HELP!!! My innova D4D Black smoke- pls Help!!!

[Walter]

With regards to D4d problems, I'm very sure there would be solution to this in the near future. Denso is a good research company that does all the new technology incorporated in the engine management and exhaust management.

A good research company should not have released a defective product in the first place. Other car manufacturers do not have this type of engine problem. Some also use Denso systems. Besides, the owners here are not complaining about the Denso system, they are complaining on how Toyota is addressing the issue.

[Mile2]

A good research company should not have released a defective product in the first place. Other car manufacturers do not have this type of engine problem. Some also use Denso systems. Besides, the owners here are not complaining about the Denso system, they are complaining on how Toyota is addressing the issue.

It's your own point of view and you are entitle to it and I respect it, everyone here is complaining on how Toyota is addressing the problem and that includes me also, just read the whole thread. If you have red the entire thread, Toyota did have replaced vital parts which are Denso products in particular.

If we are just here posting rants without trying to give solutions and relevant info then we are just flame baiting.

[innova99]

hi,
I am from india and own a toyota innova d4d 2.4L, I have been experiencing Black smoke from the exhaust right from when i completed 5000 KMS.. The delaer blames it on dirty or adultrated Diesel but i doubt it, i have been filling diesel from various petrol bunks, over a long period of time ,one other thing is not to use hi-speed diesel i've been using NORMAL diesel.

So i went back to the dealership requesting them to do something abt it.. here are the list of procedures carried out under warranty till date.. i've been having this problem for over a year now..

1) after notifing them abt the problem the first thing they did was to clean the injectors.. after a 1000 kms the problem reappeared.

2. After cleaning the injectors they Re-mapped the ECM. but again the problem reappered.

3. After following the two steps above they changed the catalytic converter and recleaned the injectors.

4. After abt 2000 - 3000 kms the problem has reappered.

5. Currently they are trying to change the Catalytic Converter yet again ( Second Time) and have requested the car for 2 days to enable them to take it for a long Test drive.

I'm still waiting for the car as it may take a couple of days.. while searching on the internet i came across this forum & learnt a lotta ppl like me are having same problems with the D-4D. The dealers seem pretty puzzled as to how to proceed further in my case after writing to Toyota i have managed to get thier attn on this case and they are monitoring my car.

By chaging the catalyic converter now for the second time i belive may not solve the problem.. it seems like it will reappear like the last time.. i think there is a problem with the Fuel pump and injectors ..

Any Person whose technically sound can shed some light on to this will be of great help ..

Hi folks,

This is an update on my black smoking innova.. the dealer for the second time changed the entire catalytic converter along with full ecm programming and injector cleaning.. the car seems okay now.. have driven abt 500 kms on the new setup.. very little or no smoke is visible from the exhaust.. they claim this should sort the problem out but i'm taking it causiously till i complete 2000 or more kms i'm going on a 700 kms drive soon .. so lets see.

On being asked why they are doing the same procedure and how will it solve the problem they claim that that catalytic converter is a modified one.. they even reprogrammmed my keys.. This procedure was done with supervision from toyota companies represtatives.

anyone here whose gone thru the same story ???

[ches]

i hope this solves the problem, my friends told me that my innova is emmiting smoke also but not that black, one time i tried to flooring the pedal to 3000 rpm in P it emmited black smoke. what i know crdi engine should not emmit too much smoke mine is now at 3200 odo will just let toyota check it on 5000 pms.

[Mile2]

Hi folks,

This is an update on my black smoking innova.. the dealer for the second time changed the entire catalytic converter along with full ecm programming and injector cleaning.. the car seems okay now.. have driven abt 500 kms on the new setup.. very little or no smoke is visible from the exhaust.. they claim this should sort the problem out but i'm taking it causiously till i complete 2000 or more kms i'm going on a 700 kms drive soon .. so lets see.

On being asked why they are doing the same procedure and how will it solve the problem they claim that that catalytic converter is a modified one.. they even reprogrammmed my keys.. This procedure was done with supervision from toyota companies represtatives.

anyone here whose gone thru the same story ???

The solution might be correct, catalytic converter somehow restrict engines hp and to overcome this they previously had the engine running rich to gain more hp. But running rich will produce more black particulate matters or soot.

If we search the internet, in other countries you can buy modified whole exhaust system with catalytic converter for D4d. The modified exhaust system guaranties additional hp.

[innova99]

The solution might be correct, catalytic converter somehow restrict engines hp and to overcome this they previously had the engine running rich to gain more hp. But running rich will produce more black particulate matters or soot.

If we search the internet, in other countries you can buy modified whole exhaust system with catalytic converter for D4d. The modified exhaust system guaranties additional hp.

very interesting point.. i could never fully understand why they're after the catalytic converter.. it all makes sense now.. so now have they made the ecm setting to lesser " rich " state and added a modified converter ??? What exactly is toyota doing by changing the Exhaust system twice ?

Can u please elaborate a little more on this.. it would help me understand this better.. my question is.. if they havent got the " ecm setting " "spot on.." perfectly then black smoke will return very quickly with the modified exhaust system ? maybe after a few thousand kms ???

[Mile2]

If we read the previous post of our fellow innova D4d owners here, recent new units are now equipped with newer exhaust system complying with Euro IV standards which means it has better exhaust emission treatment but certainly this would mean a little drop in power as trade off, so to overcome the drop in power "they might" had the ECU running rich so that the output would still be consistent to what the previous released model has before.

here's an article about modified D4d exhaust system
http://www.eng-tek.com.au/product_in...roducts_id=233

[innova99]

in india we still follow the EURO III system so selling cars with EURO IV is unlikely.. but maybe they have a modified or alternate exhaust system which they replace on troubled innovas, coupled with ECM re-mapping. lets hope the black smoke doesnt return on my car.. will know after a few thousand kms.. i havent noticed any power increase or drop however i do feel that the engine noise may have gone up a bit after the re-map.

[dindy]

in india we still follow the EURO III system so selling cars with EURO IV is unlikely.. but maybe they have a modified or alternate exhaust system which they replace on troubled innovas, coupled with ECM re-mapping. lets hope the black smoke doesnt return on my car.. will know after a few thousand kms.. i havent noticed any power increase or drop however i do feel that the engine noise may have gone up a bit after the re-map.

Hi Innova99, Mile2, Chilun, Dedeypi, Cheska, Tambok and the rest of the people here!

Its been a long time since i checked out my email and tsikot and a lot of very interesting things and topics here and i would also like to add on this...

dont know were to start but here goes......

First of all my Innova is still with the Ortigas dealer since Sept 23, 2008. Its more than a month already and my unit is still with them. If everyone has read the 1st page of this thread, i enumarated all the procedures done and parts that was replaced with my unit. During the last week of september, TMP has informed me/us (aka "THE BLACK COALITION GROUP" according to TMP) that the problem of our units is the catalytic converters and since they have pinpointed the problem, they will need to wait for the new Modified Catalytic Converter that is being "produce" according to TMP by toyota Japan. While waiting for the converter, TMP issued me a service unit while waiting for the said part.

My question with TMP after the first few week of my unit with the dealer is " are they sure that Toyota japan...THE TOYOTA JAPAN will make a 5 modified catalytic just to accomodate the 5 of us??? Is our group really that special that they will bother to do all of these? If in fact they made one, then if they install it with our units then we would be the 5 special innovas out there that has a unique part. What happens if it that part breaks down?? Do they need to manufacture one again??!!!! Will a RECALL of innovas with the same problem be done?

After asking TMP..... all they can say to me are "noted sir" and "we can give you an answer as soon as the catalytic becomes available" wow naman!!!

-Last week of september....TMP told us that the new modified converter will become available tentatively by Oct 8.
-Oct 8 No converter yet and Oct 15 it will become available daw pero WALA PADIN!
-3rd week of October, i was adviced to get my unit already since TMP has cleaned the exhaust and muffler and replaced for the second time my EGR and that no smoke is present anymore. I asked them if the new converter is installed and they said NOT YET... so my question is "why do you want me to get my unit" are you sure that smoke wont come out well in fact there are no special procedure done except cleaning... grabe na to
-Oct 30.... here comes the weird and funny part..... TMP said from the very start that theyve pinpointed the problem already and that the culprit is the Catalytic and that they have been insisting that a modified one is on its way. After going to that direction, they made a different story now and MILE2 i will definitely need your techinical expertise on this..... TMP said that the problem is not the converter but the EGR!!! they said that they have replaced the EGR and that by the end of nov or early december the new program for the EGR will be up dated with my ECU and that we need to have our units back for the re programming/ updating of the software.....wawawhat!!!!????? They said that, to complete the process of really eliminating the black smoke, the new program should be installed again my question is will the program be installed with the other innovas also. TMP said that if they have the same black smoke problems then they will install it. They said that they will only install/ update your program if deemed necessary.... case to case.

Although i believe that there is a much more possibility that the EGR will be the culprit for the EGR has a connection to the ECU and that if there is a slight problem with the EGR program then black smoke may happen. The reason that their computer cannot get a signal that there is black smoke is because there is no connection between the Catalyitc and the ECU. Again i am not sure and that MILE2 i bet you are the expert on this... you might like to give a feedback on this....

According to the VP for Technical, what is mysterious is that they couldnt find a common factor for our innovas aside from all are emitting black smoke.

It is not a batch problem for we have different innovas purchased on different batches. They ruled out the Catalytic already for the reason that all of innovas that have the same problems are all automatic transmission and that the VP and i both agree that it shouldnt have a bearing on the smoke problem. They dont have an innova with black smoke case that is a manual transmission.... i can vouch to that coz the service unit they lent me is a 07 Innova E diesel with catalytic and ive tried to rev it to almost red line and completely this innova is clear of smoke.... WEIRD!!!!

Now the reason that my unit is still with the dealer and that i am not ready to get it is because i would like them to write a report of what procedure was done with my unit, what precautionary measure was done, what to expect and what else needs to be done.... i would like to have written proof of what they did. I would like TMP to write that if i do get my unit and after all the parts and program update was done but if black smoke still occurs then i would like them to replace my unit or refund my money. its a long shot but my mediation with DTI and TMP is just around the corner.

Now to add more.... Sgt pepers unit and ampys unit are all free of smoke up until now. I believe that they have also passed the emission testing but what they have noticed is that inspite of not having black smoke, the scent of the fumes from their unit smells bad... but nevertheless.... NO Black smoke present....

But up until when.... that we have to see....

Peace!

Din

[Mile2]

Hi Dindy,

I'm not an expert, it just happened that I do lots of readings on updates with regards to cars and mechanical things as it became my passion maybe because I spent my childhood helping my father doing cars and passenger vehicles.

Technically, Innova's engines and exhaust system are far more sophisticated than my previous experiences that is why I spent some of my time reading here and sharing what I can found on the I'net.

Maybe you can give Innova99 a private message on what has been done technically on his car by Toyota India. Reading from his post, it was said that "a new and modified catalytic converter" was installed coupled with ECU programming. If India already received the modified catalytic converter then we should have it here from the regional dispatch center (Thailand or India)?