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  1. Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    2,027
    #151
    IT WILL FLY!

    the conveyor cannot stop the forward movement of the airplane. kumakagat sa hangin yung engine. aabante yan, yung gulong parang free wheel lang. pag umabante, magkakaroon na ng bernoulli effect or kung anuman iyon sa wings. kailangan lang mahaba yung conveyor para makaabot sa take off speed. kung maikli mag-crash yan ano magagawa nung gulong, hindi naman yun ang nagpapaabante ng eroplano..

  2. Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Posts
    1,496
    #152
    Quote Originally Posted by nerbyoso View Post


    The prop/jet pushes the plane through the AIR until it reaches take-off speed, which is the same no matter how fast the wheels are going. again it uses the air to move forward and not the ground....in contrast to a car that uses the GROUND to move forward.

    re: aircraft carrier...sir, i'm sorry, but i didnt get your idea regarding the use of treadmill/conveyor on an aircraft carrier...wala akong nakitang use/role for it to launch a plane..


    a conventional plane is no different than a VTOL except that it is designed to use a certain lenght of runway to achieve flight.

    give it another serious thinking tonight.
    I agree, you have to push the plane using air for it to reach a certain speed. Ang assumption ko dito is since the treadmill matches the wheel speed, the airplane never moves. No forward movement=no distance covered. No distance covered, no speed. No speed=no lift.

    For example, when running at 5mph on a treadmill, does air flow over us at 5mph? No because we are stationary. Now for example we put on a rocket pack (ala Wiley Coyote) on our backs and use it to propel us 5mph(on roller blades) on a treadmill running at exactly 5mph. Will there be movement? Still no. It doesnt matter where the source of propulsion is (this case rocket pack), since the treadmill will always match our forward velocity, there can be no speed.

    Kaya nga aircraft carriers and airports have certain runway lengths, that length is the minimum distance needed by the plane to acheive sufficient velocity to produce lift. Since running on the treadmill does not produce any velocity, no lift.

    Ayoko nang pag-isipan to mamaya

  3. Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    1,218
    #153
    Ang daming ayaw maniwala, hehehe.

    Some people are concentrating too much on the wheel/conveyor belt-effect, that the basics get overlooked ... that the medium is air. The plane will move forward, even if you take out the wings. Just like what people on the other side of the argument keep pointing out, the wheels will just spin faster.

  4. Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Posts
    2,703
    #154
    Quote Originally Posted by Chip View Post
    Ang assumption ko dito is since the treadmill matches the wheel speed, the airplane never moves.
    No. The plane will move because there is no friction between the plane and the treadmill, thanks to wheel bearings.

    Now for example we put on a rocket pack (ala Wiley Coyote) on our backs and use it to propel us 5mph(on roller blades) on a treadmill running at exactly 5mph. Will there be movement? Still no.
    Yes there will be movement because the roller blades effectively rendered the treadmill to be frictionless.

    For example. You are on roller blades, standing on a very long treadmill. With treadmill not running, somebody pushes you forward momentarily and off you go rolling at constant speed. You will remain at the same speed forever if not stopped by very little friction force on the roller's bearings. Now while you are cruising at the same speed, the treadmill was started and moved backwards. Will you be slowing down now? No, because there is practically no friction between you and the treadmill surface. You simply continue to cruise at the same speed, but now the wheels are turning faster (because there is friction between the treadmill and the roller rubbers).

    It doesnt matter where the source of propulsion is (this case rocket pack), since the treadmill will always match our forward velocity, there can be no speed.
    It does matter where the propulsion is applied to a wheel. For a plane, propulsion is applied at the center of the wheel, similar to the roller blades, and wheel bearings effectively cancels out friction at the rubber surface. In this case, the plane (or the roller skater with jetpack) will move as usual, regardless of runway (or treadmill) movement.

    For a car, propulsion is derived from friction between tire and road,i.e., propulsion is apllied at the bottom surface of the wheel. In this case, the basic intuition works. The car will remain stationary if the road matches the car speed. The car can be made to go forward or backwards depending on the difference of speed between wheel and road.

    Kaya nga aircraft carriers and airports have certain runway lengths, that length is the minimum distance needed by the plane to acheive sufficient velocity to produce lift. Since running on the treadmill does not produce any velocity, no lift.

    Ayoko nang pag-isipan to mamaya
    With or without runway movement, the plane will move and take-off as usual requiring the same length of runway as usual.

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Will the Airplane Fly??????????