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  1. Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Posts
    22,658
    #281
    Quote Originally Posted by cocoy View Post
    so a 4WD, will just automatically spin around if it aquaplanes? even without braking or turning the steering wheel?
    Not to speak for M2, but I guess he based his statement to the fact that AWD (without intervention from traction aiding electronics or limited slip/locking diffs) will always send the MOST power to the wheel with the LEAST traction. Mahabang paliwananagan iyan, but that is how it really goes. Otherwise the system will bind when you take a turn.

    As per M2's theory, maybe the Fortuner driver was on the throttle when he hit the puddle (and did not back off the throttle), thereby transferring the most power to the wheel with the least traction. When all the tires (now with different torque levels) regained traction, this could have upset the vehicle's balance.

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  2. Join Date
    May 2006
    Posts
    913
    #282
    so would it be safe to say that it was indeed driver error that caused the fortuner to spin? or can we fully blame the puddle of water?

  3. Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    1,985
    #283
    Quote Originally Posted by scarab View Post
    ...eto na

    Is the Skyway above the law?
    BACKSEAT DRIVER By James Deakin
    The Philippine STAR 10/18/2006


    The driver of the Fortuner was on the leftmost lane of the Skyway heading southbound, just before the merging point of the Magallanes on ramp when he hit a large, deep pool of standing water. The Toyota aquaplaned and started spinning counter clockwise. The rear of the Fortuner slammed into the left lane barriers, bounced off and spun in a clockwise direction across three lanes, then struck the right hand barriers, where it eventually came to a halt. The Trooper was entering the Skyway from the Magallanes on ramp, and swerved to avoid the out-of-control Fortuner. Neither driver could confirm whether there was any contact between the two SUVs, but the evasive action of the Trooper, combined with the slippery conditions, was enough to push him over the edge. Literally.
    The Fortuner was in the left most lane, when the Fortuner hit the puddle it caused the vehicle to spin counter clockwise 180 degrees before having rear the hit the barrier. Then only to spin again after bouncing off the barrier this time in a clockwise spin. Hmmm???? Was that portion a straight or a curve? Two things could have happened to cause the spin. 1) He must have turned his steering wheel when he hit the puddle to spin 180 degrees. Because as everyone has said if you keep the steering straight and let off the gas you shouldn't be spinning 180 degrees. 2) The AWD of the Fortuner transferred most of the power to rear wheels once it sensed resistance from the front tire contact hitting the puddle, this caused the Fortuner to oversteer. If you've driven through a deep puddle at high speed you'll notice that there is resistance when you first hit the water.

    Just my 2 cents.

  4. Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    1,985
    #284
    double post

  5. Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Posts
    2,976
    #285
    Quote Originally Posted by Driv3er View Post
    how many of you hever have NEVER driven at 80kph on a wet road?
    I haven't, and I can take the high moral road because its true.

    It's doubtful that Mr. Quintal was driving at 80kph. That was a self-serving statement, maybe to mitigate the consequences of his act. The best he can do now is to shoulder all the expenses incurred by the victims, and learn to drive more responsibly, especially in wet and slippery conditions.

  6. Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Posts
    457
    #286
    Quote Originally Posted by Galactus View Post
    Driving at 80kmh after a rainshower, knowing that the roads are wet and slippery is never a smart thing to do.

    Re: this Deakin guy and blaming the PNCC, I remember an article he wrote wherein his brother accidentally ran over a puddle, splashing another motorist driving a Kia who had his windows open. Naturally, the guy was pissed and ran after Deakin's brother, who didn't even stop and apologize. The brother rationalized that he didn't stop as the other driver was raging like hell, and said he would have done the right thing if that wasn't the case. (Yeah, right!) Ang ending, hindi naabutan ng Kia yung kapatid, at obviously nagsumbong kay Kuya. Eto namang si Deakin, sinisi pa yung driver and even blamed his "genetically-deficient asset" for the Kia guy's seething behavior. Talk about abuse of power! Eh kahit sino naman, basta natalsikan ng putik sa mukha eh magagalit! Tapos tatakbuhan ka pa. Reading his column above makes me think twice about his motives. Obvious talaga na may bias.
    This is why I don't believe everything the media says. They write/broadcast what they want you to hear and see. Not always 100% truth, as they claimed. There will always be bias and ulterior motives.

    It would be so easy if somone just admitted his mistake, made up for it, learn from it, and that's it. End of story. Things happen. People make mistakes, minor or tragic. People learn from it.

    But these rarely happen. So off we go again to arguments and counter arguments.

  7. Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Posts
    22,710
    #287
    Quote Originally Posted by mrpink View Post
    he has his points .. he was harping about the international standards of the railings .. i'm no expert .. but how fast can you hit an international standard railing before it gives way ? .. but i'm pretty sure he would have been all over the drivers as well .. if his boss wasn't involved ..
    Maybe... like I said, we can't really tell.

    I've talked to some people, and thanks to that patrolman's instant verdict (without even consulting eyewitnesses), Kenneth Quintal has been branded from here until the hereafter by people who listened to the news as a bloody-minded street racer.

    Like I've said before, if the guy is innocent of speeding, poor him.

    But as the Trooper was coming up from the Magallanes interchange and Quintal was coming from further north, it's obvious then, that they weren't racing each other.

    Speeding? God only knows... Judas not pay.

    ----

    James is right about the railing. How can the PNCC claim they're US standard...standard for what? School zones?

    Like I've said, modern US highway barriers are designed to deflect vehicular impacts instead of absorb them. Our current post and railing barriers don't. If they're built to any standards, maybe it's the 1970's standard.

    It doesn't take thousands of tons of concrete to make better barriers for the Skyway, just up-to-date construction techniques. Modern highway barriers are astoundingly simple and effective:



    The angle of the lower portion pushes the impact energy up, and the angle of the upper portion pushes the vehicle back onto the road. The only way a vehicle is going through this barrier is if it hits it head on.

    Expensive? consider the temporary barriers the PNCC uses follow a similar design already.

    The Trooper in question only hit the barrier at a slight angle, and it still went through... US standards? Bull sh*t.

    Ang pagbalik ng comeback...

  8. Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Posts
    22,658
    #288
    Ang sabi lang ng PNCC dun sa isang interview ay 'international standard' sila. Ano nga ba ang international standard? Baka naman nga mababa talaga (below U.S. standard).

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  9. Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Posts
    526
    #289
    Quote Originally Posted by Galactus View Post
    I haven't, and I can take the high moral road because its true.

    It's doubtful that Mr. Quintal was driving at 80kph. That was a self-serving statement, maybe to mitigate the consequences of his act. The best he can do now is to shoulder all the expenses incurred by the victims, and learn to drive more responsibly, especially in wet and slippery conditions.

    Yep, he is definitely thinking of what possible mitigating circumstances that he can institue in order to ease the penalty/ies that may be imposed upon him.

    IMO, shouldering all expenses is not enough; under our civil code a person who is criminally liable is also civily liable. Dapat kulong yan for endangering and ending a life of another.

  10. Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Posts
    22,710
    #290
    It would then depend on what the judge would say, I guess. In this case, speeding would have ordinarily caused minor injuries to anyone he would have hit. But the Trooper going through the barrier was really a freak occurence.

    It's up to the family of the deceased if they want to pursue the issue, but, of course, they probably don't have the money to.

    What's the Trooper driver's story? Did he say that the Fortuner hit him? That could be a sore point in the case if the Fortuner caused him to swerve into the barrier without actually hitting him.

    We'll probably never know.

    RE: Galactus, while I'm still 50:50 about Quintal's speeding (although I personally think 80 km/h is already excessive speed in the rain for an SUV), right on on the second part... especially about driving more responsibly.

    Don't trust the PNCC to do their part in ensuring a safe highway... If he lived further south, he'd know that the SLEX is one of the most dangerous highways anywhere... concrete barriers lining the construction, arranged haphazardly, potholes the size of a cow, ruts and cambers that send novice drivers veering into the grass... it's a wonderful place to drive.

    Ang pagbalik ng comeback...

Vehicle falls from Skyway; 4 injured