Cornering

[Carrie Tella]

Good morning. It was said that you avoid braking while cornering. Why? Recently, I found an advice which says that it is better to brake while cornering. Which is the better advice?
Thanks.
:tumbleweed:

[mbeige]

What kind of car? A FWD car can brake while cornering and have no problems, while a RWD car might spin out if it brakes while cornering. Some RWD cars even have lift off oversteer, done by just letting off the accelerator to induce oversteer.

[niky]

Where'd you find that advice? That guy should have his nuts chopped off and his license revoked. (oh, okay, revoking his license might be a little harsh).

It is always best to brake in a straight line. Braking while cornering can lead to lots of nasty situations:

1. Braking while the car is turning can lead to snap-oversteer (it'll spin). While this might help in an autocross, on the road, you want the car to maintain the same attitude. If your car is understeering (it's not turning through the turn), you can use the brakes to trim the line... but if you're understeering, that means you're driving too fast through the turn.

2. Turning under heavy braking can lead to one of two things:

a. On a non-ABS equipped car, the extra angle of the front wheels can lead to reduced braking efficiency, heavy understeer, and a very long stop (you'll stop when you've hit whatever it is you were trying to avoid.

b. On an ABS-equipped car, it is possible to spin out or run off the road... See... when you're in an emergency, you panic... you hit the brakes, you steer. The brakes lock, so steering does nothing, you steer more... then the ABS kicks in... suddenly, the car shoots off in the direction you're steering to... but since you've added more steering, you veer off sharply to the side and possibly off the road.

Newer ABS algorithms may prevent such catastrophes, but you shouldn't rely on them... You should always... always brake first, then turn. While it's perfectly safe to brake lightly into a turn on a dry road... any amount of braking in a turn on a wet or dusty road is dangerous.

[niky]

BTW: any car can oversteer on lift-off or in braking into a corner... I've done it myself... and I've seen quite a few people spin on their first trip to the Batangas Race Circuit because they didn't know enough to not trailbrake on those bends.

It's just that on cheap, original equipment tires, most modern cars tend to understeer more.

[drey]

Yup, not unless if your car is equipped with ABS, EBS, TCS etc. The tendency to oversteer would be lessened. But take note, you can't bend the law of physics. So it is better to brake in a straight line before entering a curve. This is what racer's do... But I am exempted in computer games. :lol:

[ghosthunter]

You can practice your cornering with safety in the latest driving games. They can simulate the driving physics pretty accurately. Just get a car model as close to the one you normally drive.

[ghosthunter]

Good morning. It was said that you avoid braking while cornering. Why? Recently, I found an advice which says that it is better to brake while cornering. Which is the better advice?
Thanks.

If entering the corner at high speed, you brake while cornering, you have two possible scenarios:

1. you can possibly loose control of your car since it will understeer. You will skid off the road, hit the tree beside the road and then you die.

2. you can possibly loose control of your car since it will oversteer. You will skid off the road backwards, hit the tree beside the road and then you die.

So, in that light, it is best to brake BEFORE the corner. Even with all the electronic aids like anti-lock brakes, electronic stability control, electronic traction control, etc cannot out-perform a driver who will take proper precaution when entering a corner.

Also when going through a corner, it is advisable to be as smooth with your steering and throttle inputs to maintain the car's balance through the curve.

[Horsepower]

I don't know if this is right but I normally brake upon approach of the curve and step on the gas moderately inside the bend then flat out when i get to the straight...

[niky]

Tama naman.

Brake on the approach, only initiate turning once the weight has shifted and the car is already slowing down...

Step on the gas at the apex or just after, then floor it once straightened out on the exit.

On the racetrack, as you get more comfortable with the turns and your car, you can start to brake later, experiment with trimming your line with the brakes, experiment with getting on the gas a bit earlier, correcting oversteer with gas (FWD) or correcting understeer or inducing a drift with the gas (RWD)... or experiment initiating a neutral four wheel drift with some trail-braking to overcome understeer (any kind of car).

But it's not something you should play with on the road if there's a possibility of killing someone besides yourself...

[170kphlang]

normally ginagawa ko ay release sa gas pedal para bumaba yung momentum then bago magapproach ay downshift nalang, pero i could be wrong hehe...

[safeorigin]

+1 to message above. make sure you have your insurance signed, last will written, your girl scored, etc if you're planning to do it on public road. make sure you limit the casualties to yourself if you do.

[mbeige]

Be really careful when flooring it mid-turn when the road is wet. I did this one time and my car downshifted to the next lower gear, the rear wheels spun, and the tail flipped out. Good thing the car had good balance and I countersteered as I exited the turn.

So there came a time when it was once again rainy, late at night and nobody was around. The left arrow was green and I had good momentum. Needless to say it was probably weird to see a diesel drifting in the rain making a corner. Buti walang pulis

[wewoy_romero]

well, i sometimes brake lightly when tackling medium to slightly sharp corners. pero slow speed na ako nun, around 20kph na ata, basta nasa 2nd gear speed lang.

pero pag yung mga wide corners or highway corners, i just lift my foot off the gas way before the corner to slow down the car.

pag straight na yung car, saka na lang ulit ako umaapak sa gas.

car is a fwd with abs, btw.

[monsrick]

well, i sometimes brake lightly when tackling medium to slightly sharp corners. pero slow speed na ako nun, around 20kph na ata, basta nasa 2nd gear speed lang.

pero pag yung mga wide corners or highway corners, i just lift my foot off the gas way before the corner to slow down the car.

pag straight na yung car, saka na lang ulit ako umaapak sa gas.

car is a fwd with abs, btw.

Same din po for me!

[safeorigin]

hmmm... well if you feel that your car is understeering, try brake drifting then countersteer a bit if the car's rear is already "floating". now i'd wish i have 4 wheel steering in my car.

[Auto_Xer]

It is better to brake in a "straight" line.
The straight line may not necessarily the path the road takes.
Braking in a straight line maximizes the grip potential of all 4 tires and provides the most predictable braking characteristics.
Trail braking(braking while cornering) is a more advanced technique which drivers of higher skill employ when they are going into a corner too fast. It requires you to ease off or modulate the brakes while going into a corner.

[meledson]

For us (well most of us) na non-racers, our safest practice (during high speeds) is to brake before the corner not during the corner.

[stelvio]

it is possible to brake and corner at the same time. what matters is the degree at which you will take it. a normal car has in approximation about .7 to .8g of grip which applies to both braking and cornering. the trick is how to share this available grip to both variables. if ur braking at .8g and you try to turn the steering wheel, like when ur entering a corner and you maintain the same pressure on the brakes, you will either spin out or understeer depending on your vehicle's configuration. if you're cornering at .8g and you apply .3g of brakes, you will get the same result. if ur cornering at .6g, then it is possible to make minute adjustments to your speed by applying your brakes, but no more than .1 or .2gs of braking and you will not spin out. the fastest way through a corner is by trail braking (at least in circuit racing), where you burn off excess speed by max braking before entering a corner, then trail off the brakes as you pick up the cornering forces simultaneously. to give you a better idea of g forces, the amount of strain on your neck while lying on your side with your head off the bed is exactly 1g

[cardo]

nalilito pa rin ako sa understeer and oversteer

[niky]

Understeer - you hit the tree headfirst.

Oversteer - you hit the tree buttfirst.