GM in trouble

**AG4** · December 8th, 2008 01:30 PM

Originally Posted by uls

the big 3 automakers are just 3 of thousands and thousands of US companies on the edge of the cliff

it just so happens they get more media coverage than others

They got more media coverage because in the US alone, the domestic auto industry employs millions of people (plus millions more outside in regional plants around the world).

**uls** · December 8th, 2008 01:50 PM

well, the one thing that was responsible for the housing boom was also responsible for the expansion of the global auto industry in the past years --- LOOSE CREDIT.

The new world order now is tighter govt control over banks, stricter lending standards

so any industry that was relying on its customers being able to access easy credit will have to get used to the new environment.

they just have to accept that things will not be the same as before.

**tidus1203** · December 8th, 2008 02:20 PM

Fiery debate regarding the bailout. Peter Schiff (against the bailout) VS Virg Bernero (mayor of Lansing, Michigan and for the bailout). You decide? I believe more on the points raised by Peter Schiff.

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-BmqthF1LVM"]YouTube - Peter Schiff on CNN Auto Bailout Intense Debate! 12/4/08 part 1/2[/ame]
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_GlBwq-7rIs&NR=1"]YouTube - Peter Schiff Dec 4 CNN Headline News - Part 2[/ame]

**uls** · December 8th, 2008 04:07 PM

FT:

December 7, 2008 - Company crashes set to hit record next year

Record numbers of companies will go bankrupt next year with 200,000 insolvencies in Europe alone and "an explosion" of failed businesses in the US, according to the world's largest credit insurer.

The US will see 62,000 companies go bust next year, compared with 42,000 this year and 28,000 last year, says a report by Euler Hermes, part of German insurer Allianz.

The absolute numbers, however, pale in comparison with the figures from western Europe, where the larger number of small companies mean insolvencies are expected to rise by a third from 149,000 last year to 197,000 next.

No bailout for most

**Monseratto** · December 8th, 2008 06:32 PM

Originally Posted by tidus1203

Fiery debate regarding the bailout. Peter Schiff (against the bailout) VS Virg Bernero (mayor of Lansing, Michigan and for the bailout). You decide? I believe more on the points raised by Peter Schiff.

LOL! That's what you get when you pit Peter Schiff with a small time politician. Biglang pumutok si Mr. Mayor at nag wala. Patriotism my AS*!

One point Peter raised was why Cerebrus Capital, 80% percent owner of Chrysler, didn't want to put in additional capital to Chrysler. Why aren't the Big Three asking for loans from private investment groups? Obviously they know that whatever money they may put in will never be seen again..

**tidus1203** · December 8th, 2008 06:37 PM

OT: Yep Peter is all cool and collected and si Mayor napikon na. Shows who the loser is, come on its just a debate...

On topic, Peter made a good point regarding the previous Chrysler bailout in the late 70's. Many pro bailout people point to the bailout of Chrysler 25 years ago as a success since the government made money... Well he did suggest that if Chrysler was allowed to go under back then, then we don't have to bailout them out now and might have a cleaner auto industry to begin with. So we really don't know if the American people really did make money on the 1st Chrysler bailout since with the present bailout they might have to pay more and erase all the gains on the 1st bailout...

**AG4** · December 8th, 2008 07:54 PM

Originally Posted by tidus1203

OT: Yep Peter is all cool and collected and si Mayor napikon na. Shows who the loser is, come on its just a debate...

Peter might have a point, but its obvious he was trying to piss of the mayor and he was successful. :evillaugh
What the mayor was about to say about the Japanese government protecting their local industry is also true.
In Japan imported vehicles are usually heavily taxed.

**Monseratto** · December 8th, 2008 08:30 PM

If Chrysler did well after it's 80's bailout, why did it merge then quickly dumped at a loss by Daimler Benz?

Speaking of the Japanese protectionist market, will the japanese auto companies suceed by marketing in their homeland alone? They rely heavily on exporting their products overseas. But not all of them suceeded. Nissan nearly went bankrupt, it was rescued by Renault. Mazda also almost went under before it was rescued by Ford. Note: no japanese goverment intervention here.

**tidus1203** · December 8th, 2008 08:33 PM

Also here is another thing, the private equity firm who owns Chrysler right now Cerberus does not even want to put more money into the company. If Chrysler has a viable plan (they did make a plan and present one to the Senate) and I am sure Cerberus knows of its plan (being the owner) then why isn't Cerberus bailing them out using private money? The answer. Cerberus is not confident of investing even more money, they have already lost a lot of money as it is. Only government money is stupid enough to invest in failing companies private money won't even touch it.

**Monseratto** · December 8th, 2008 08:48 PM

Originally Posted by tidus1203

Also here is another thing, the private equity firm who owns Chrysler right now Cerberus does not even want to put more money into the company. If Chrysler has a viable plan (they did make a plan and present one to the Senate) and I am sure Cerberus knows of its plan (being the owner) then why isn't Cerberus bailing them out using private money? The answer. Cerberus is not confident of investing even more money, they have already lost a lot of money as it is. Only government money is stupid enough to invest in failing companies private money won't even touch it.

Hehe...I mentioned it earlier 4 replies ago. Lucky for Daimler Benz that they dumped Chrysler when they did. Na affect ung bottomline nila because of the bottomless Chrysler pit. Also the Mercedes badge was being affected, being associated with Chrysler.

If they were still stuck with Chrysler now, no way they can sell it...