3 Wheelers

[architect]

A gallery of T-rex cars, a USD40K 3 wheeler - http://www.go-t-rex.com/

[architect]

[architect]

[donbuggy]

A bit expensive for such a minimalist vehicle. I believe that for a sporty three-wheeler to sell in the Philippines, it must not cost more than the cheapest brand new four-wheeled car.

[architect]

*wildthing

one of the original group advocates is ehnriko, who has designed a three wheeler sports car - http://ehnriko.bravehost.com/concepts/trima.htm (gt250)

He is currently based overseas but is planning to come back end of July. I am planning to order one unit from him, pending registration and safety issues. (Reckless bus drivers might easily miss its low profile.) Exact configuration will depend on the price.

[ogpro]

*wildthing

one of the original group advocates is ehnriko, who has designed a three wheeler sports car - http://ehnriko.bravehost.com/concepts/trima.htm (gt250)

He is currently based overseas but is planning to come back end of July. I am planning to order one unit from him, pending registration and safety issues. (Reckless bus drivers might easily miss its low profile.) Exact configuration will depend on the price.

On this Trima vehicle, since it is supposed to work off a motorcycle engine, I'd like to ask a couple of questions...

1. Aren't motorcycle engines much more polluting than your standard auto engine?

2. Can a motorcycle engine operate an A/C unit's compressor?

3. Seems to me the safety features were more implied than explained. I'd like to know what safety features will keep such a low profile vehicle from being run over by a bus or crashing and sliding under a truck. Just thinking in philippine traffic/road conditions terms....

[wildthing]

1. Aren't motorcycle engines much more polluting than your standard auto engine?

2. Can a motorcycle engine operate an A/C unit's compressor?

3. Seems to me the safety features were more implied than explained. I'd like to know what safety features will keep such a low profile vehicle from being run over by a bus or crashing and sliding under a truck. Just thinking in philippine traffic/road conditions terms....

in my views:

1) Motorcycle engines na 2 stroke are bad... in terms of air pollution than 4 stroke... but they are definitely polluting less (being single pistons) than car engines that are 6 cylinder.

2) yes motorcycle engine can operate a/c unit BUT with limits... RPM of engine and torque of the engine.... I think mahihirapan ang small displacement motorcycle engines to run an a/c lalo na kung single cylinder lang ito and it is running a cargo load at the same time. Yun ngang 3K na makina ng toyota which is 1200cc hirap pagmeron aircon yung oto.... (pero mabigat din kasi yung load ng toyota na car).

3) your risk of being run over by a bigger vehicle with a stupid driver remains the same when you are riding a motorcycle or a bike in the streets... the key is not to make the car TOO small (like a go-kart) and use all necessary safety precautions (like brightly colored, signal ligts, light reflectors, headlights etc).

[architect]

*wildthing, ogpro,

Unfortunately I don't have the answers to your questions although I do share your concerns. That is why I am waiting for ehnriko to come home so that I can ask the same questions.

However he does get to log on from time to time. Hopefully he might see this thread and answer the issues before then.

In the meantime, good luck!

Actually am surprised the rest of the gang haven't jumped in - drey, safeorigin, proxies, foifoi05, oyIL, where are you guys?

[OyiL]

*wildthing, ogpro,

Unfortunately I don't have the answers to your questions although I do share your concerns. That is why I am waiting for ehnriko to come home so that I can ask the same questions.

However he does get to log on from time to time. Hopefully he might see this thread and answer the issues before then.

In the meantime, good luck!

Actually am surprised the rest of the gang haven't jumped in - drey, safeorigin, proxies, foifoi05, oyIL, where are you guys?

around, aware and raring to dive-in. but i dont want to lose focus.

i'll come up with something to jump-start this one, dont worry.

[ogpro]

in my views:

1) Motorcycle engines na 2 stroke are bad... in terms of air pollution than 4 stroke... but they are definitely polluting less (being single pistons) than car engines that are 6 cylinder.

What about compared to a small 4 cyl which is what it will most likely be compared with?

2) yes motorcycle engine can operate a/c unit BUT with limits... RPM of engine and torque of the engine.... I think mahihirapan ang small displacement motorcycle engines to run an a/c lalo na kung single cylinder lang ito and it is running a cargo load at the same time. Yun ngang 3K na makina ng toyota which is 1200cc hirap pagmeron aircon yung oto.... (pero mabigat din kasi yung load ng toyota na car).

Zactly. An engine that is straining is also less efficient and more polluting.

3) your risk of being run over by a bigger vehicle with a stupid driver remains the same when you are riding a motorcycle or a bike in the streets... the key is not to make the car TOO small (like a go-kart) and use all necessary safety precautions (like brightly colored, signal ligts, light reflectors, headlights etc).

I would not put this Trima on the same level as motorcycles, just because it has a motorcycle engine.

The thing is, with a motorcycle, you are mostly alone and are MORE careful. People will have the tendency to assume the added safety when surrounded by 4 walls, and will operate the Trima with relatively less care at higher rates of speed. Not only will this vehicle have the capability to carry a passenger (an extra life to worry about) but its bigger footprint will also be occupying the same roads as other much larger 4-wheeled vehicles. It stands to reason that it will figure in more fender benders than your average MC. I'd consider impact protection not just from OTHER cars but also in the case of the Trima hitting another vehicle or stationary object. Safety equipment can mean the difference between just a dented body panel or a broken leg.

[mazdamazda]

my suggestion...

two wheels up front, one at the rear (for stability).

something like this:



i'll try to draw a few sketches of what I have in mind. definitely not as agressive looking as the vehicle above.

[architect]

*mazdamazda,

Is that the T-Rex?

[architect]

Another three-wheeler - http://www.rqriley.com/xr3.htm

It is the XR3 but costs considerably less than the US$40,000 T-Rex. I believe this will be available for about US15,000.

Incidentally, all three - the T-Rex, XR3, and Trima - have the same tadpole form with two wheels in front.

[donbuggy]

Three-wheelers can be stable at high speeds and won't overturn during cornering as long as:

1) the configuration is two wheels at front and one wheel at the back.
2) the track (distance from center of the left tire to the center of the right tire) is wide enough.
3) the center of gravity is low and is located near the front end.

Pollution will not be an issue if a 4-stroke motorcycle engine is used.

The A/C compressor can be run by an electric motor just like in the Toyota Prius hybrid.

As for visibility issues, a low three-wheeler will stand out among the ordinary cars because of its unique shape.

[donbuggy]

Here's my drawing of a three-wheeler that I posted in another thread:

[ghosthunter]

1. Aren't motorcycle engines much more polluting than your standard auto engine?

yes and no. Only the two stroke motorcycle engines give off more pollutants. The four stroke motorcycle engines are roughly at level with most modern cars.

2. Can a motorcycle engine operate an A/C unit's compressor?

make the engine bigger and/or compressor smaller and it will run the A/C system.

3. Seems to me the safety features were more implied than explained. I'd like to know what safety features will keep such a low profile vehicle from being run over by a bus or crashing and sliding under a truck. Just thinking in philippine traffic/road conditions terms....

Any small vehicle will be in danger of getting run over by a bigger one. Even a Camry can get run over by a truck if it was in the wrong place at the wrong time. At this point, any vehicle you design has to be crash worthy. Protect the occupants in a "passenger survival cell".

My micro-car three wheeler project (of more than 10 years ago) had a survival cell built into it's tubular space frame design. It was more similar to a race car than a typical production vehicle.

[donbuggy]

My micro-car three wheeler project (of more than 10 years ago) had a survival cell built into it's tubular space frame design. It was more similar to a race car than a typical production vehicle.

*ghosthunter,

Very interesting. Can you tell us more about this micro-car?

Engine?
Top speed?
Fuel consumption?
How many passengers?
Materials used (body)?
Photos?

Why did you build it?
What was it like to drive the micro-car?
Did you drive it every day?
Where is it now?

Sorry if I have too many questions. I'm just fascinated with these kind of vehicles.

[ghosthunter]

*ghosthunter,

Very interesting. Can you tell us more about this micro-car?

Engine?
Top speed?
Fuel consumption?
How many passengers?
Materials used (body)?
Photos?

Why did you build it?
What was it like to drive the micro-car?
Did you drive it every day?
Where is it now?

Sorry if I have too many questions. I'm just fascinated with these kind of vehicles.

Engine : donated Honda 800cc motorcycle two stroke.
Top speed : unknown but it was computed to be 120 kph. Actual runs were limited to 60kph (safety purposes).
Fuel consumption : unknown
How many passengers: one driver, one passenger
Materials used (body): steel tubing as frame, painted GI sheets as the shell.
Photos: none with me but it's general shape was "tadpole".

Why did you build it: I was part of a research & design team in DLSU back in 1991 to 1994. The plan was to built a concept city car. It was pre-determined that a small engine and two seater car would be used. To save weight, a three wheel layout was chosen. Safety was NOT to be compromised. The design incorporated a passenger survival cell design which included side impact beams for added rigidity in non-frontal impacts.

Since the vehicle was a prototype, we also went with some flair. The doors were butterfly opening doors. The front section was modeled to look like a late 80's sport's car.

Using computer finite analysis, it was determined that the tubular space frame design was strong enough to survive a 100kph frontal impact without intrusion into the passenger survival cell. The crash forces were directed around the survival cell.

It was also proposed that a later version would use an electric motor as the drive unit and deep cycle batteries as power source but it was never built.

What was it like to drive the micro-car: handling was like a go-cart.
Did you drive it every day: no, it was only driven during testing or to the World Trade Exhibit Hall.
Where is it now: unknown



Interestingly the MicroCar 2 project looks similar to your concept drawing, including those finned side intake vents. The major differences were the front wheel fenders were integrated with the rest of the front part of the car, the rear section ended to a chisel-like edge and the headlights were integrated into the body for better aerodynamics.

Note: yes, the project had a predecessor, MicroCar 1. Basically a failure from the start because of poor design. I wasn't in the design team for this project but I was in the build team (and giving my *$%^*& comments on it).

[donbuggy]

Thanks ghosthunter. Designing and building that micro car is quite an achievement. Maybe the micro car is in somebody's garage somewhere. It would be a pity if it was lost forever.

[jedi]

pwede na ba ako mag pre-order ? heheheh

gusto nyan