Difference between low-charge turbo and standard turbo

[jraf_zams2]

Mga tsikoters,

May tatanong lang ako. Ano bang part sa low charge turbo ang pinagkaiba nito sa mga standard turbo charge? Katulad ng nakalagay sa mga crosswind na low charge.

[niky]

There's no such thing as a "low-charge" turbo. It's just Isuzu marketing talk. It just means that Isuzu's 4JA1-T turbocharger produces very low boost (which is why the engine is still rated at under 90 hp. It provides a tiny bit of midrange torque, but nothing to really get excited about... at most, it gives only 14 ft lbs of torque, and about 4 more horsepower. Exciting, huh? :hihihi: ...in practice, it's nearly un-noticeable, as the turbo Crosswinds I've driven have never felt any more powerful than the non-turbo ones.

It's a good way for them to market a disadvantage as a product feature. But truthfully, the turbo only helps keep the automatic Crosswind from being unbearably slow from a stop, and helps give the manual Crosswind a little extra pep, but not enough to warrant paying extra for it... which is why Isuzu has never charged much extra for the turbo unit.

[jjmichaels]

Similar to LPT of Volvo. Light or low pressure turbo. It sorta defeats the intended purpose. You'd like a little more ooomph in power when it has a turbo on it.

[alwayz_yummy]

LPT ata ginagamit para bolt-on lang at walang major internal part difference-->

for example, sa 4d56 non at turbo at sa 2c-local at sa 2c-turbo. may major difference sa internal components, specifically sa pistons and its rings..

[empy]

"low charge" (yes, a better name would be low pressure or low psi) turbos do have an advantage. they spool up quicker and do not lag as much (i.e. power delivery is more linear), and they are create less stress on an engine, especially if you're going with stock internals.

however, as niky said, they will not make a grossly underpowered car fly. they are better to enhance power delivery on decently powered cars or those that need a little more kick in the midrange at a fairly affordable price.

[niky]

Of course, in some case, you have to wonder why they even bothered. I could get just as much horsepower out of the 4JA1 by fiddling with the exhaust and injectors.

Heck, Isuzu could get more midrange just by shifting to CRDI. But that's kinda expensive to put in such a cheap car... especially one that sells for just as much as some CRDI equipped vehicles from other manufacturers...

[jraf_zams2]

Marami salamat sa mga reply nyo... May tanong ulit ako, kasi diba kung titingnan nyo yong turbo ng mga 4JA1-L, hawig talaga sya doon sa mga turbo na nakikita sa ibang sasakyan. di kaya magkaiba sila ng size ng propeler na nakakabit sa mga malalakas na turbo? Kung sakaling papalitan ko ng ibang turbo yong turbo ng 4JA1, katulad ng turbo ng mga DMAX or Alterra, ano ba yong possibleng mangyayari sa makina ng 4JA1? At ano ba yong mga dapat na modification yong gawin?

[rion]

so that means, the Crosswind N/A is the exact same engine with Crosswind Turbo?

so it's not the same in 4d56 case, where there is a 4D56 turbo and a 4D56 NA where they are different engines and also between 2C or 2C-T and 2L or 2L-T.

*jraf_zams2: if you are planning to increase boost, I suggest you add intercooler too. if I understand it correctly, you may risk your engine from additional heat and pressure...IF the engine is not really designed for higher psi...

atleast the xwind was low charge turbo, where some Adventure 4D56 and highlander just put intercooler stickers and sometimes airscoop upfront.

[niky]

It's most likely the same engine... the price difference between NA and turbo models from the beginning wasn't that big (meaning minimal cost in parts, possibly no internal differences), and the pressure is really very low.

I don't know how much an intercooler will do for the Crosswind, as, if the turbo doesn't give enough pressure, the intercooler will actually make it more sluggish.

[jraf_zams2]

Actually yong sa 4D56-T at 4D56 N/A ay magkaparehas lang talaga sila ng makina.ang pinagkaiba lang nila merong intercooler turbo yong 4D56-T. Yong sa case na maglalagay ka ng intercooler, mas maganda yong magiging effect noon sa cooling system ng makina tsaka mas magiging efficient yong makina mo pagdating sa fuel efficiency at power. Check nyo na lang sa Law ng Thermodynamics. Ibig sabihin pala, pag-high pressure yong turbo mo, kelangan mo ng intercooler.. pero meron kasi akong na-eexperience dati na yong turbo ng caterpillar nilagay nya sa ISUZU Forward L200 Intercooler turbo, ang nangyari mas naging malakas yong makina nya lalo na sa akyatan..kaya lang in the end nag-crush down din.nabasag yong makina nya sa sobrang lakas ng pressure sa loob..malamang dapat sychronize ang turbo at ang makina.. pero what if ginawa kong intercooler yong sa 4JA1-T tapos yong turbo na ilalagay ko ay yong sa D-Max or Alterra,ano ba yong possibleng mangyayari sa performance nito?

[mazdamazda]

what if ginawa kong intercooler yong sa 4JA1-T tapos yong turbo na ilalagay ko ay yong sa D-Max or Alterra,ano ba yong possibleng mangyayari sa performance nito?

for one, you can possibly look at a very costly repair bill.

simply put, the crosswind's engine isn't designed to handle all that additional power regardless if it has an intercooler or not.

[rion]

Actually yong sa 4D56-T at 4D56 N/A ay magkaparehas lang talaga sila ng makina.ang pinagkaiba lang nila merong intercooler turbo yong 4D56-T.

it has been mentioned in a number of threads that they have different internals.

some few threads:

http://tsikot.yehey.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11302
http://www.mitsubishi-forums.com/t14419-4d56-4d56t-.htm

as for 2C Tamaraw FX between 2C turbo Liteace
or 2L Revo between 2L turbo Hilux Surf... despite the same engine displacement, the piston's shape are different. even the air filter size is different.

meron kasi akong na-eexperience dati na yong turbo ng caterpillar nilagay nya sa ISUZU Forward L200 Intercooler turbo, ang nangyari mas naging malakas yong makina nya lalo na sa akyatan..kaya lang in the end nag-crush down din.nabasag yong makina nya sa sobrang lakas ng pressure sa loob...

pero what if ginawa kong intercooler yong sa 4JA1-T tapos yong turbo na ilalagay ko ay yong sa D-Max or Alterra,ano ba yong possibleng mangyayari sa performance nito?

he dis-regarded the engine's pressure limit for sure... maybe he could even have the wastegate removed...

you can increase your stock turbo pressure instead. transplanting a turbo with a different size is hell work.

but I agree with sir mazda. unless your baby is old na I would not risk it.

but if you really want to try, kung may manuals ka, check mo na lang pressure limit. kung may overboost warning code yung dashboard, mas ok.

but still risky Imo...

[JagXtrm]

just curious lang...

how "low" is the max boost ng isuzu crosswind low-charge turbo? may nakapag-connect na ba ng boost gauge sa engine & read the max boost? :D

[rsnald]

natanong ko na dati sa isuzu yan how much it would cost and what mods will they do if I wanted to convert my 4JA1 NA engine to their "low charge" turbo version. ang sabi sakin, di daw simple yung conversion at all the cylinder liners(?) and piston rings, exhaust etc will have to be changed and it will cost a hefty P100TH as per their guesstimate. so basically, it's the same engine, with stronger internal linings(?) to accomodate the extra pressure.

as for other turbo kits for the 4JA1, Denso offers it for $2560 in the US. (http://www.dencodiesel.com/turbo.asp). Sayang lang di ma-download yung turbo fitting instructions.

[boy astig]

Share ko lang po...

I have a friend who installed a surplus intercooler and turbocharger (from an isuzu bighorn) into his 4ja1 (hilander). I dont remember how much he spent for labor but it was really expensive Yung surplus parts, na freebie nya kasi.

We tried driving it along the nlex in the middle of the night and malaki talaga ang driving difference. Lakas ng boost at arangkada. Parang hindi diesel yung dala mo. When we tried to push the speed to 150 kmh, we started feeling strong vibrations from the engine. Thats when we started slowing down. Overall, accelerating to 140 kmh is just like driving a 1.6-2.0 gasoline engine. This happened three years ago. The vehicle still has the upgrade but the fellow doesn't floor the pedal anymore. Maximum driving speed for him now is 120.

Lessons learned:

If you have money to install that kind of upgrade in your 4ja1, do so at your own (pocket) risk

You WILL have all the additional power that you need. If you abuse that power, then be prepared to either buy a new engine or meet your creator

[20vanda01]

Share ko lang po...

You WILL have all the additional power that you need. If you abuse that power, then be prepared to either buy a new engine or meet your creator

OT po di ko lang mapigilan. Sabi nga ni Spiderman (at ni Pacman) great power comes with great responsibility. hehehe

Sorry po talaga, gusto ko lang banggitin..

[jraf_zams2]

Thanks sa inyong lahat.. Ngayon mas lalo ko na naintindihan yong concept behind turbo..