Auto-LPG Conversion Thread

[ghosthunter]

before refueling, kelangan ba ubos laman ng tank or u can refuel anytime?

You can refuel anytime. You can also limit the amount of LPG you put in the tank by the money you have at hand too.

Example, you are running on empty but you only have P300 in your wallet. You can choose to refill with P200 for the meantime.

* sir GH: ilan liters capacity ng "donut" tank? what's the maximum capacity ng donut tank? di ba prone na pasukin ng debris yung filler nozzle?

"Donut" tanks have a typical capacity of 40, 50 and 60 liters. The size you will actually use in your car depends on the available space in your vehicle. In the case of CRV 2nd gen, it's a 50L donut tank.

Note: the capacity of the LPG tank is a reference of the 100% fill capacity BUT in normal use, you can only fill to about 80% to 90% of the maximum (depending on whom you refill with and what time of day). The rest is expansion space for the fuel.

[ghosthunter]

So after reading the entire thread, i have somewhat a more than enough understanding of what the conversion is about. My problem is about the engine itself, since i grew up in 12r's and 4k's, and my experience with efi's is basically ask someone else to do it. So i need to ask those who know Honda engines in particular for help :D

what's the best unit for my car? closed loop or SGI? and how to finetune the f/a mix? what do i need to tell the mechanic, like the buzzwords so that i may appear "learned" and thus not be fooled easily

First, you might want to check your car's engine first before going with LPG conversion. You might want to see why your car is doing poorly in it's average fuel consumption figures. It could be an engine in need of a good tune-up to a need for a proper wheel alignment job to a ballbearing in need of being replaced.

Now, what kit to use? Your choices are open-loop, closed loop & SGI. If you have the budget to spend, SGI would get you the best results. A closed loop system would get similar results (with a slight power loss) at a cheaper price but only a few shops have closed loop kits available. The last choice is the open loop system which is the cheapest as well.

A word of advise, bring a new engine air filter when you have your car converted to auto-LPG.

[ghosthunter]

SGI ka na ser ; this kit comes with an ECU;
you wont need any manual tweaking; computerized po ang tuning.

it's the same with the close-loop LPG system, it has an ECU to control the a/f ratio.

[paolorenzo]

So GH, how does the filling work for LPG pumps? Nag auto stop rin ba, like petrol pumps? Or do you need to look at the gauge everytime, and estimate 80-90%? Is there any danger of overfilling or spillage?

[ghosthunter]

So GH, how does the filling work for LPG pumps? Nag auto stop rin ba, like petrol pumps? Or do you need to look at the gauge everytime, and estimate 80-90%? Is there any danger of overfilling or spillage?

Auto-lpg pumps are automatic. When it does cut off, you might want to check the LPG tank gauge just in case it has cut-off too early though.

No danger of spillage/overfilling as compared to gasoline pumps.

[paolorenzo]

2. no mention whatsoever of installers in Davao

btw, filling centers are not a problem since almost all of the taxis here are LPG powered, and one thing i noticed... almost all kia's reek of that stale
egg stench, while with the aveos and sentras all are ok. probably because of the overall quality of the newer cars. but there is this kia avila that overtook a lancer struggling up the access ramp, and i noticed that the rpm didn't drop at all! i asked the driver if he's on LPG. he is! ganda ng pagkatono ng taxi nya hehehe and that was with A/C on!

The fact that most taxis in Davao are LPG will mean that there is already an installer there. Best to find a well converted unit (like the Aveos/Sentras), and ask the driver where conversion was done.

IMO, mag SGI ka na, if the Accord can be fitted with one. At 100 liters/month, you should reach ROI in about 20 months (assuming for a 40k SGI kit, and P20 per liter savings). Grabe naman FC mo, para ka nang Expedition.

[Elroi]

thanks a lot, sir Ghosthunter...

[Redman7]

So GH, how does the filling work for LPG pumps? Nag auto stop rin ba, like petrol pumps? Or do you need to look at the gauge everytime, and estimate 80-90%? Is there any danger of overfilling or spillage?

Automatic cut-off, No spillage compared to gas....

Over-filling...on the other hand; i would still recommend you monitor the pump's meter (#liter filled vs your tanks 80-85% capacity)...

I have experienced high pressure pumps; >90% filled na ung tank ko di pa tumitigil nor signs na titigil na ung pump, so i have to tell the gas boy to manually stop the filling process.
(normally the gas hose will start to vibrate or the pump filling starts to slow down pag reaching nya na yung >80% capacity ng tank)....

[xykosomatik]

The fact that most taxis in Davao are LPG will mean that there is already an installer there. Best to find a well converted unit (like the Aveos/Sentras), and ask the driver where conversion was done.

IMO, mag SGI ka na, if the Accord can be fitted with one. At 100 liters/month, you should reach ROI in about 20 months (assuming for a 40k SGI kit, and P20 per liter savings). Grabe naman FC mo, para ka nang Expedition.

yup but based on the smell of the older taxis from 10 ft away, you can just imagine the quality of the installers who serviced them. the aveos and sentras are with a big taxi company who, among other things, have a shipyard and a bus line, so most likely they installed it themselves. so far no big presence yet here for LPG conversions, aside from 1 local oil player. and since they are the only one with a name, surely they will be charging bigtime.

my FC sucks more compared to an Expe, and bro, you're not the first nor the last who will comment on that thats why i want to have her converted... mahirap kasi siya bitawan, ang ganda ng ride with only 70+k on the odo :D

Sir GH:
yup car's all checked out, but that's just how the FC is.. have compared notes with other accord owners as well. the traffic here is comparable to makati's traffic everyday. kahit short distance lang, panay stop-go naman. can't really wait to be LPG'ed :D

[paolorenzo]

good luck with your hunt for an installer xykosomatik. I spent 3 years in Davao, during the latter days of the PUs, and the dawning of the Holiday Taxis (Kia Pride CD5). Taxis are my preferred way to travel around the city, kasi nga Davao City is pretty much compressed in a small area. My P40 then can get me anywhere around town I wanted to go to. With the traffic buildup in the past decade, that explains the poor FC.

PU na lang (minica)! Tapos LPG pa! :D

[xykosomatik]

thanks paolorenzo.... i'm sure there are installers here.. what i'm looking for are professional and reputable installers :D

yup, nowadays your P60 can still take you anywhere... the cd5's are still around but their days are now numbered since the franchises for non-aircon taxis will no longer be renewed.

minica? only a handfull still exists.. sure will be fun, no problems looking for a parking space :p

[jov78ph]

Thanks Ghosthunter.

Just a piece of advice who are having some reservations on LPG conversion. If you extra money to do something about the rise in fuel cost, go with the conversion. Its either you we spend in advance for the LPG or just let the would be savings you'll get in the long run. Greenfuel has a great price not to mention their very accomodating team of people from top to bottom.

Sacrifice a little time and some bucks, the rest will come in big big savings.

[*TubbY*]

May I ask what the oldest moldel car you can fit an LPG convertion kit into? I'm thinking of getting a fairly good second hand vehicle less than P100k then have it converted into LPG. I'm thinking of late 80's to early 90's sentras, lancers and corollas. Is this a good idea? Will 15-20 year old cars still behave "as normal" if they get converted at such a late age? My concern is that due to the wear and tear that the vehicle has gone through, the engine might not take the LPG as good as cars made in the late 90's to current models. Technology may be an issue too, cars made during that period are not as 'reliable' than cars made recently. I might end up with a lemon... an LPG powered lemon. :banana1:

[ghosthunter]

May I ask what the oldest moldel car you can fit an LPG convertion kit into? I'm thinking of getting a fairly good second hand vehicle less than P100k then have it converted into LPG. I'm thinking of late 80's to early 90's sentras, lancers and corollas. Is this a good idea? Will 15-20 year old cars still behave "as normal" if they get converted at such a late age? My concern is that due to the wear and tear that the vehicle has gone through, the engine might not take the LPG as good as cars made in the late 90's to current models. Technology may be an issue too, cars made during that period are not as 'reliable' than cars made recently. I might end up with a lemon... an LPG powered lemon. :banana1:

In general, nearly all gasoline powered cars can be converted to run on LPG. The auto-LPG kit will be the venturi-mixer type LPG kits. There might be some problems with certain cars that require LEADED GASOLINE because their valve seats are soft and requires the "lead" in leaded gasoline for lubrication. As with those cars converted to be able to run on unleaded gasoline, the valve seats will have to be replaced with hardened valve seats. Once that is done, I don't see much problem with those cars running on LPG as long as the engine is still reliable and in good running condition.

Cars with EFI type engines will be easiest to convert and operate. Older carburated engines can run on LPG but switching between fuels will be a manual process and cannot be done on the fly as compared to EFI engines.

So if you are planning to convert a 15-20 year old car to use auto-LPG, I might suggest you first have the engine checked if it's in good health. If you have a choice of either carb or efi type engine, choose efi before converting as this would make it easier later to operate.

One more thing to consider if you really are planning to convert a 15-20 year old car, how long are you planning to keep the car? Is the rest of the car reliable or at least comfortable to use? Have you ever considered selling the car and getting a "newer" car instead which might have less defects and maybe more comfortable?

[xykosomatik]

what GH said doesn't just apply to old cars, it is also applicable to your current ride as well. our accord may be 8 yrs old, but only has 71+ kms on the odo. was seriously considering replacing it for a pickup or mid size suv, something thats diesel and fuel efficient, but we just simply cannot give up the comfort of the accord. our only complaint is really just the FC, and when we do convert, we have already decided that the accord will be for keeps :D

oh for some extra cash to do what one of the forumers said and buy one of those 2nd hand low mileage Expe's and convert it to lpg :D:D

[ghosthunter]

oh for some extra cash to do what one of the forumers said and buy one of those 2nd hand low mileage Expe's and convert it to lpg :D:D

Although an XP is really comfy especially on long trips, if you are going to buy one, IMHO, it's not really worth it (unless you simply have too much money to spend in a single lifetime) even after converting to auto-LPG to save on fuel costs. Reason is, although LGP is more than 40% cheaper than gasoline, it won't offset the actual fuel consumption of this beast of a car.

Something smaller might be a better option like a Nissan X-Trail or the Toyota Camry, both of which are relatively simple to convert to auto-LPG and comfortable on long trips.

[boneDR]

Sir GH, I have a 1993 Corolla Gli and I plan to install the closed loop w/ EFI emulator. Aside from DENSO, are there other companies who install this type of system?

[ghosthunter]

Sir GH, I have a 1993 Corolla Gli and I plan to install the closed loop w/ EFI emulator. Aside from DENSO, are there other companies who install this type of system?

Partial list of auto-LPG installers in Metro Manila:
http://tsikot.yehey.com/forums/showthread.php?t=50159

Aside from EROOM/DENSO, I haven't heard of anyone else doing such a system. But Mike of GREENFUEL did once mention to me that he could have the same results with a few mods on his existing open-loop kits. I have no confirmation if he was able to setup one yet though.

You might want to note that open-loop lpg kits can offer comparable performance as close loop kits if they are tuned well. Also due to the overall simplicity of the install for open loop kits, it can be done in a day (four to eight hours). Closed loop kits require some degree of interfacing with the engine's stock ECU which can mean some delays to completion if the installer is unfamiliar with the car's ECU wiring layout.

[Redman7]

Sir GH, I have a 1993 Corolla Gli and I plan to install the closed loop w/ EFI emulator. Aside from DENSO, are there other companies who install this type of system?

Ser follow this link : http://tsikot.yehey.com/forums/showthread.php?t=50159

Goodluck!

[bigMIKE]

Thanks Ghosthunter.

Just a piece of advice who are having some reservations on LPG conversion. If you extra money to do something about the rise in fuel cost, go with the conversion. Its either you we spend in advance for the LPG or just let the would be savings you'll get in the long run. Greenfuel has a great price not to mention their very accomodating team of people from top to bottom.

Sacrifice a little time and some bucks, the rest will come in big big savings.

thanks for the endorsement. Anyway its a weekend again another round of gasoline price increase. The sooner you convert the sooner you can save. To all lpg equipped motorists, aren't you glad you took the plunge early on....