audio set-up for beginners [continued]

[jhnkvn]

My current car audio config:

- Kenwood DPX-U5130BT Head Unit
- Kenwood X700-5 Amp
- Polk DB6501 front doors
- Polk DB651 rear doors
- Polk MM1040 sub

I also still have a Kenwood M845 4-channel amp that is currently not being used (was replaced by the X700).

Curious about 3-way active setup and looking at acquiring the Pioneer DEH-80PRS.

Thinking of reconfiguring things as follows:

- Kenwood M845 as amp with Channel A for mid/mid-bass (*60W RMS 4ohm) to drive DB651 coaxial and Channel B for tweeter (*60W RMS 4ohm) to drive DB6501 tweeter. Will not be using the included passive crossover module.
- RCA splitters to daisy chain mid head unit RCA out to both M845 (channel A) and X700 amp (channel a & b).
- Bridge channel A and B of X700 amp (*100W RMS 4ohm) to drive DB6501 woofer

Not looking to acquire any new equipment except possibly the DEH-80PRS.

Any suggestions or comments (good or bad) about what I am thinking of doing?

Thank you!

Well, first thing is that.. if you want to upgrade. The head unit should go. You need a head unit that gives your installer much needed tools to make a good sounding car.

Unfortunately, the Pioneer 80PRS is only limited to 2-way full-active. This is because you can't dip the tweeter's frequency lower than 1khz so 3-way semi-active is also out of the window.

In any case, I'll heed the advice of markygy with regards to the reconfiguration.

[ezem]

mga bossing & sound masters, few questions lang po...

1.) meron na bang naka-audition dito ng Gladen seps (RS, SQL, and/ or SQX line)? I was eyeing for Focal access seps kasi and sabi ng installer ko i-try ko daw yung Gladen RS 165 since magkalapit lang ang price and he's recommending that one over the Focal Access.

2.) Ano pa bang pwedeng ibang options for the same price range as that of Focal access 165 (or kahit dagdag onti)?

3.) Also, anyone knows mga nasa anong price range ang Dominations ES 62?

4.) HU would be x8650BT, and Amp will be LRx 5.1k with Sundown sub/s in a ported enclosure. Pinag-iisipan pa kung 1 x SA8v2 or 2 x E8v3 or 2 x SD-2 8. Planning on LnC/ SQL setup. Which option should I take? Any suggestions?

[jhnkvn]

mga bossing & sound masters, few questions lang po...

1.) meron na bang naka-audition dito ng Gladen seps (RS, SQL, and/ or SQX line)? I was eyeing for Focal access seps kasi and sabi ng installer ko i-try ko daw yung Gladen RS 165 since magkalapit lang ang price and he's recommending that one over the Focal Access.

2.) Ano pa bang pwedeng ibang options for the same price range as that of Focal access 165 (or kahit dagdag onti)?

3.) Also, anyone knows mga nasa anong price range ang Dominations ES 62?

4.) HU would be x8650BT, and Amp will be LRx 5.1k with Sundown sub/s in a ported enclosure. Pinag-iisipan pa kung 1 x SA8v2 or 2 x E8v3 or 2 x SD-2 8. Planning on LnC/ SQL setup. Which option should I take? Any suggestions?

1. Haven't heard of them. And truthfully, I hear a lot of seps na compared to most people - installers excluded. Although not all speakers sound the same because of their differing materials, constructions, and design.. unless you know what you actually want, you'll be content with any. It's like picking whether you'd like a Mercedes, a Beemer, or a Jaguar... iba't-iba taste ng mga tao but all brands are quite excellent. But if you're a fan of Beemers, then you go for the Beemer.

2. Your price range will include JBL's Infinity Kappa Series, Audio System's Radion (Audio-System is the parent company as Gladen Audio), and on the pricer side.. probably the veterans DLS R6A and Morel Tempo.

3. The ES62 is priced at 29k. It's expensive is because it doesn't use a tweeter but a neodymium 2" full range driver complete with pre-built pods if memory serves me. I posted it in #500~ of this thread. Easily searchable via Google :D

4. If you're planning a LnC/SQL setup, bigger the better abot sa subwoofers. Creating bass is simply the science of moving air. The bigger displacement (cone size) you have, the more air you displace. The less linear movement your cone needs to make, the lower the distortion (tho we're immune to it since we're numb to low-end distortion). In that sense, a single Sundown 12" will beat all of your above options really.

[ezem]

hi sir jhnkvn and masters...i've been narrowing down my option...patulong ulit

the hu would be avh-x8650bt and i've read na may built-in dsp na ito and TA. The amp would be LRx 5.1k. Would I need a bit one? or no need since may dsp na yung hu? looking for a possibility in joining the EMMA comp here in uae this 3rd quarter

Audison Voce K6 / Hertz HSK 165 / Focal PS 165 / Focal Flax 165? or Focal access 3-way? if 2-way, tweeters will be in customized sail pod...so I guess I need to ask my installer to tone down the tweeter (if focal - bright signature) a little bit since di sya sa A-pillar nakalagay...if 3-way, sa A-pillar...doors will be deadened also.

Full active or passive?

And I will not be aiming for LnC anymore...going to walk the SQ road what are my options for 10" SQ sub (in a ported box - pipe)? Focal P21? Polk MM1040? What else? Just mid-range, I'm not capable of buying a Utopia Be hehe

When Erick (of Sun-X) have made that Vios-Targa win the SQ comp, I started to think na nasa install nga talaga siguro...so will that also mean na I can choose the gears that I want and if the install is good, it will sound great? haven't heard the Voce yet but I somewhat prefer that one over the Focal Polyglass seps.

Thanks again...and pasensya na kasi matanong hehe

[jhnkvn]

hi sir jhnkvn and masters...i've been narrowing down my option...patulong ulit

the hu would be avh-x8650bt and i've read na may built-in dsp na ito and TA. The amp would be LRx 5.1k. Would I need a bit one? or no need since may dsp na yung hu? looking for a possibility in joining the EMMA comp here in uae this 3rd quarter

Audison Voce K6 / Hertz HSK 165 / Focal PS 165 / Focal Flax 165? or Focal access 3-way? if 2-way, tweeters will be in customized sail pod...so I guess I need to ask my installer to tone down the tweeter (if focal - bright signature) a little bit since di sya sa A-pillar nakalagay...if 3-way, sa A-pillar...doors will be deadened also.

Full active or passive?

And I will not be aiming for LnC anymore...going to walk the SQ road what are my options for 10" SQ sub (in a ported box - pipe)? Focal P21? Polk MM1040? What else? Just mid-range, I'm not capable of buying a Utopia Be hehe

When Erick (of Sun-X) have made that Vios-Targa win the SQ comp, I started to think na nasa install nga talaga siguro...so will that also mean na I can choose the gears that I want and if the install is good, it will sound great? haven't heard the Voce yet but I somewhat prefer that one over the Focal Polyglass seps.

Thanks again...and pasensya na kasi matanong hehe

The AVH-X8650 has as it is Pioneer's flagship 2DIN head unit. However, it's DSP capabilities are limited (but enough). Judging by what I see in its press release in Malaysian photos, it's limited to 3-way semi-active or 2-way full active only.

Before you start doing your setup, you should first know which category you'll be competing in. As EMMA has a # of channels and price category, you'll be building upon what you're aiming for. For example, in the Philippines we have a price bracket of 120,000php. In that case, you'll be building upon that budget inclusive of head unit. And yes, since the competition does not take installation costs into account, doon usually dinadaan ng tao ang pera

The difference of a 3-way and a 2-way is still humongous. However, there's the aspect of tuning that you need to get it right. SQ is factually just controlling the sound inside the cabin so that what you hear - sounds great. Tuning a 2-way is actually a PITA if you don't know what you're doing, a 3-way is probably a 4-fold jump in difficulty. But if you get it right, you'll be well-rewarded. This is from a pure SQ capability, the Focal Access 3-way will outperform its higher model 2-ways if you get it right.

As for full passive or active. You will always aim for active. That's what your DSP is for after all. In this case, you'll be choosing between 2-way full active or 3-way semi-active if you plan on going 3-way.

As for your subwoofer, I'll first ask on why a 10" subwoofer? Truthfully in subwoofers, there's no "SQ" or "SPL" subwoofer. The science of creating bass is simply moving air. There's no such thing as "SQ" is because kahit ano gawin mo subwoofers create a ton of distortion - 20% upwards but our ears can't simply hear it. When it comes down to technicals, a 15" subwoofer is more "SQ" than a 12 or 10" subwoofer. Why? Because it won't move a lot just to displace air whereas the smaller cones will need more cone travel (which causes distortion).

My choice of a subwoofer is the Php9k JBL P1222 sub for the 12" category and Php8k JBL P1022. JBL subwoofers are highly engineered and they have great prices. In fact, they're better than you choices of Focal P series subwoofers or the Polk MMs. I always feel they're underloved by the community really. I also don't believe in purchasing a more expensive subwoofer unless you're after the engineering behind it. For example, I payed roughly 22k for my ImageDynamics IDMax in my trunk. However it has more to do with admiration of engineering (light paper cone yet stiff enough to pound) rather than performance.

If you're in QC, shoot me a PM since taga-QC din ako. I'll let you hear my car.

[ezem]

The AVH-X8650 has as it is Pioneer's flagship 2DIN head unit. However, it's DSP capabilities are limited (but enough). Judging by what I see in its press release in Malaysian photos, it's limited to 3-way semi-active or 2-way full active only.

Before you start doing your setup, you should first know which category you'll be competing in. As EMMA has a # of channels and price category, you'll be building upon what you're aiming for. For example, in the Philippines we have a price bracket of 120,000php. In that case, you'll be building upon that budget inclusive of head unit. And yes, since the competition does not take installation costs into account, doon usually dinadaan ng tao ang pera

The difference of a 3-way and a 2-way is still humongous. However, there's the aspect of tuning that you need to get it right. SQ is factually just controlling the sound inside the cabin so that what you hear - sounds great. Tuning a 2-way is actually a PITA if you don't know what you're doing, a 3-way is probably a 4-fold jump in difficulty. But if you get it right, you'll be well-rewarded. This is from a pure SQ capability, the Focal Access 3-way will outperform its higher model 2-ways if you get it right.

As for full passive or active. You will always aim for active. That's what your DSP is for after all. In this case, you'll be choosing between 2-way full active or 3-way semi-active if you plan on going 3-way.

As for your subwoofer, I'll first ask on why a 10" subwoofer? Truthfully in subwoofers, there's no "SQ" or "SPL" subwoofer. The science of creating bass is simply moving air. There's no such thing as "SQ" is because kahit ano gawin mo subwoofers create a ton of distortion - 20% upwards but our ears can't simply hear it. When it comes down to technicals, a 15" subwoofer is more "SQ" than a 12 or 10" subwoofer. Why? Because it won't move a lot just to displace air whereas the smaller cones will need more cone travel (which causes distortion).

My choice of a subwoofer is the Php9k JBL P1222 sub for the 12" category and Php8k JBL P1022. JBL subwoofers are highly engineered and they have great prices. In fact, they're better than you choices of Focal P series subwoofers or the Polk MMs. I always feel they're underloved by the community really. I also don't believe in purchasing a more expensive subwoofer unless you're after the engineering behind it. For example, I payed roughly 22k for my ImageDynamics IDMax in my trunk. However it has more to do with admiration of engineering (light paper cone yet stiff enough to pound) rather than performance.

If you're in QC, shoot me a PM since taga-QC din ako. I'll let you hear my car.

Actually sir, I've considered a 10" sub kasi i don't want for it to take too much space. When I was planning to go LnC, i've considered sundown SA8v2 ported...pero when I decided to go SQ, i might go for a custom FG box. and considering yung nanalo last year na jazz (jc car audio), t'was using an 8" focal P21v2 sealed enclosure...then, so i thought 10" sub would do good after all.

Also, when I auditioned 1 civic here, ang setup nya is x8650, gladen seps, LRx 5.1, IDQ12 L-ported...di nya ma-hit yung lows when I played bass i love you (i also played several music like beatles, alternative rock,etc. , either 384bit or flac format). And I expected it to sound great, but a bit unimpressed. Had to admit that it is yet to be tuned daw but sub SQ would just depend on the box size and tuning freq. (please correct me if i'm wrong). I was comparing this to my old system na P7150ub 1din, JL J2 320.4 amp, TMA seps, and 12" JL w0v2 slot ported (pipe) wherein i can hear both the lows and hard pounding beat of "bass i love you", and yung bass is tama lang, di sobra di din naman kulang (installed by sun-x).

I'd love to hear your setup sir but sadly sa dec pa ako magbabakasyon. I might PM you sa dec

Good day, ask ko lang, ano ba magandang low budget simple set up sa MB100, yun hindi naman bitin ang lakas sa loob at meron din bayo, gusto ko sana yun speakers ay in place pa rin sa original place niya dito sa MB, 2 front and 2 back, then a simple sub for bass na hindi bitin

for low budget, i'd go for JBL sub, V12 amp, and powerbass seps for oem placement. JBL seps are also good kaso parang malalim ang mounting depth nya (not so sure). try mo kay nogs of candyshop, may mga budget meal packages sya na baka pasok sa budget mo...

[jhnkvn]

I see. If it's primarily for competition, even a 8" will suffice. First, competing in SQ competitions doesn't require you to crank up the volume and second, most "SQ" tracks doesn't have much information below 40hz really.

Correct. A subwoofer's performance is highly dependent on its enclosure. If it's a ported enclosure, it will also depend on its tuning frequency. For example, if you tune the port quite high then you won't hear the music below the tuned frequency - this is because the ported box's response dips drastically after that but if you port it too low then you aren't taking advantage of the free decibels the port freq gives you. This "fickleness" is why most people prefer to go for a sealed application for SQ. This is because a sealed box gives a very smooth response (if built right) and this is further complimented with the natural roll-off of a car's environment.

Alright, just PM me in Dec. I don't think my setup will change pa naman. I'll hype your expectations a bit since I offer one of the best bass-midbass transition among the cars I hear. It's something that I pay particular attention to ;)