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  1. Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Posts
    2,113
    #31
    I haven't driven other SUV except my fortuner 2.7VVTi, my personal observation is its a/t tranny is smooth almost as smooth as my former honda city IDSI, 7 speed CVT, I don't feel much its shift shock so i often don't know on what gear am i engaged. Anyway my xtrail a/t tranny is smooth also maybe because they are all gas fed, i guess the engine type also contributes with the smoothness.

    These are all based on my personal experience

  2. Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Posts
    222
    #32
    With regards to the current/existing technology and considering the future (if this thread remain open for the years to come),


    Motero Sport win


    By the way here is a sneak preview of future transmission with a goal of improving fuel consumption/reducing emission.
    hybrid_DDP/DDM
    Better look at them now for they might be soon removed from the site.

    And look who is the owner:
    MCAT

  3. Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Posts
    22,710
    #33
    Quote Originally Posted by arsen View Post
    Are you referring to the goal of the technology or your wish/expectations?
    Do you know were to find the goal of the technology? Where it is written?

    I have to say NO to your statement for the safety of others expecting that capability to adapt with such dangerous but avoidable situation. Kasi unang una pa lang eh bakit ka naman kasi mag overtake ng alanganin?
    An overtake that is not "alanganin" can become so if the transmission does not behave in a manner that the driver expects it to, resulting in uneven power delivery and unpredictable vehicle behavior or handling.

    Quote Originally Posted by arsen View Post
    Kaya po siguro kayo nag expect ng ganito kasi may alam kayo na “ADAPTIVE” fuzzy logic since adaptive, it must suit with the driver. Kung walang kumontra sa inyo doon sa sinabi nyo na adaptive fuzzy logic akalain nyo naman tama.
    Didn't I just say that? Are you arguing that I didn't say it should suit the driver?

    All modern electronically controlled automatics use fuzzy logic. It's the only way to determine proper shift points, which can vary based on load, speed, engine speed and temperature.

    Quote Originally Posted by arsen View Post
    Di po nagvavary ang program parameters to suit with ALL styles and mental state ng driver. kaya wala pong ADAPTIVE fuzzy logic. Mga parameters po ay pre-set at predetermined. Siguro tatawa kayo pagsinabi ko na actually, maraming driver ang meron sa computer. At pipili ang computer kung alin doon ang optimum para sa kasalukuyang nagmamaneho. Ang mga driver po na meron ang computer ay yaong may mga tendencies ng mga good/behave drivers and ibang driver naman ng computer ay mga nagmamaneho ng by the book.

    Ang situation po sa example ninyo ay tanging mata lang ang makakapagdetermine (or mga technology kagaya ng sa Google Earth). Wala pa pong mass produced car na may MATA at alam ang daan na kanyang tatahakin para malaman kung may kasalubong or may sharp curve sa unahan.
    Which is why it behooves the manufacturers to make such systems behave in a consistent manner, which allows drivers to make the adjustments themselves, as necessary.

    Quote Originally Posted by arsen View Post
    Going forward po, meron na naimbento which can suit with situations like sa example ninyo. Yan po ang mga tiptronic, +/-, paddle shifters para ma manually override ng driver ang system lalo na kapag kailangang kailangan nya magshift. Separate technology po yan covered by intellectual property rights kaya di lahat malayang makagamit.
    Almost all manufacturers have their own "manumatic" system. The only "IPR" involved is in the trade names used to describe thenm.

    Quote Originally Posted by arsen View Post
    “Frequent and unnecessary shifting” sa Tagalog, madalas at di kinakailangan pagkambyo. Example: Sa conventional automatic transmission ay yung mga nasa third gear na tapos pag ni release ng driver ang accelerator pedal from depression dahil may kurbada pero nakuha pang mag-up-shift ng transmission from 3-4 then pag na lampasan na ang curve pag-apak sa accelerator magdodownshift nman from 4-3 then upshift ulet from 3-4. Kakainis di ba?
    Di ba unnecessary po yan? papasok na sa curve nag-upshift pa, lumampas na sa curve nag downshift pa tapos up-shift na naman ulet. Kung madalas mangyari yan di ba frequent po yan sa English? Kung minsan naman mangyari yan eh di hinde frequent.

    Whereas your example discuss about fast/speedy shifting, mabilis magkambyo. Mabuti at alam na alam nyo na ang DCTs.
    Madagdag ko lang na ang DCT ay another technology, a separate invention. Integrated lang po yan sa adaptive transmission technology kagaya ng ginawa sa tiptronic. Dinagdag lang po yan para ma meet ang ibang requirement/expectations ng car owner. Hindi po lahat ng manufacturer makakagamit nyan ng walang license dahil sa intellectual property rights.
    Any manufacturer can use automated-clutches. They've been around for nearly a century, already.

    Quote Originally Posted by arsen View Post
    The suicidal is the lone car among the dozens of cars that you have driven.
    Actually... the one transmission I'd consider suicidal is one of those that not only did not adapt properly, but kept hunting for gears all the time...

    Quote Originally Posted by arsen View Post
    I posted here the goal and some basic concept of the technology hoping that someone expecting something (either for pleasure or safety) will realize that such expectations is not covered by that particular technology.
    But the good thing is, there are additional/new technologies that once integrated to the existing one can meet those expectations.
    What I am doing is, I am sharing these things I learned about the technology. It’s not from marketing literature. It’s from a certified true, containing unique ideas and they are legally enforced documents.
    Legally binding? So notarized by a CPA and reviewed and approved by a reviewed scientific journal?

    Ang pagbalik ng comeback...

  4. Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Posts
    222
    #34
    Quote Originally Posted by niky View Post
    An overtake that is not "alanganin" can become so if the transmission does not behave in a manner that the driver expects it to, resulting in uneven power delivery and unpredictable vehicle behavior or handling.

    Didn't I just say that? Are you arguing that I didn't say it should suit the driver?

    All modern electronically controlled automatics use fuzzy logic. It's the only way to determine proper shift points, which can vary based on load, speed, engine speed and temperature.

    Which is why it behooves the manufacturers to make such systems behave in a consistent manner, which allows drivers to make the adjustments themselves, as necessary.

    Almost all manufacturers have their own "manumatic" system. The only "IPR" involved is in the trade names used to describe thenm.

    Any manufacturer can use automated-clutches. They've been around for nearly a century, already.

    Actually... the one transmission I'd consider suicidal is one of those that not only did not adapt properly, but kept hunting for gears all the time...

    Legally binding? So notarized by a CPA and reviewed and approved by a reviewed scientific journal?
    Yan lang po ba ang alam nyo? Kung sa bagay di naman sa Pilipinas galing ang technology.

    Familiar po ba kayo sa patent na tinatawag?

    Kaya po iba-iba ang performance ng mga automatic transmissions dahil sa patent.

    Gusto nyo po ba pag-usapan natin ang patent and how it works?

    Kung alam niyo lang po ang patent na tinatawag kayo na mismo makakasagot dito sa latest post nyo.

  5. Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Posts
    22,710
    #35
    Quote Originally Posted by arsen View Post
    Kaya po iba-iba ang performance ng mga automatic transmissions dahil sa patent.


    :hysterical:

    Ang pagbalik ng comeback...

  6. Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Posts
    29,320
    #36
    Quote Originally Posted by arsen View Post
    Yan lang po ba ang alam nyo? Kung sa bagay di naman sa Pilipinas galing ang technology.

    Familiar po ba kayo sa patent na tinatawag?

    Kaya po iba-iba ang performance ng mga automatic transmissions dahil sa patent.

    Gusto nyo po ba pag-usapan natin ang patent and how it works?

    Kung alam niyo lang po ang patent na tinatawag kayo na mismo makakasagot dito sa latest post nyo.
    MODERATOR'S Note:

    Er... before I facepalm myself over this thread, I suggest everyone to get back to topic.



  7. Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Posts
    28
    #37
    nakaka-speechless to'ng thread na ito

  8. Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Posts
    5,465
    #38
    eto lang yun eh.. claimed technology can be overwhelming pero have you driven all SUVs compared to say that sir arsen? How a transmission theoretically should perform may differ in how it actually performs.

    For sure, the MS tranny maybe loaded with technology but is it really impressive to use? Nah, not for me. I'd rather take the rather regular for you, Fortuner transmission.

  9. Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Posts
    1,790
    #39
    Quote Originally Posted by RBT View Post
    nakaka-speechless to'ng thread na ito
    Yes, but I learned a lot.

  10. Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Posts
    22,710
    #40
    What's funny is that while many manufacturers hold patents on specific transmission systems, many of the important ones are held by transmission specialists like Getrag, Jatco and Borg-Warner to whom manufacturers like Mitsubishi (et al) farm out production.

    And even manufacturers share technology... Toyota licenses out hybrid technology and their proprietary planetary-gear transmission to other makers (though the Chevrolet Volt has its own planetary-gear system) and Hyundai builds engine systems for Mitsubishi.

    There are a million ways to skin a fish... and just because one chef holds a "patent" on how to skin a fish one way, doesn't mean nobody else has the right to skin it in a similar (but not identical) manner.

    -

    Translated:

    There's no practical difference in use between most AT systems like in the Montero and Fortuner except that resulting from different algorithms and gear ratios. But while I don't think the Montero's AT is all that great, it certainly is the best truck in its class at the moment. Best chassis, best ride comfort, best interior, etcetera.

    Ang pagbalik ng comeback...

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Which has the best A/T: Montero Sport, Fortuner, Everest or Alterra?