Remote bypass oil filtration

[asher25]

[QUOTE=locoroco777;1795192]wala sila stock sa pacer bro...so I guess I'll settle with baldwin nalang....[/QUOTEl;

last time nag inquire ako ng LF16267 oil filter para sa trooper 4jx1 yung ibinigay titan gold LF16370xl = p400 kaya kinuha ko na.. ang sabi under din daw sa fleetguard at mas good quality kaysa sa vic... dalawa nga ung kinuha pati yung secondary filter dalawa rin na lf3462 = p200 hirap mag hanap d2 sa amin ng good quaility filter..... para may stock..........next time baldwin naman gagamitin ko...

BAldwin filter price sa VOLMAX
BD7160 - p545
BD28 - p850 at donaldson P551343 same ng bD28...ito sana gamitin ko sa trooper kaso dua-l flow lube yung sa akin is full flow lang...
B2 - p225 for toyota engine
b143 - p190

Fleetguard filter price sa F n E iolio
mitsubishi engine pwdey kaya 2 sa trooper? same thread naman mas malaki lang ang OD..
Lf3564 - p790
Lf3746 - p900+
lf3918 - p1100+
ff5229 - 750 repalcement for vic fc 326
bf7838 = 800+

ito ang gmit ko sa 4dr5 offroader na jeep namin ff5087 - p320, ff5114 - p280
lf3407-545...

[locoroco777]

sir what do you mean by dual flow and it wouldn't work because yours is full flow?


BTW, buti pa dun sa iloilo may LF 3918 na microglass...dito manila wala....

[dvldoc]

Here's the deal you have a full flow filter which it means it filters 100% of the oil all the time, Then you have a dual flow filter also known as a bypass filter. A bypass filter will have two filter elements in it. The second element in fleetguards is a stacked disk, as well as most of the other high end filters.

If your vehicle uses a fuel flow filter you cannot put a combo/dual flow filter on there. Your engine is not designed for that and you can run into some serious oil pressure problems. The combo/dual flow filters redirect about 10% to 15% of the oil to the second filter element for much finer filtration.

Here is a example of a Baldwin dual flow.



And the kind you would find on say a 4M40 engine.




Now you can see the big difference of a regular full flow on this Donaldson and OEM Toyota (note the quality difference in filters OEM vs a heavy duty filter)



Don't think I would use that OEM for 10000klm maybe 5000. Dondaldson vs a OEM Toyota is no comparison.

[locoroco777]

Ahhhh I see now, so its like the system you've done on your elgrand only on a compact scale?

So How would I know if my 4m41 will accept the bd28 bypass filter? is there a way of knowing it before buying the filter?

[dvldoc]

Just so others know first you need to double check what filter is the stock one. Second cross reference and look up the specs then you will know what you need.

Use this site. JS Filters :: Product Catalogue

As you can see these will fit your vehicle and it says full flow. The older 4M40 and 4D56 are much dirtier engines that's why they have a bypass system because a standard full flow will not do a good enough job on them.

BALDWIN B173-S


Descriptions: Full-Flow Lube Spin-on
Contains: Anti-Drainback Valve
20 PSID By-Pass Valve
Fits: AMC, Chrysler, Eagle, Hyundai, Isuzu, Mitsubishi Automotive, Light-Duty Trucks
Replaces: Chrysler 4186267
Thread: M20 x 1.5
O.D.: 3 11/16 (93.7)

You can also use any of those fleetguard ones listed on the JS filter site. Just make sure it's a real one.

[12vdc]

Filtration efficiency is affected by flowrate/ pressure..

More flow = less filtration

Less flow = more filtration

In bypass filtration, a small orifice in the filter-head redirects SOME oil to the bypass filter.. This means that bypass filters are designed to operate in low pressure/ partial flow only.

Bypass Filter is designed to operate in conjunction with the Full-flow filter.

[Ry_Tower]

Ahhhh I see now, so its like the system you've done on your elgrand only on a compact scale?

So How would I know if my 4m41 will accept the bd28 bypass filter? is there a way of knowing it before buying the filter?

BD7028 para sa 4m41 mo sir, same sa 4m40.

[dvldoc]

You are correct. Looks like the JS filter site has a bug in the system or there is a gas 3.2 engine for the Pajero as well. When you look it up by vehicle you get this.

MITSUBISHI » Pajero IV / Shogun / Challenger // MONTERO
03.07~ 3200 V88W, ... C304J

When you look it up by the OEM number which is ME013307 you get this

MITSUBISHI » Pajero IV / Shogun / Challenger // MONTERO
03.07~ 3200 V88W, ... C313J

There must be some difference in the engines maybe one is a petrol version then again I am only guessing what vehicle he has since it's the 4M41 I am assuming Pajaro.

I know the OEM number is right and that's what Baldwin pulls up so go with it.

You can also use FLEETGUARD LF3830 or Titangold LF16859XL

BD28 (has different gasket) i would check the fit first.
Descriptions: Dual-Flow Lube Spin-on
Contains: Anti-Drainback Valve
20 PSID By-Pass Valve
Fits: Ford Light-Duty Trucks
Replaces: Ford E5TZ-6731-A
Thread: M26 x 1.5
O.D.: 3 11/16 (93.7)
Length: 5 3/8 (136.5)


BD7028
Descriptions: Dual-Flow Lube Spin-on
Contains: 20 PSID By-Pass Valve
Fits: Kobelco Excavators; Mitsubishi Engines, Trucks
Replaces: Mitsubishi ME013307
Thread: M26 x 1.5
O.D.: 4 1/4 (108.0)
Length: 5 27/32 (148.4)
I. Gskt.: G401

[locoroco777]

BD7028 para sa 4m41 mo sir, same sa 4m40.

Yup bro Im aware of that, but since it has the same thread size, as what dvldoc said it will fit... and besides theres no available 7028 in volmax hehe

what I mean with "if it will accept" is that if the bypass filter will work well with the 4m41....I know it will fit but what am I asking if will it work fine? considering that I'am not aware if the engine is only compatilble with full flow filters alone or will it work well with a bypass type also...

hahaha! nahirapan na ko dito sa thread....dumudugo na ilong ko...:bwahaha:

You are correct. Looks like the JS filter site has a bug in the system or there is a gas 3.2 engine for the Pajero as well. When you look it up by vehicle you get this.

MITSUBISHI » Pajero IV / Shogun / Challenger // MONTERO
03.07~ 3200 V88W, ... C304J

When you look it up by the OEM number which is ME013307 you get this

MITSUBISHI » Pajero IV / Shogun / Challenger // MONTERO
03.07~ 3200 V88W, ... C313J

There must be some difference in the engines maybe one is a petrol version then again I am only guessing what vehicle he has since it's the 4M41 I am assuming Pajaro.

I know the OEM number is right and that's what Baldwin pulls up so go with it.

You can also use FLEETGUARD LF3830 or Titangold LF16859XL

BD28 (has different gasket) i would check the fit first.
Descriptions: Dual-Flow Lube Spin-on
Contains: Anti-Drainback Valve
20 PSID By-Pass Valve
Fits: Ford Light-Duty Trucks
Replaces: Ford E5TZ-6731-A
Thread: M26 x 1.5
O.D.: 3 11/16 (93.7)
Length: 5 3/8 (136.5)


BD7028
Descriptions: Dual-Flow Lube Spin-on
Contains: 20 PSID By-Pass Valve
Fits: Kobelco Excavators; Mitsubishi Engines, Trucks
Replaces: Mitsubishi ME013307
Thread: M26 x 1.5
O.D.: 4 1/4 (108.0)
Length: 5 27/32 (148.4)
I. Gskt.: G401

I've checked all the available filters that appeared when I counter checked doc , for FG the LF3918/Lf3830/LF3564 for Baldwin BD28/BD7028 for donaldson its P551343 and for Titan Gold LF16859XL...

I've even called all the shops that offers it.....and Unlucky me, I was only able to find the BD28 and the donaldson one in volmax... So now after the long successful hunt with the BD28 suddenly the full flow vs. Bypass has been raised and my truck is already due for PMS....So frustrating because my truck is already due for a PMS....Anonther Plus is when you posted about the mishaps in oil pressure when you put a bypass filter in an engine wherein it only accept full flow filters...

So doc, Would you know if the 4m41 woudl work well for both Full Flow and Bypass? or it will only work with one? If yes which of the two will it be? full flow or bypass?


Im truly grateful with all the help...kudos to you dvldoc!

[asher25]

it's getting deeeeeeepeeer, but very interesting topic for us'.....same here i'm also confused about dual filter will its going to work well in trooper 4jx1 or not? as of now i'll stick with full flow filter co'z that one i bought..hehehehehehhehe.. about to change oil na rin by next week... if ever that dual/combo will work with trooper 4jx1 i will try to use that combo filter...well having a combo filter has an advantage than regular full flow filter?

sir locoroco ,na try mo bang mag inquire cummins sa laguna?

[dvldoc]

THE 4M41 is a dual flow / bypass filter/combo filter. it all means the same thing.

The BD28 and the Donaldson filter i have verified that they will fit that engine from Baldwin. So get the BD28. If the Donaldson is cheaper nothing wrong with go the Donaldson the efficiency ratings are pretty close within 4 microns.

[locoroco777]

THE 4M41 is a dual flow / bypass filter/combo filter. it all means the same thing.

The BD28 and the Donaldson filter i have verified that they will fit that engine from Baldwin. So get the BD28. If the Donaldson is cheaper nothing wrong with go the Donaldson the efficiency ratings are pretty close within 4 microns.

that's all I've waiting for...thanks a bunch doc!

it's getting deeeeeeepeeer, but very interesting topic for us'.....same here i'm also confused about dual filter will its going to work well in trooper 4jx1 or not? as of now i'll stick with full flow filter co'z that one i bought..hehehehehehhehe.. about to change oil na rin by next week... if ever that dual/combo will work with trooper 4jx1 i will try to use that combo filter...well having a combo filter has an advantage than regular full flow filter?

sir locoroco ,na try mo bang mag inquire cummins sa laguna?

it definitely is! at first all I thought is that all filters are no different from each other and the synthetic oils are enough to keep the engine going great then suddenly this thread came out and its back to zero for me....

I havent tried inquiring there eh....its quite far kasi sakin Im from bulacan hehe...the company that I asked that carries the cummins/fleetguard is the one in mindanao avenue, apparently they dont carry the part numbers I inquired about....

[Ry_Tower]

Same spec lang (dual-flow) nga but different height lang yung BD28 at BD7028 so puwede na nga yan.

that's all I've waiting for...thanks a bunch doc!



it definitely is! at first all I thought is that all filters are no different from each other and the synthetic oils are enough to keep the engine going great then suddenly this thread came out and its back to zero for me....

I havent tried inquiring there eh....its quite far kasi sakin Im from bulacan hehe...the company that I asked that carries the cummins/fleetguard is the one in mindanao avenue, apparently they dont carry the part numbers I inquired about....

[dvldoc]

The biggest difference your going to notice is how much cleaner you oil is, especially with that BD28, vs a standard over the counter filter. The cheap ones just don't filter down to the smaller particles and don't hold 1/4 the dirt as these heavy duty filters.

The OEM vs Donadoldson pic above is a good example of why they hold more particles and last longer.

Filters like OEM and VIC, and the rest of the cheap ones all have the cheap thin paper media, The industrial filters media is so much thicker and filters so much better. Lets you run your oil longer and you don't have to use synthetic if you use good filters even though your running the oil longer. It's all about what fits your budget, you will be able to go much further using synthetics than dyno.

[locoroco777]

so will the synthetic oil combined with the High quality filters of FG BD and donaldson lasting up to atleast 15k kms is possible?

[12vdc]

^Using the stock filter head?

With the dirt and heat in Ph, you are safe to assume that it would only be possible by using remote bypass filtration.

[dvldoc]

With most of these you can easily go 15000k with synthetic, The fact that they keep the oil cleaner for longer lets you get the full use out of the oil. Most people here will do 10000 mile intervals on these with these on non-commercial vehicles.

This is the purpose of their design, These filters are designed for fleet use to give owners of commercial vehicles longer oil change interval and less maintenance cost. The OEM recommended oil changes are based more on the limitations of the filtration not of the oil. Many people get 15000klm out of regular dino oil using a high quality filter. You can't do this on a bosch or Purolator because they still have less than half the dirt/particle holding capacity of a Fleetguard, or Baldwin or Donandlson .

But use good oil not the cheap junk, but a high quality non synthetic with the Baldwin will get you a 15000k oil change interval in most cases especially on a bypass set up like the BD28.

I would not push it to much pass 15000klm since you don't have oil analysis available there to see how well the oil is holding up.

For diesels I highly recommend you use oil designed for diesels vs cars since it has a much stronger additive package. Diesels work harder and turbo diesels even harder and have very high compression ratios so you need good oil. I won't use a oil unless I know what's in it zinc over 850 is what I do look for and a good amount of moly in the mix.

[Ry_Tower]

With most of these you can easily go 15000k with synthetic, The fact that they keep the oil cleaner for longer lets you get the full use out of the oil. Most people here will do 10000 mile intervals on these with these on non-commercial vehicles.

This is the purpose of their design, These filters are designed for fleet use to give owners of commercial vehicles longer oil change interval and less maintenance cost. The OEM recommended oil changes are based more on the limitations of the filtration not of the oil. Many people get 15000klm out of regular dino oil using a high quality filter. You can't do this on a bosch or Purolator because they still have less than half the dirt/particle holding capacity of a Fleetguard, or Baldwin or Donandlson .

But use good oil not the cheap junk, but a high quality non synthetic with the Baldwin will get you a 15000k oil change interval in most cases especially on a bypass set up like the BD28.

I would not push it to much pass 15000klm since you don't have oil analysis available there to see how well the oil is holding up.

For diesels I highly recommend you use oil designed for diesels vs cars since it has a much stronger additive package. Diesels work harder and turbo diesels even harder and have very high compression ratios so you need good oil. I won't use a oil unless I know what's in it zinc over 850 is what I do look for and a good amount of moly in the mix.

Do you have a link or file of what diesel engine oil have high zinc and moly content? Or would CF-rated or higher API enough as a benchmark?

[crazy_boy]

Do you have a link or file of what diesel engine oil have high zinc and moly content? Or would CF-rated or higher API enough as a benchmark?

+1, dvldoc, what oil are u using here in the Philippines? currently, im using Elf Trophy DX 15w40 and Top1 synthetic diesel oil 15w40.

[dvldoc]

Well I am not in the Philippines not until next year. But the oils I like there are the Rottela, Motul, and Mobil Delvac if you can get it.

But I like mine high in zinc if you see CI-4 Plus rating on it snap it up it's getting very rare and is very high in zinc, I was lucky Mobil has stopped making this but on base here it's on deep discount for the Mobil Delvac super 1300, in pesos it would be 225P for 1 gallon I got a bunch which I will send over when I move there.

But here is some stuff you can look for in a good diesel oil Mobile Delvac super for instance has the API service rating of CJ-4, CI-4 Plus, (new formula does not) CI-4, CH-4, CF/SM/SL plus a bunch of other manufacture ratings.

Here's how to look at these ratings.

SM – 2004 Gasoline Engine Service – For all automotive engines currently in use. Introduced in 2004, SM oils are designed to provide improved oxidation resistance, improved deposit protection, better wear protection, and better low-temperature performance over the life of the oil. Some SM oils may also meet the latest ILSAC specification and/or qualify as Energy conserving.

SL – 2001 Gasoline Engine Service – Category SL was adopted to describe engine oils for use in 2001. It is for use in service typical of gasoline engines in present and earlier passenger cars, sport utility vehicles, vans and light trucks operating under vehicle manufacturers’ recommended maintenance procedures. They may be used where API Service Category SJ and earlier categories are recommended.

CF – Indirect Injected Diesel Engine Service – Service typical of indirect injected diesel engines and other diesel engines that use a broad range of fuel types, including those using fuel with sulfur content above 0.5%. Requirements include control of piston deposits, wear and bearing corrosion. Engines may be naturally aspirated, turbocharged or supercharged. CF rated oils may be used when API CD oils are called for.
CI-4 – 2002 Severe-Duty Diesel Engine Service – The API CI-4 Service category describes oils for use in those high-speed, four-stroke cycle diesel engines designed to meet 2004 exhaust emission standards, to be implemented October 2002. These oils are compounded for use in all applications with diesel fuels ranging in sulfur content up to 0.05% by weight. These oils are especially effective at sustaining engine durability where Exhaust Gas Recirculation (EGR) and other exhaust emission componentry may be used. Optimum protection is provided for control of corrosive wear tendencies, low and high temperature stability, soot handling properties, piston deposit control, valvetrain wear, oxidative thickening, foaming and viscosity loss due to shear. API CI-4 oils can effectively lubricate engines calling for API CH-4, CG-4 and CF-4 Service Categories.

CJ-4 – 2006 Heavy Duty Diesel Engine Service; Exhaust Aftertreatment – Introduced in 2006. For high-speed, four-stroke engines designed to meet 2007 model year on-highway exhaust emission standards. CJ-4 oils are compounded for use in all applications with diesel fuels ranging in sulfur content up to 500 ppm (0.05% by weight). However, use of these oils with greater than 15 ppm (0.0015% by weight) sulfur fuel may impact exhaust aftertreatment system durability and/or oil drain interval. CJ-4 oils are effective at sustaining emission control system durability where particulate filters and other advanced aftertreatment systems are used. Optimum protection is provided for control of catalyst poisoning, particulate filter blocking, engine wear, piston deposits, low and high temperature stability, soot handling properties, oxidative thickening, foaming, and viscosity loss due to shear. API CJ-4 oils exceed the performance criteria of API CI-4 with CI-4 PLUS, CI-4, CH-4, CG-4, and CF-4 and can effectively lubricate engines calling for those API Service Categories. When using CJ-4 oil with higher than 15 ppm sulfur fuel, consult the engine manufacturer for service interval.


I car more about what's in the oil the what the brand is, I won't use anything without the API rating simply because you don't know what your getting. Now if your using regular car oil in your diesel it's probably just SM rated, but using diesel oil in a gas engine is never a bad thing it offers more protection, better lubrication and have better cleaning and anti corrosion additives as well as anti wear additives.


Some ELF ratings for diesels oils can be found here. ELF Products



· ELF PERFORMANCE TROPHY DX 15W40 :
Top -of-the-range lubricant recommended by the European and American diesel engine manufacturers: trucks, buses, construction machinery and agricultural machinery used in severe conditions.
STANDARDS
ACEA : E3-96API CH4
DAIMLER CHRYSLER : MB 228.3 ; MAN : M 3275;
VOLVO : VDS-2
Performance level:
RENAULT VI : RD ; SCANIA : E3 ; DAF : E3


Heavy Duty (Diesel) « Top 1 Oil

Some of there formulations can be found here, Looks like a good amount of zinc over 1000ppm.

http://www.top1oil.com.pl/pliki/all.pdf

Top-1 synthetic diesel oil (sdo) 15w-40
Specification/s
Api ci-4, ch-4/sl


How's that for a answer