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  1. Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    710
    #1
    Do you agree the the dam operators be charged? Would not PAGASA be the first to be blamed for failure to forecast volume of rainfall? Then PAGASA will then blame the politicians for failure to purchase needed equipment? As a structural engineer, I think the operators decided for the lesser evil. So who else to blame: Global Warming, NDCC ill-preparedness, LGUs, etc.?
    http://www.gmanews.tv/story/174438/s...rs-over-floods
    Suits mulled vs San Roque dam operators over floods
    AMITA LEGASPI and AIE B. SEE, GMANews.TV
    10/12/2009 | 07:22 PM

    (Update 2 - 12:48 a.m. Oct. 13) Legal suits are looming over the operators of San Roque dam for allegedly failing to properly warn residents along the Agno river basin in northern Luzon that last week's release of water during the height of typhoon “Pepeng" would cause massive flooding.

    Governor Amado Espino Jr. of Pangasinan, one of the most affected provinces by the flooding, on Monday said he and other organizations are considering a move to file charges against the dam officials.

    “I am asking the legal officials here to study because there is some neglect on their [dam officials] part," Gov. Espino told GMANews.TV in an interview.

    The National Power Corporation (Napocor) owns the San Roque dam and spillway, while the San Roque Power Corporation (SRPC) owns and operates the power generating facilities.

    According to the website of the San Roque Multipurpose Project www.sanroquedam.ph, the SRPC is owned by the Marubeni Corp. (75 percent) and Kansai Electric Power Co. Ltd. (25 percent).

    As described in the website, Napocor's Flood Forecasting and Warning System for Dam Operations (FFWSDO) and the Philippine Atmospheric Geophysical and Astronomical Services Administration (PAGASA) "dictate the volume of water to be released by specifying the appropriate spillway gate openings to SRPC" based on weather and river data.

    AGHAM, an organization advocating "science for the people," also joined the outcry, saying the operators of San Roque dam should be held accountable for the disaster that struck northern Luzon provinces.

    "The operators and owner of the dams should be held accountable. They have allowed the water to reach dangerously high levels and not acted on it sooner. Instead of releasing the waters earlier, gradually and in lesser volumes, they did it suddenly without adequate warning to the communities," said Dr. Giovanni Tapang, AGHAM chairperson.

    San Roque dam is the biggest of the three dams along Agno river, and is designed to produce energy, supply water and control flood.

    In Manila, Sen. Francis Escudero said he is now coordinating with local government officials in northern Luzon for the possible filing of a class suit against the operators of dams there, including the San Roque dam.

    “Inaalam at kinukuha na namin ang mga dokumento mula sa mga naapektuhang lugar, partikular na pinag-aaralan ay yung nag-ooperate ng dam. Hinahanap at hahanapin namin ang pananagutan kaugnay sa nangyaring ito kung meron man," he said.

    (We are seeking and gathering documents from the affected areas particularly with regards the dam operators. We will look into their liability, if there’s any.)

    Recent reports from the National Disaster Coordinating Council (NDCC) showed that the floods affected 38 towns and three cities in northern Luzon, rendering thousands of people homeless and causing millions worth of damage to agriculture and infrastructure.

    Of the affected areas, 23 towns and three cities are in Pangasinan, most of which are in the Agno river basin located downstream from the San Roque dam and reservoir.

    Nothing wrong

    Napocor however maintained that it followed the protocol when it released water from San Roque dam last Thursday.

    "It is their right (to file charges). In my view, we followed the protocol," said Alex Palada, division manager of the flood forecasting and warning system for dam operations of Napocor.

    He said the San Roque dam is being managed by the San Roque Power Corporation under Japanese companies Marubeni and Kansai.

    Barangay Mabanogbog in Urdaneta City, Pangasinan under water. Residents and provincial officials are blaming San Roque dam for the disastrous flooding. John-John Sarmiento

    An official from the Department of Science and Technology (DOST) meanwhile admitted that the release of the water aggravated the flooding in northern Luzon but added that the dam is not solely to be blamed.

    “It increased the flood waters, yes, but [North Luzon] to be flooded is a foregone conclusion. Evidence showed the amount of precipitation was just too much," said DOST Undersecretary Graciano Yumul in a press briefing in Malacañang.

    Yumul said even if the dams did not release any water, northern and central Luzon would have been flooded anyway because Pepeng dumped rains of from 200 to 675 millimeters - or three times the definition of “heavy rainfall" that is 180 millimeters - in 24 hours.

    He said the heavy rainfall proved too much for the watersheds to absorb, and resulted in the collapse of dikes and in the release of excess water from dams.

    Yumul added said the water from the flooded areas of San Fabian, Mangaldan and Dagupan City in Pangasinan did not come from the dams but from the adjacent mountains in Benguet.

    “With or without the dams, there would have been a flood. There was no way the mountains could absorb all that water. It's a combination of several sources and reasons," he said.

    Legally liable

    In a press statement, Escudero said under the law, operators are legally liable for any negligence on their part.

    In the case of San Roque dam, he said the operators failed to adequately warn residents of the floods that may be caused by the release of massive volumes of water during Pepeng’s onslaught.

    He said dam operators could be sued for deaths or injuries incurred by their disregard for safety.

    “In extreme cases, they can even be criminally liable. Any complainant may also add reckless imprudence to the class action suit," he added.

    Escudero said lawyers from Manila and the affected provinces who believe that dam operators are liable for the incident would assist in the crafting of the class suit. He said representatives of the residents in the area would be named as complainants.

    A flooded Manan Elementary School in Barangay Mabanogbog, Urdaneta City in Pangasinan, one of the most affected provinces by typhoon "Pepeng." John-John Sarmiento

    Protocol

    The senator said he wants to know the protocol that dam operators follow when releasing water. He said operators of San Roque dam should explain why they waited for the water to reach the maximum level of 290 meters above sea level before releasing it.

    “Bakit kailangang maghintay na umabot sa 288 meters above sea level bago sila nagpakawala ng tubig? Dapat 220 to 240 pa lamang nagpakawala na nang unti-unti kaysa mabilisan at malakasan," Escudero said.

    (Why did they wait for the water to reach the 288 meter level when they could have gradually released it at 220 to 240 level?)

    He said the capacity of a dike is 4,000 cubic meters per second, but the dam released water at 5,000 cubic meters per second.

    “Klarong masisira ang mga dike, klarong bibigay, klarong magiging dahilan ng pagbaha (It is clear that the dikes would be breached, collapse, and cause the flooding)," he said.

    The dikes in Rosales and Villasis gave away during the height of Pepeng.

    Napocor's Palada denied that there was an abrupt release of water from the San Roque dam. He said they first opened the gate of the spillway on Tuesday October 6 at 12 midnight upon learning of the forecast that Pepeng may hit Pangasinan. The water level then was 268.25 meters.

    They opened another gate 12 hours later. Both gates were opened at 1 meter each, he said.

    Around 4 in the afternoon of Wednesday October 7, the two gates were further opened to 1.5 meters each. The gates were left open until morning.

    On Thursday October 8, the dam operator opened two more gates at 1 meter. Around 10 in the morning, the two of the gates were closed while the two others were opened at 1 meter each. Around 11 in the evening the same day, another gate was opened at 1 meter.

    “We open gates at progression," Palada said, adding that one of the gates is still open as of Monday night.

    It was not clear from Palada's account that by Friday October 9 at 12 noon, all six gates had been opened and by afternoon had been releasing nearly 6,000 cubic meters per second, a sudden jump from the previous day's figures, based on PAGASA's Dam Status bulletins. - GMANews.TV
    Another CHIZ media flick?
    Last edited by valvura; October 13th, 2009 at 03:11 PM. Reason: indicated source

  2. Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    3,829
    #2
    Asus! Lubog din ang pangasinan nung bagyong gading ah. What if hindi na release ng tubig ang DAM? Abay mas malaking problema yan.

    Hindi nga kayang forecast ng pagasa ang tubig na dala ng bagyo, dahil walang gamit. Hay chiz, wala ka na ba talagang maisip.

  3. Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    4,459
    #3
    Si Chiz na naman ba nagpush nito? Eh dapat dun ilunod sa dam, nagmarunong na naman

  4. Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Posts
    2,267
    #4
    hoy chiz, hindi tanga lahat ng botante. wag mo kami daanan sa patula-tula mo.

    graduate ka ng law. kung engineer ka, maniniwala pa sana ako.

    kung ndi bubuksan ang dam? mawawala ba ang tubig baha?

  5. Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    469
    #5
    The dam operators should do is to contact the local goverment so that they could spread the word na magpapakawala ng tubig.

    Eh sa amin tapos na nung nagsabing magpapakawala ulit. Kung hindi ba naman katangahan yun.

    Ayun lubog ang kotse ko at mga sasakyan ng kapitbahay ko. Lubog ang ibang appliances dahil less than 1 hour lampas tao na ang tubig.

    Di ko lang alam kung mananalo pa ang administrasyon sa bayan namin. This happened 2 times already in his watch and wala pa ring natutunan ang ugok.

    Ayun, lubog. Galit ang mga tao. Siguradong mapuputukan ang kapartido niya sa eleksyon.

    Simpleng warning lang oh. Para mataas ang gamit at ang tsikot.

  6. Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Posts
    1,463
    #6
    Quote Originally Posted by valvura View Post
    Do you agree the the dam operators be charged? Would not PAGASA be the first to be blamed for failure to forecast volume of rainfall? Then PAGASA will then blame the politicians for failure to purchase needed equipment? As a structural engineer, I think the operators decided for the lesser evil. So who else to blame: Global Warming, NDCC ill-preparedness, LGUs, etc.?
    For me,

    Quote Originally Posted by nurse_corrupted View Post
    The dam operators should do is to contact the local goverment so that they could spread the word na magpapakawala ng tubig.
    and they should also record conversations with the local government crooks...

  7. Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    3,829
    #7
    Why do I have the idea that everyone suddenly become expert in forecasting the volume of water the the rain will bring in relation to San Roque Dam probe.

    Even lowly, please forgive the expression suddenly become experts.

    Dam spill came too late
    SRMP execs accused of not following procedures

    By Gabriel Cardinoza, Gil C. Cabacungan Jr., Amy R. Remo, Leila Salaverria
    Philippine Daily Inquirer
    First Posted 01:26:00 10/14/2009

    Filed Under: Pepeng, Flood, Disasters (general)
    Most Read
    MANILA, Philippines—Did officials of the San Roque Dam follow their operations manual in regulating its water level amid the incessant rain and flooding triggered by Tropical Storm “Pepeng”?

    The officials say they did. But based on the extent of the flooding that hit Pangasinan and the magnitude of the devastation, a Dagupan-based environmentalist doesn’t think so.

    Nicanor Melecio, president of the NGO Pangasinan Institute for Land and Aquatic Research, said dam officials should have started releasing water at 500 cubic meters per second (cms) when the dam’s level had reached 280 meters above sea level (masl) as indicated in their basic operation rule.

    The dam has a maximum elevation of 290 masl.

    Under the rule, water release operates from “zero hour to 240 hours” when floods occur, said Melecio, a former member of the San Roque Dam multipartite monitoring team.

    “You have 10 days to play with an incoming flood event by anticipating the water coming from the watershed,” he said.

    In a privilege speech, Pangasinan Rep. Mark Cojuangco Tuesday called for an inquiry into the operations of the dam.

    Cojuangco said that the “overloading” of downstream river systems beside the San Roque Dam had caused “tremendous devastation” in his province that could have been avoided had the dam operators followed a more “conservative and a cautious approach” in releasing excess water.

    The San Roque Dam captures water released by the Ambuklao and Binga hydroelectric dams in the upstream Agno River in Benguet province.

    Power needs vs people’s lives

    When the San Roque Dam shifts to “flood mode,” or has reached the 280 masl mark, it should not be allowed to reach 290 masl, Melecio said.

    “If you reach 290, it will be very difficult to control. So, even during the first 20 hours, you can start releasing [water]. You can start even up to 60 hours at 500 cms,” he said.

    Melecio said water may be released up to 1,400 cms. “So, as you are releasing water, the dam’s water level that is supposed to be going up to 290 [masl] actually flattens,” he said.

    But if the rains continue, and the dam’s water approaches the critical level of 290 masl, then there is no choice but to release more than 1,400 cms, he said.

    “And so the question is: Do you have to wait for the water level to reach a very critical level so that you will release more than 1,400 cms? That’s the crux of the matter. How do you balance power needs as against people’s lives?” Melecio said.

    Water releases

    Based on SMS media advisories, Tom Valdez, a vice president of the San Roque Multipurpose Project (SRMP) that operates the facility owned by National Power Corp. (Napocor), said the dam first opened a spillway gate midnight of Oct. 7 when the water level was 287.65 masl.

    Pepeng smacked Cagayan Valley on Oct. 3 and hovered west of northern Luzon for over a week before moving out of the country at the weekend.

    The Provincial Disaster Coordinating Council (PDCC) in Pangasinan recorded the first water release at 12:03 a.m. on Oct. 7, when the water elevation at the San Roque Dam was 286.5 masl. The rate of water release was 181.5 cms, with one gate opened at a height of a meter.

    Valdez’s advisory said that on the same day, the dam opened another gate and released excess water at 650 cms.

    All 6 spillway gates open

    The bulk of water release came on Oct. 8 when dam officials announced the opening of all its six spillway gates and released water at 2,500 cms.

    The PDCC record showed that the dam, by 11 p.m. that day, was releasing water through its six gates at a rate of 3,600 cms. Water elevation at that time was 288.55 masl.

    At 3 a.m. on Oct. 9, the dam was already releasing water at 5,072 cms. Water level at the reservoir was 289.05 masl.

    The excess water overtopped dikes along the Agno River, eventually eroding them, causing a 7-kilometer breach in the dike along the Agno River at Barangay San Vicente in San Manuel and massive flooding in 38 towns and cities of Pangasinan.

    The provincial government, farmers, business groups and concerned citizens said they would file a class suit against SRMP and Napocor for the destruction.

    Followed diligently

    Valdez in a statement said the dam operators coordinated and “carried out diligently” instructions by Napocor managers and experts on water releases.

    “Napocor gave written instructions that were so specific that they included not only the time of the gate openings, but also the specific opening height of each gate to provide the release they required from the dam,” he said.

    “Unfortunately, toward the end of the storm, the San Roque Dam no longer had the capacity to absorb the unprecedented level of rainwater dumped by (Pepeng).”

    Operation rule vs gov’t policy

    “There are two issues here,” Melecio said. “One is the basic operation rule of the San Roque Dam. The other is a local government policy, which takes precedence against utilities.”

    He said it was “very clear in the dam’s basic operation rule that in the first 60 hours, water can already be released.”

    “So, when the rains start coming in heavily, you beat the rainfall so that this rainfall will not raise the water level to 290 [masl],” Melecio said.

    “We have a lot of robotic measurements, rain gauges in Mt. Sto. Tomas and Mt. Data along the Agno River. So, if you are a hydrologist, you should be able to interpret the rainfall and translate that,” he said.

    “There should be a management review of the capability of dam controllers. Do they know what they are doing?” he said.

    Massive spill over 10 hours

    Cojuangco said his investigation showed that the dam released for more than 10 hours 5,700 cms into the floodwater control system or dikes of the Agno River.

    When added to the normal 1,000-cubic-meter inflow from each of the three tributary rivers system, he said the dikes were overburdened with more than twice the floodwater control system’s capacity of 4,000 cubic meters per second.

    “The water released grossly exceeded what the system was designed for so it’s no wonder the whole of Pangasinan was submerged in water,” said Cojuangco, who noted that the dam operators should have released water in smaller volumes ahead of the storm’s arrival.

    ‘Lame excuse’

    Cojuangco dismissed as a “lame excuse” the dam operators blaming the weather bureau’s lack of equipment—Doppler radar—that would have advised them in advance of the amount of rainfall from an incoming typhoon or storm.

    The militant group Bagong Alyansang Makabayan (Bayan) Tuesday said the long-term solution to the flooding in Pangasinan was the decommissioning of the San Roque Dam.

  8. Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Posts
    3,872
    #8
    Wow. Its not like the dam operators are given advance info on the amount of rainfall to a scientific certainty. I do think that their culpability should be determined if they did not follow standard operating procedures like giving sufficient and advance warning to the areas affected by the water release.

  9. Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Posts
    8,452
    #9
    mga simpleng issue na pinapansin ng senate natin. halatang walang ginagawa ang senate natin dahil pati ang issue na ito, ginagawang big deal. halatang nagpapansin ang mga nasa senate talaga :hammer:

  10. Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    3,829
    #10
    Regarding warning naman eh, continous naman ang monitoring ng media regarding San Roque Dam. Nasa news yan daily, even before Oct 8.

    Etong provincial Government ng pangasinan ang engot wala daw fax na na recieve, alam na nilang bumalik si pepeng at panay na ang pag release ng San Roque ng tubig eh di man lang nag monitor. Halatang di ginawa ang trabaho nila.

    Sinakyan naman ng media na ubod ng expert regarding wheather condition and forecasting.

  11. Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Posts
    2,407
    #11
    Haay..

    mas mahirap naman siguro pag sumabog yung dam, di ba? ito sabi nung officemate ko na tiga pangasinan na binaha din ang bahay dun.

  12. Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    3,829
    #12
    Background lang mga bro. Taga Arellano, Dagupan ako, nasa tarlac ako nung friday. Pinilit kung umuwi via lingayen, stranded ako ng isang oras sa lingayen. Buti na lang nag lakas loob ang Dagupan Bus na pumasok ng Dagupan. Hangang Tulay sa Perez lang kami at dun na kami nag paabot ng umaga.

    Morning comes, ayun lusong na sa baha. Halos dibdib pa rin ang tubig from perez to arellano. As expected lubog ang kotse ko.

    Now imagine na lang kung tong mga expert sa senate at media ang nag operate ng dam at na breach. Etong local government naman eh naghahanap lang ng maturo. At nagpagamit naman ang media.

San Roque Dam Probe [merged]