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  1. Join Date
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    #91
    Quote Originally Posted by V8_killer View Post
    oh you got some jokes huh very funny ha ha ha hope that gives you a smile well deal sounds kinda good but its not just the money coz it is not that much u konw this ricers will burn some gas when we go there and i dont think 150 is enought and the farthest im goin is only lemore to tell you the truth i wanted to go bad but you say it is gonna be on wednesday cannot do that homei i work whole week exept for saturday and sunday and drivin an 8 hour just to go up there and race then comeback the next day thats kinda hard to do homeboy if its like saturday me and my homies might come u know check what you guys got and show u guys what we are all about in socal peace out
    there are close to ten people in my group. if you miss work, i'm sure the people in my group have no problem chipping in for the paycheck you are going to miss from taking three days off from your work. i will even let you crash in my house. food is on us. just come by and show us what your evo can do to our american muscle.

  2. Join Date
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    #92
    deng....so THAT's why i can't afford an Evo. it's because i can't stop hatin' :hysterical:

  3. Join Date
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    #93
    I'm a bit late. But here's my 2 cents. That same question about American muscle vs Japanese ingenuity had been asked way back in the 80's. No one was able to give a perfect answer. It was asked again in the 90's and again, no one was able to give a perfect answer. I'd imagine by now in this decade that there still wouldn't be a perfect answer.

    The time when I asked the same question was back in 1990 when I just bought a brand new Plymouth Laser RS Turbo which preceded the Evo by a good many years and followed the trend set by the Mitsu Starion/Dodge Conquest. Here's what I found out:

    Japanese cars can be tuned for more power and better handling, but so can American muscle cars. That's something many kids (and myself back then) failed to remember. When the cars are all tuned out, it boils back down to driver skill and knowing the car's limits.

    My 2 cents

  4. Join Date
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    #94
    Quote Originally Posted by V8_killer View Post
    well have you ever heard about mail in reflash well if you dont well its so easy take your ecu off put it on the box with a paper and put all the mods in a piece of paper and mail it to ams and they will do it for you hope that i gave you some knowledge today *n2knee

    You're a little bit confusing ,Do you reflash your ecu or you have a Fcon EMS.

    21 psi of boost luchin rpm 5000 dont want to burn my stock clutch still savin up for a new set of exceddy
    ON stock internals and reflash ecu?

  5. Join Date
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    #95

  6. Join Date
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    #96
    Quote Originally Posted by mazdamazda View Post
    sorry! ako ang nahilo dun. :puyat:

    ===

    back to the 300C versus E39 M5 comparo.

    300C Hemi
    - base price of around $34K
    - 5.7L V8 w/ MDS, 340hp * 5000rpm 525Nm * 4000rpm torque
    - EPA mpg 17 city / 25 hway

    E39 M5
    - base price of around $70K (a few years ago)
    - 5.0L 32v V8, 400hp * 6600rpm 500Nm torque * 3800rpm
    - EPA mpg 13 city / 21 hway

    so... which is a more "efficient" vehicle as a daily drive?
    I've read/ heard a lot of 300C american owners trading there cars for a Lexus or an Avalon. Miata wins over Solstice on every review I've read (not game based but professional driver reviews), Civic is the benchmark on the compacts, BMW 3 on the mid-sizers, ferrari/porsche on the luxury sports, ( and these I've read on many reviews while wating in Midas or Discount tire or just reading in Kroger's/Wal-Mart's/Barne's and Nobles mag section) where the hell are the Americans??? Trucks probably? O, there is the Tundra..Ford just closed a factory on the area where Toyota is building one. Ford stopped producing the Taurus. Indy is dominated by Honda. Run on US roads, and I've been in alot. With the exception of Michigan, look around and you will see more Jap/euro cars than there are Americans'.

    And nope, they (Americans) are not capable of building cars as good as the Japs/Euros, why else did Ford hire an Englishman to head its design team? Why did it have to buy Mazda so that it can share there platform?

    And cmon, US manufacturer's don't see the need to make small, economy engine? Whoever said that must be misinformed, why the hell are civics ruling the US roads man? Prius is the most successful Hybrid car! GM not retiring there push rods? The fact is they are stubborn, insisting that there's is the best when on the contrary they are being stepped-on over. Yeah it's cheaper? Why is there more older Dahons and Toyota's than there are newer GM's on the US road. Brace yourselves, the Koreans are coming Uncle Sam!
    Get a Consumer Guide, no freakin American car dominated any category.

    Don't get me wrong, I dream of having the Shelby's, Z06, or the big-block Camaros and these are great cars (just as I lust for American women)...but why are more Americans buying imports than domestics? Dream of having a Skyline or NSX, or a true blue SiR. Cursing the Japs for not bringing them here? Drool over Evo's. Lots of this guys doesn't just base there preferences on numbers they read over the net, they have actually owned one swapped there stangs for more modern and more powerful cars (except probably for those not rich enough to do so). Guess they have made their verdict.

    Performance is not just about torque, its handling, reliability, etc. US has there mind soley on the first. That's why they are losing.

    Cars are like women, different races, different faces..some got big booties, some have freckles, some have silken skins, you just have to love them. So tambay na ulit ko run sa chicks na thread, hehe.

  7. Join Date
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    #97
    Quote Originally Posted by n2knee View Post
    there are close to ten people in my group. if you miss work, i'm sure the people in my group have no problem chipping in for the paycheck you are going to miss from taking three days off from your work. i will even let you crash in my house. food is on us. just come by and show us what your evo can do to our american muscle.
    that's a very generous offer na from n2knee. i wonder why v8killer won't take it?

  8. Join Date
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    #98
    Quote Originally Posted by SNAKE V6 View Post
    I've read/ heard a lot of 300C american owners trading there cars for a Lexus or an Avalon. Miata wins over Solstice on every review I've read (not game based but professional driver reviews), Civic is the benchmark on the compacts, BMW 3 on the mid-sizers, ferrari/porsche on the luxury sports, ( and these I've read on many reviews while wating in Midas or Discount tire or just reading in Kroger's/Wal-Mart's/Barne's and Nobles mag section) where the hell are the Americans??? Trucks probably? O, there is the Tundra..Ford just closed a factory on the area where Toyota is building one. Ford stopped producing the Taurus. Indy is dominated by Honda. Run on US roads, and I've been in alot. With the exception of Michigan, look around and you will see more Jap/euro cars than there are Americans'.

    And nope, they (Americans) are not capable of building cars as good as the Japs/Euros, why else did Ford hire an Englishman to head its design team? Why did it have to buy Mazda so that it can share there platform?

    And cmon, US manufacturer's don't see the need to make small, economy engine? Whoever said that must be misinformed, why the hell are civics ruling the US roads man? Prius is the most successful Hybrid car! GM not retiring there push rods? The fact is they are stubborn, insisting that there's is the best when on the contrary they are being stepped-on over. Yeah it's cheaper? Why is there more older Dahons and Toyota's than there are newer GM's on the US road. Brace yourselves, the Koreans are coming Uncle Sam!
    Get a Consumer Guide, no freakin American car dominated any category.

    Don't get me wrong, I dream of having the Shelby's, Z06, or the big-block Camaros and these are great cars (just as I lust for American women)...but why are more Americans buying imports than domestics? Dream of having a Skyline or NSX, or a true blue SiR. Cursing the Japs for not bringing them here? Drool over Evo's. Lots of this guys doesn't just base there preferences on numbers they read over the net, they have actually owned one swapped there stangs for more modern and more powerful cars (except probably for those not rich enough to do so). Guess they have made their verdict.

    Performance is not just about torque, its handling, reliability, etc. US has there mind soley on the first. That's why they are losing.

    Cars are like women, different races, different faces..some got big booties, some have freckles, some have silken skins, you just have to love them. So tambay na ulit ko run sa chicks na thread, hehe.
    i think you make some good points. the automotive media does have a clear preference for non-US marques, and there's no arguing the sales numbers of the cars you mention.

    i just have to disagree on 2 points:

    1. the Japanese marques are not completely running away with the market like you're implying. maybe if you live in California, but nationwide it's much closer. a simple google search revealed these 2006 YTD figures by Automotive News:

    1. Ford F-Series 616,785
    2. Chevrolet Silverado 486,901
    3. Toyota Camry 340,905
    4. Honda Accord 278,422
    5. Dodge Ram 275,225
    6. Honda Civic 251,543
    7. Chevrolet Impala 219,167
    8. Toyota Corolla 216,934
    9. Chevrolet Cobalt 178,558
    10. Nissan Altima 174,661

    oh, and in case anyone trots out the old argument that these are all fleet sales or rental companies....30% of GM's total sales were to fleets. if you apply that percentage to the Cobalt, Impala and Silverado to show retail sales only, the Cobalt drops off the list, but the Impala still stays on the list, and the Silverado goes down to tie the Camry for second. still a lot of vehicles. and it's certainly not the Civic that's "ruling the roads"...the F-series sells more than the Civic and Accord COMBINED.


    2. when you say "the Americans are not capable of building cars as good", how do you define "as good"? reliability, probably. media accolades, certainly. but performance? handling? value for money? if you think they can't compete on those factors you're sorely mistaken.

    most of the people who know me will say that i'm biased towards euro cars first, and japanese cars second. but i won't automatically discount any car just because it's made in the US.

  9. Join Date
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    #99
    Quote Originally Posted by SNAKE V6 View Post
    I've read/ heard a lot of 300C american owners trading there cars for a Lexus or an Avalon.
    i would probably get a Lexus GS series before the 300C, but i'd take the 300C before any Lexus ES/Toyota Avalon. RWD over FWD. you get more bang for your buck. now if reliability were the only deciding factor, i'd probably pick the Lexus/Toyota over the Chrysler. reliability is elusive at Chrysler Corp.

    Quote Originally Posted by SNAKE V6 View Post
    Civic is the benchmark on the compacts
    in which market? US? Europe? Asia? and when you say civic is the benchmark, is it the benchmark in quality, sales or performance?

    Quote Originally Posted by SNAKE V6 View Post
    BMW 3 on the mid-sizers
    the BMW 3-series is considered compact/small size entry level luxury sport sedan. not mid-size. it competes with the Lexus IS series, Volvo S60, and M-B C class. i cannot think of any american car that competes in this segment. so if you are comparing a $20,000 american car to a BMW 3-series then of course the BWM wins hands down.

    Quote Originally Posted by SNAKE V6 View Post
    ferrari/porsche on the luxury sports
    again, maybe these two are the leaders in sales, but these are not the leaders in quality and performance.

    Quote Originally Posted by SNAKE V6 View Post
    and these I've read on many reviews while wating in Midas or Discount tire or just reading in Kroger's/Wal-Mart's/Barne's and Nobles mag section) where the hell are the Americans???
    it's best to cite your sources instead of telling as that you've heard through the grapevine, so it gives more credibility to your claim. we'd also like to see what factors these so-called car expert evaluators used in assessing and forming their conclusions.

    Quote Originally Posted by SNAKE V6 View Post
    Trucks probably? O, there is the Tundra.
    The Ford F series has outsold the Tundra. and as a matter of fact, the F series has been number one in sales ten years in a row. as far as performance, the CURRENT engine choices on both brands show that the F series is more powerful than the Tundra (more hp/torque and greater towing capacity).

    Quote Originally Posted by SNAKE V6 View Post
    Ford just closed a factory on the area where Toyota is building one.
    there are many factors as to why a factory is shut down. you can't just conclude that Ford conceded just because Toyota is currently building a factory nearby its existing plant. name that plant and i'll find out for you why it was closed.


    Quote Originally Posted by SNAKE V6 View Post
    Ford stopped producing the Taurus
    i remember the days when it was once the best selling mid-sized car, but Ford rested on their laurels. one of the contributing factors of its demise is the lack of design updates from its cash-strapped company while Honda and Toyota continuously poured in money in r&d/marketing to the Accord and Camry respectively. another negative publicity the Taurus suffered was the blowing headgaskets from its 3.8L motors, which was manufactured by YAMAHA (a japanese company). the Ford 500, Ford Freestyle, and the Ford Fusion will be replacing the Taurus.

    Quote Originally Posted by SNAKE V6 View Post
    Indy is dominated by Honda.
    very interesting information you have there concerning the IRL. do you know why Honda is dominating the race? of the 40 cars tell us how many of them use Honda.

    Quote Originally Posted by SNAKE V6 View Post
    Run on US roads, and I've been in alot.
    hmmm....are you telling us that you are unbeaten in ALL street races against american cars? tell us what kind of car you drive, the mods you have, and the cars you've raced and the mods of the cars you've raced. that's interesting. where are you from? i am in the bay area, cali.

    Quote Originally Posted by SNAKE V6 View Post
    With the exception of Michigan, look around and you will see more Jap/euro cars than there are Americans
    i don't see the relevance of this statement to the subject. and i don't think you've been around the country to form such conclusion.

    Quote Originally Posted by SNAKE V6 View Post
    And nope, they (Americans) are not capable of building cars as good as the Japs/Euros
    this the dumbest statement i've heard from you

    Quote Originally Posted by SNAKE V6 View Post
    why else did Ford hire an Englishman to head its design team?
    because he was the most qualified candidate at that time the position was available maybe?

    Quote Originally Posted by SNAKE V6 View Post
    Why did it have to buy Mazda so that it can share there platform?
    business wise, it is more financially viable for companies to partner with other companies that already had spent the r&d as opposed to doing their own r&d. r&d is very costly. global companies do this all the time. it's not just ford.

    Quote Originally Posted by SNAKE V6 View Post
    And cmon, US manufacturer's don't see the need to make small, economy engine?
    they are building and producing them.

    Quote Originally Posted by SNAKE V6 View Post
    why the hell are civics ruling the US roads man?
    we would like to see the demographics of the owners/buyers/potential buyers of this car, so we can better assess the reason why there are so many of them on the us roads. i'd take the styling/design compared to its competitors may be one of the reasons. the perceived reliability is also another. let me emphasize the word "perceived" as the civic is trully not the most reliable compact car in the market right now.

    Quote Originally Posted by SNAKE V6 View Post
    Prius is the most successful Hybrid car!
    as well as most dangerous too!

    Quote Originally Posted by SNAKE V6 View Post
    GM not retiring there push rods? The fact is they are stubborn, insisting that there's is the best when on the contrary they are being stepped-on over.
    where do you get these information from? again. let me reitirate to you. GM will be keeping the pushrod for a long time for as long as the vette is around. period! it's proven and it best fits the car's balance as opposed to an OHC design. it is also more compact than an OHC and it's cheaper to build?


    Quote Originally Posted by SNAKE V6 View Post
    Yeah it's cheaper? Why is there more older Dahons and Toyota's than there are newer GM's on the US road.
    :lol: where do you live? do you ever go outside the 1-mile radius of your house?

    Quote Originally Posted by SNAKE V6 View Post
    Brace yourselves, the Koreans are coming Uncle Sam!
    so are the Chinese. and what's your point?

    Quote Originally Posted by SNAKE V6 View Post
    Get a Consumer Guide, no freakin American car dominated any category.
    reliability, there is not a single american car on the TOP spot. they are found in the middle of the list, which is a significant improvement considering a lot of american consumers had complained too much about the reliability of american cars. one thing i almost omitted to mention regarding the reliability tests from various magazines. half of the comlplains are pertaining to minor issues such as cup holders LOL

    Quote Originally Posted by SNAKE V6 View Post
    Don't get me wrong, I dream of having the Shelby's, Z06, or the big-block Camaros and these are great cars (just as I lust for American women)...but why are more Americans buying imports than domestics?
    unless you have a data that shows the sales numbers each year during the last ten years, i will take your comment with a grain of salt. it's true though that the US auto makers are losing their market shares to the Japs.

    Quote Originally Posted by SNAKE V6 View Post
    Dream of having a Skyline or NSX, or a true blue SiR. Cursing the Japs for not bringing them here? Drool over Evo's. Lots of this guys doesn't just base there preferences on numbers they read over the net, they have actually owned one swapped there stangs for more modern and more powerful cars (except probably for those not rich enough to do so). Guess they have made their verdict.
    :lol: its amusing to keep reading your comments that it seems like you are slowly shooting your foot. let me be very candid to you. guys who drive an SVT Cobra, a Vette, or a Saleen Mustang will not be drooling all over a Mitsubishi EVO. you have it reversed! i can probably agree with you on one thing though. if i owned a piece of sh!t V6 Mustang, i would prabably trade that with an NSX though.

    Quote Originally Posted by SNAKE V6 View Post
    Performance is not just about torque, its handling, reliability, etc. US has there mind soley on the first. That's why they are losing.
    you crack me up every time i go on about reading your post. are you telling me the american cars cannot handle? :lol: you sound like a typical japanese car fanboy i've dusted on the street.

    Quote Originally Posted by SNAKE V6 View Post
    Cars are like women, different races, different faces..some got big booties, some have freckles, some have silken skins, you just have to love them. So tambay na ulit ko run sa chicks na thread, hehe.
    ummmm...NO! cars are not like women. cars are material possessions, women are not.
    Last edited by n2knee; November 14th, 2006 at 01:56 PM.

  10. Join Date
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    #100
    1. Read the previous posts, I was not the one who said the US carmakers don't need to produce econo-engines, in fact, I contradicted that, they're producing econo-engines, shut-off vlave sytems, MDS, etc. I know that. Didn't you see the "?" at the end of the statement? I was quoting an earlier remark.

    2. I've gone out of my house, been to DC, MD, NJ, NY, MS, LA, VA, MI, FL, NC, SC, AL, TN, IL, PA never been to the west coast though. I don't travel to RACE, and I rarely travel by plane coz I stay ina state for at least a month, it's part of my job as an Engineering consultant. And I've driven to these places all the way from ATL. So when I say on the road, I mean it per se. If I've been racing and never beaten, I would be in Nascar or Indy right now and you would've probably heard of a Pinoy in race car mainstream and it would've made you proud. But I am not, and never in my comment did I mentioned I raced or modded my car for that purpose.

    3. Sources: various mags, reviews, etc. Where they actually drive the vehicle? Put some sensors, time em, waht have you. Do I have to say every publication I read? Go out and read some. They can be found in the stores I mentioned and more. You know what they are. I did say I read them right? not heard em, except for the 300C which you didn't quote on your comment pertaining to this.

    4. Detroit is in Michigan, I don't know why you can't see the relevance. Detroit is home to US marques. Make the connection.

    5. Yes, the F series is still the no.1 truck. I didn't say it wasn't. Just said that Tundra is catching up, so are the ying yangs. Ridgeline is the JD powers truck, alhtough saturn had some of that too on a diff category. But still more F's can be seen on the roads.

    6. Civic as the benchmark: I've read it in the publicationS.

    7. # of Hondas in the Indy: prescisely my point.

    8. Swapping stangs: baseline stangs, didn't say vette owners swapped for a jap.

    9. Factory closing up: Reasons, hmmmmm...poor sales? poor sales? what else...Why would a factory close up when a factory in the same industry is opening? Makes no sense unless you don't need that facility anymore because its not producing.

    I am not shooting myself on the foot, you're the one who seems to be doing that by implying my points. I didn't say it was all correct but it seem to me that your comments just strengthens alot of my points.

    10. Cars to me are not merely possessions. They're a part of my family. If you treat em well, they treat you well also. To me a car is an intimate thing, it talks back to you depending on how you treat it. That's why we name em right? I was referring to the physical aspect of cars and women (differences in marque, race), so don't take it like its an insult to women.

    11. Englishmen more qualified than Americans? You just proved the point.

    12. Precisely, Ford just wants to buy em along with there technology. Why? Because of the technology.

    Ask yourself this question: Why are Americans, who are one of the most patriotic people you'll ever meet buy more import cars than domestic?

    I rest my case.

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American muscle vs japanese ingenuity