. Nemenzo (former Chancellor, former activist) was pointing out how the Government was subsidizing our tuition fees (to the tune of 200% of what the students were paying) and would be withdrawing this in the future, and how a long-term lease of commercial land outside the campus would help cover what Congress would take away. What was the activist's answer? "Basta! Mali ang commercialization!" Pure B.S.. Look wher the "iskos" are now... paying three times as much, simply because UP doesn't have the money to subsidize them anymore!

I've seen police beat up nuns and priests, tear gas crowds of students... simply because the "activists" in the back of the crowd started throwing rocks (I don't know if concrete chunks the size of a beach ball count as boulders). It's their favorite tactic. Get some innocent-looking people up front... start trouble, and enjoy the media frenzy from showing how "fascist" our government is... arresting nuns and priests who didn't do anything.

In other rallies, they do their best to make it appear that all of us were there because of them. Ri-i-ight. Appoint themselves spokespersons for everyone there. Hey, I thought we were supposed to be protesting the lack of security that got that student killed... not the government...

It's a favorite communist party trick. Putting "us" against "them". Making people choose between a rock and a hard place. What if neither choice appeals to me?

So, why defend Chavez? benefit of the doubt? Or simply because he's Anti-American, and anything Anti-American, or more directly, anti-neo-conservative and anti-Bush, is a good thing? So I'm supposed to love Saddam Hussein and Fidel Castro?

Don't project your own prejudices on the matter upon us all. Some people might be against Chavez because of his anti-US stance, but some of us are not.

Let's stick to the facts. (and that means you, too, oldblue and the others).

[mazdamazda]

Sory Moderator.

China's secures oil from African states:

http://www.cfr.org/publication/9557/

Errr - what does this have do with the said topic?

[empy]

Really?

Btw, stop using profanity... tsk tsk

yup, i expected this. personal attack, and then a comment about one single word in my post, while completely avoiding any semblance of intelligent discourse.

go f--- yourself. is that better?

[torque2006]

:popcorn:

basta ako :war:

[uls]

Errr - what does this have do with the said topic?

China is forming economic and political ties with some african countries... some of which are not exactly friends with the US. Sudan in particular.

A number of world leaders are currently doing stuff that get on Washington's nerves.

Putin, Kim, Ahmadinejad, Chavez...

I feel this has something to do with the topic.

[mazdamazda]

China is forming economic and political ties with some african countries... some of which are not exactly friends with the US. Sudan in particular.

A number of world leaders are currently doing stuff that get on Washington's nerves.

Putin, Kim, Ahmadinejad, Chavez...

I feel this has something to do with the topic.

Well... China is different from Venezuela. China only forms ties only because of one thing: OIL.

For example, Sudan. Most countries have placed economic sanctions against Sudan for the government sponsored genocide that happened there. On the other hand, China will overlook these human rights violations just for the sake of oil.

But this is OT already though.

[mazdamazda]

another update...

Chavez threatens to close a non-government TV station by not renewing its expiring license.

[GasJunkie]

^^^^

agree, just look at our gov't owned networks. :blech:




:fly:


edit ad revenue FTW

[Asus700]

Does a ten year old need an excuse to watch mindless drivel on TV? Oh, yeah... two of my favorite things on TV when I was a kid besides Sesame Street were televangelists and pro wrestling. You might say that when I found out the truth about both (televangelists and wrestlers, I mean, not Sesame Street... I always knew they were puppets), my outlook on those issues became a little more... realistic.

in reply to ot:

i said that, because what most people and that includes you, fail to see is that when watching this people, never focus on them but rather on who and what they talk about and that is the Lord Jesus. you seemed to have focus on them a lot and from admiring them (since you said you watched them a lot) you began to be disilussioned when all the scandals came out.

if your faith (if you had one) had been focus on the right object, you would not have felt the way you feel right now about these people.

you, just like a lot of people are quick to jump into conclusions and brand them as wolf etc. when we dont really know what's in their hearts, let us leave it to God, and he will deal with them accordingly.

what we have seen from these people is that just like everybody else, they are not perfect. none of God's servant has achieved perfection and none of them will.

moses, samson, david, peter, all have shortcomings, and the bible made sure their mistakes, sins are highlighted so that we can see that they are but human beings. what's important is how they got back up again. Only Jesus was perfect.

I wonder what would have happened if the media got a wind of david's sin against batsheba? fortunately for him, electronic media was not yet available then.

now back to topic.

[Asus700]

about chavez,

when God wants to bless you, he sends you enemies....

chavez has a special disliking for the US. Just like the president of iran, he is very vocal of his hatred of the US and Bush in particular.

with his actions of taking control of the oil refineries and closing down stations and stuff, he seems to be saying, "come on, US, try to come down here and take me down if you can."

the US learned a lot from history.

Franklin roosevelt once asked winston churchill what he thinks of ww2, what he will call it.

churchill responded by saying " i would call it the unnecessary war."

"Why?" asked rooselvelt.

"because we saw that hitler was going to be a problem and if we had the courage to take action and took him down early, the world would not have been plunge into a war and 50 million lives should not have been lost".

[GasJunkie]

So what you're saying is that the americans' are gods personal ninja???



:fly:


edit must be nice to be able to think of an afterlife free of problems, no??? escapism FTMFW!!!!!

[wildthing]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hugo_chavez

this would explain why Hugo Chavez is an a$$hoe to others and a robinhood to others...

[niky]

in reply to ot:

i said that, because what most people and that includes you, fail to see is that when watching this people, never focus on them but rather on who and what they talk about and that is the Lord Jesus. you seemed to have focus on them a lot and from admiring them (since you said you watched them a lot) you began to be disilussioned when all the scandals came out.

if your faith (if you had one) had been focus on the right object, you would not have felt the way you feel right now about these people.

you, just like a lot of people are quick to jump into conclusions and brand them as wolf etc. when we dont really know what's in their hearts, let us leave it to God, and he will deal with them accordingly.

what we have seen from these people is that just like everybody else, they are not perfect. none of God's servant has achieved perfection and none of them will.

moses, samson, david, peter, all have shortcomings, and the bible made sure their mistakes, sins are highlighted so that we can see that they are but human beings. what's important is how they got back up again. Only Jesus was perfect.

I wonder what would have happened if the media got a wind of david's sin against batsheba? fortunately for him, electronic media was not yet available then.

now back to topic.

I don't want to stray that far off-topic, but:

Don't presume to know me. (this is not confrontational... just fact).

I did listen to what they said. As a child, I listened whole-heartedly and believingly.

As an adult, now, I listen and watch with a critical ear and eye. I have long since passed the point at which I take things at face value, and my faith, whether it be with your God, their God or my own, has nothing to do with my disbelief in televangelists.

Should we not focus on their lives? Should we listen to them say these things and their begging for alms (which made them quite rich, and which still works for lots of religious "leaders" today) and turn a blind eye to the hypocrisy of those who say they stand for the faith?

I'm not anti-God or anti-Morality. I'm anti-organized religion. Any time anyone tells you to follow them blindly... and lots of people do so... you follow at the peril of your soul.

The message is not what comes out of their mouths. But their entire being.... their lives.

The nice thing about the Old Testament is that it acknowledged the weaknesses of old leaders and kings. Showed how even the most pure could run down the path to corruption and evil... But the Bible does not ask us to follow or worship them, but to learn from their examples and shun the path they've taken.

Does it not also warn us to be wary of the "Anti-Christ"? I'm not a Bible scholar myself, but the passages relating to the Anti-Christ apply very well to many of our modern "evangelists".

God (whatever his nature is, and whether he exists or not) gave us brains. If we ignore that gift and follow our leaders blindly to whatever evil they direct us to do, then that's our own fault.

[Asus700]

I don't want to stray that far off-topic, but:

Don't presume to know me. (this is not confrontational... just fact).

I did listen to what they said. As a child, I listened whole-heartedly and believingly.

As an adult, now, I listen and watch with a critical ear and eye. I have long since passed the point at which I take things at face value, and my faith, whether it be with your God, their God or my own, has nothing to do with my disbelief in televangelists.

Should we not focus on their lives? Should we listen to them say these things and their begging for alms (which made them quite rich, and which still works for lots of religious "leaders" today) and turn a blind eye to the hypocrisy of those who say they stand for the faith?

I'm not anti-God or anti-Morality. I'm anti-organized religion. Any time anyone tells you to follow them blindly... and lots of people do so... you follow at the peril of your soul.

The message is not what comes out of their mouths. But their entire being.... their lives.

The nice thing about the Old Testament is that it acknowledged the weaknesses of old leaders and kings. Showed how even the most pure could run down the path to corruption and evil... But the Bible does not ask us to follow or worship them, but to learn from their examples and shun the path they've taken.

Does it not also warn us to be wary of the "Anti-Christ"? I'm not a Bible scholar myself, but the passages relating to the Anti-Christ apply very well to many of our modern "evangelists".

God (whatever his nature is, and whether he exists or not) gave us brains. If we ignore that gift and follow our leaders blindly to whatever evil they direct us to do, then that's our own fault.

its obvious from your statement that you dont fully believe in God, his existence, which explains you position. i respect that.

i thought for a moment that you do and are just critical.

no, we should not follow them blindly, we were told to check from the scriptures the things they say: does it line up? i dont care about the personality of the person who teaches, whether he is popular or highly endorsed by whoever, i'm going to check from the scriptures if what he teaches agrees with the principle of the scripture.

anyway, im sure that seeds have been sown into your heart by at one time listening to these people and hopefuly those seeds will later bear fruit, good fruit.

[boybi]

People of Tsikot, please stay on topic and don't make this thread into a religious debate. :police:

[GasJunkie]

We need more ninjas.




:rofl01: